Interview with Sue Castaldo

Interview with Sue Castaldo

Castaldo, Sue ; Gashurov, Irene

2019-02-28

In Copyright

Sue Castaldo.mp3

2019-02-28

Oral Histories from 60's Binghamton Alumni

49:24 minutes

Alumni Interviews
Interview with: Sue Castaldo
Interviewed by: Irene Gashurov
Transcriber: Oral History Lab
Date of interview: 28 February 2019
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(Start of Interview)

IG: 00:00
So, please Sue. I would like you to introduce yourself, let us know where we are sitting, and what we are going to do.

SC: 00:11
Okay, my name is Sue Costello. We are in Phoenix, Arizona. Where are we? So, um, ASU [Arizona State University] office, and we are going to be talking about my experiences at Harpur College in the (19)60s.

IG: 00:24
Very good. Okay, so Sue. We can begin. And what year did you graduate?

SC: 00:30
I graduated in (19)63.

IG: 00:31
Where are you from?

SC: 00:35
I am from Mechanicville, New York.

IG: 00:37
Oh, and where is that exactly?

SC: 00:40
It is between Albany and Saratoga, right on the Hudson, a little, tiny town.

IG: 00:47
So, you know, where did your- just tell me a little bit about your background, who your parents were, what they did.

SC: 00:58
My dad was a career army. So, we moved around a little bit. When I was a child, we lived in Panama for a while. Mom was a stay-at-home mom until they got, they got divorced when I was a when I was a freshman at Harpur, and she then worked in a local department store. They are both, they are both gone now.

IG: 01:28
Are they from Mechanicville themselves?

SC: 01:31
They were from Mechanicville. They were both of their parents. My grandparents came here as immigrants from Italy. Yeah, my small town is mostly Italian, mostly from the same area.

IG: 01:43
How interesting. Where in Italy were they from? Do you know?

SC: 01:49
Around the Naples area.

IG: 01:52
Have you been watching the Elena Ferranti series on HBO?

SC: 02:00
No.

IG: 02:00
My Brilliant Friend, it is set in Naples.

SC: 02:06
Oh.

IG: 02:06
After the war.

SC: 02:07
We are planning to go to Italy in September, so that would be nice.

IG: 02:13
And so, you grew up there, and you lived in Panama for a while. How long were you in Panama?

SC: 02:21
A couple of years, I was like, eight years old.

IG: 02:23
Oh, I see. Where did you go to high school?

SC: 02:28
In Mechanicville.

IG: 02:29
Yeah, and-

SC: 02:30
Yeah.

IG: 02:30
A public school or?

SC: 02:31
Yes-yes. I laugh at today's schools of 1000s. My graduating class had 140 students in it.

IG: 02:42
So, do you think that you got a better education as a result?

SC: 02:46
I feel like I got a good education. I had good teachers. I should have done better at Harpur, but I was experiencing so many things that I had never experienced before, coming from that little town.

IG: 03:02
Well, we would like to talk about that.

SC: 03:05
We had, like, I swear, two or three Jewish families in town, one black family. That was it. The rest of us were Italians. [laughs] And when I went to college, it was like, Oh my gosh. I did not even know what a bagel was, and I had so many Jewish friends, it was a brand-new experience for me. There were not- I remember two, one black person, one person from India, one person from Barbados, and they were all friends of mine, but that is it. Harpur was like, what 400, 600 students when I, when I started,

IG: 03:52
Tell me a little bit about I am very interested in your Italian community in Mechanicsville.

SC: 03:58
No mechanics. There was only one mechanic; there is no s [laughs].

IG: 04:00
Mechanic.

SC: 04:01
Mechanicville. [laughs]

IG: 04:04
Mechanicville. So, did you grow up hearing Italian spoken?

SC: 04:11
Yes, yeah, yes, in grandparents’ homes, my mom did not speak Italian, but she spoke Italian to her-her parents. But we did not speak it at home, so I understood more than I spoke.

IG: 04:27
But that is wonderful.

SC: 04:29
It was wonderful.

IG: 04:30
Yeah, so you grew up in two cultures.

SC: 04:33
Yes-yes.

IG: 04:36
Did you have an interest in learning more about your familial culture?

SC: 04:46
No, because I felt like I knew quite a bit.

IG: 04:50
Yes.

SC: 04:52
Yeah, they were, I mean, they came over on the boat. [laughs]

IG: 04:58
And so, you knew about the cuisine-

SC: 05:01
Oh yes.

IG: 05:01
-a little about the language, their histories-

SC: 05:09
Not so much their histories. No, I have photos and, you know, and names, and but not so much about their histories. In my head, they came from that little, little smaller towns than where we were in Italy, you know, like close together. And I think even my great grandparents were from that those same little towns.

IG: 05:40
Was education valued in your family?

SC: 05:45
Not particularly, not in my extended family, yes, especially my dad's side. My mom only had one brother. My dad had six, and a couple of them were school teachers. One of them in particular pushed a lot, but yeah, but just extended family more than you know.

IG: 06:12
So, what did they tell you about your schooling? Do they say do well, go to college.

SC: 06:18
Oh yeah, oh yeah. Definitely pushed for college. And in my generation, I was the first one to go to college in my generation, and one of my brothers went to junior college. And my niece, who is 10 years younger than I, she went to college and she-she retired as a guidance counselor. So, there was some, but in my generation.

IG: 06:56
So, what was your thinking about college as you were going to high school? Did you have a clear idea that this is what you would like to do, and what would you like to do?

SC: 07:08
I really did not have an idea of what I would like to do.

IG: 07:11
Right.

SC: 07:13
I knew I wanted a liberal arts education. And I looked at Harpur because it had such a good reputation, it was close enough to home, but far enough away that I did not have to live at home. I wanted that experience.

IG: 07:30
And is this the reason that you chose Harpur rather than Albany or Buffalo?

SC: 07:37
You know, I cannot even remember if I applied to Albany. If I went to Albany, I would probably have to live at home, so that-that came into. Buffalo, forget it, no snow. I mean, there is enough snow in Binghamton. [laughs] But I did not know too much about this school, and when I got there, I was, "Oh, my God, what an experience that was."

IG: 08:04
So, what were your first impressions?

SC: 08:06
Mud-mud and boardwalks. There were only four dormitories, a student union. Maybe the library was there. Then, no classrooms, no, we took buses to Endicott. Had classes in old army barracks. We wore gloves to take tests. I mean, cold came through the windows and the walls. It was fun, but the first impression was definitely mud everywhere.

IG: 08:48
But you saw, you know, a wooded area, or-

SC: 08:52
It was gorgeous.

IG: 08:53
It was gorgeous.

SC: 08:54
It was beautiful. I mean, there were hills and trees all around the campus.

IG: 08:59
And you arrived in early autumn?

SC: 09:01
Yes.

IG: 09:02
And you had never seen the campus before?

SC: 09:04
No-no.

IG: 09:06
So, you met students, and what were they like?

SC: 09:14
They were just fantastic. I mean, they were all from New York City. They were worldly. They were people that I learned so much from. It was great.

IG: 09:27
Like, what kind of things did you learn from?

SC: 09:30
Well, I learned about the Jewish culture.

IG: 09:32
Yeah.

SC: 09:34
I learned about New York City.

IG: 09:39
For example, give us a few examples. What did you learn about the Jewish culture? What did you learn about New York City?

SC: 09:46
Well, the Jewish culture, I learned about their holidays, and I learned about their cuisine, and a little bit about their religion. I learned that they were; it might be the Mediterranean culture. They were so much like Italians in the fact that they were very family-oriented. Yeah, and they were smart.

IG: 10:18
And they were very smart.

SC: 10:19
They were very smart. And I looked around, and I said, "What am I doing here?"

IG: 10:23
Yeah, did you feel that you had to catch up, that you had to study more as a result, or?

SC: 10:32
I did. I did. But you know, I really did not do that. [laughs]

IG: 10:32
Well, tell us what you did.

SC: 10:38
I played a lot.

IG: 10:39
Yeah.

SC: 10:40
I was- somebody called me a few months ago that I had dated 50 years ago, and he said I was looking through the Harpur directory, I guess the newest one. And he said, "I found you when you were still alive." [laughs] He said, "I am glad you are still alive," but he remembered me as a Spitfire. I do not remember that, but I was- I had a small circle of friends, but I feel like I knew almost everybody, because I loved people, and I would go where there were people, and I just knew everybody.

IG: 11:24
So, how did you know everybody?

SC: 11:27
Through classes, and we would have what we called Hoot and Nannies sing-alongs. We would have movies in the lounge areas.

IG: 11:36
Of the Student Union?

SC: 11:39
And in the dorms and in the dorms. Yeah, I do not; you know, I did not participate in a lot of extracurricular activities, but I did belong to the Newman Club.

IG: 11:52
And what was that?

SC: 11:53
It was a Catholic organization, and I also was in the chorus for a while. So, I knew some people that way.

IG: 12:04
What, what kind of music would you sing?

SC: 12:06
You know, I cannot remember.

IG: 12:08
Was it classical? Was it folk? Was it-

SC: 12:11
Wasn't folk? No.

IG: 12:13
Popular, or?

SC: 12:14
It was a little bit of classical, a little bit of popular. You had to please everybody, I guess.

IG: 12:22
So, you socialized a lot, and you met a, not really a diverse, but a different kind of student body, right?

SC: 12:32
It was not very diverse. I mean, we did not have that many international students, but I made sure I got to know who they were.

IG: 12:45
Did you have a sense of how they felt about being there among so many different people, or did you feel a kindred spirit to them? Because you felt, at first, you must have felt-

SC: 12:58
I did not feel well. I may have, I may have. But the couple, I mean, they were so two of them in particular, were very outgoing, a fellow from India, he was a little more reserved, but the others just kind of fit in. They joined social clubs, and that is another thing I did not do.

IG: 13:21
Why didn't you do that?

SC: 13:22
To me, it was like a sorority. It was not sororities and fraternities, but-but it was, I just- it did not interest me. It just would not.

IG: 13:35
What should interest you? What-what were your classes about, you know-

SC: 13:39
Well, I started my major, ended up being sociology, with sociology, anthropology, and what I was going to do with that, I had no idea, but it sounded interesting to me.

IG: 13:54
Was it interesting?

SC: 13:55
It was, and I carried through all the way with it, all the way through, I did not change.

IG: 14:00
So, are there any classes or professors that stand out?

SC: 14:05
Oh yes-yes-yes, I wrote them down. You know what? I went through my yearbook.

IG: 14:13
Okay.

SC: 14:14
Because I did not think I would remember their names. I remembered their names, but I do remember who did what. Dr. Savage, in philosophy. I had never had a philosophy course.

IG: 14:26
So, what kind of things-

SC: 14:28
Absolutely-

IG: 14:29
-he opened your mind to?

SC: 14:31
Absolutely loved it. A lot of it was logic. And I had never been exposed to logic. And I have always been a very logical person. And he just explained it so well. And another one was Dr. Levin, and he taught a course in law, which fascinated me. I had taken an aptitude test once since, and they told me I should have been a tax lawyer. I guess that is where the logic comes in as well. And I really enjoyed his class. And there was an English class, Dr. Kasberg. I see these, and these were all freshman classes, and they were all taught in the old colonial building in Endicott. Have you been in that building?

IG: 15:22
No.

SC: 15:24
Have you seen that building? It is gorgeous.

IG: 15:26
No.

SC: 15:27
It was all run down then, though, and the classes were held upstairs, kind of in an attic, it was-

IG: 15:33
And the barracks were also in Endicott.

SC: 15:36
Yes-yes.

IG: 15:37
Do you remember Bill Vogley from that time?

SC: 15:41
I do remember that name.

IG: 15:42
Name, because he also describes barracks,

SC: 15:48
Cold.

IG: 15:49
Cold and snow covering into the barracks.

SC: 15:52
Wearing gloves.

IG: 15:53
Yeah.

SC: 15:53
But that is how you got to know everybody. You were crammed in these little buildings, and you- there was no place to go that was not, that was not a campus, you know, so you really did get to know everybody.

IG: 16:08
Was there a bus to take you back to your dorms?

SC: 16:11
Yes.

IG: 16:12
Did any of the students drive their own cars?

SC: 16:15
No, not until I do not remember anybody driving their own cars as a freshman, but as an upperclassman, I remember some, but I think most of them, the ones from New York City, did not know how to drive. They never had to drive. The ones who drove were the townies, and I knew so many of them. I do not know how I just people gravitate to me. They still do. I do not understand why, but I knew the very-very popular people, and I also knew the not-so-popular people, and we were all kind of friendly.

IG: 16:59
So, you socialized with your classmates in the dormitories, but where else in town?

SC: 17:13
We did we had a roller rink in Endicott that we could bus to you. I did that there was Pat Mitchell's ice cream, which I think is still there on Endicott, you are missing out. [laughs] And you know, typical college students, there was a bar in Endicott, I mean, in Binghamton, that was not very far from campus.

IG: 17:42
What was it called?

SC: 17:43
I cannot remember Sullivan's, and there is one, and there was one, and we used to play shuffleboard in that place, and we would go to a place in Johnson City. And I cannot remember the name of that one, but that is where we had speedies, and I think it is still there.

IG: 18:02
What was the drinking age then? Did they check licenses? No?

SC: 18:07
I do not ever remember them checking these. I do not, and I did have a circle offense that we went to church in Binghamton, and I even I started a group. There were people at church that wanted to do something, and I suggested, how about you adopt some college students and invite them to your homes? And-

IG: 18:07
How nice.

SC: 18:40
-like an adopt-a-grandmother kind of thing. And I had a group that went to this Mrs. Taylor's house on Pennsylvania Avenue almost every Sunday for fried chicken.

IG: 18:51
Oh, how nice.

SC: 18:52
It was so cool. I do not know how long it lasted. I cannot remember.

IG: 18:57
So, you discovered organizational abilities in yourself, right?

SC: 19:01
Yes.

IG: 19:03
Did you know that you have them before?

SC: 19:07
You know, I belonged to an awful lot of stuff in high school, but I do not think I myself organized anything. I was kind of a shy- I was a nerd. They know me in high school is, you know, a smart, a smarty. I was not that way in college. [laughs] I think if I got out with a C average, that was good.

IG: 19:35
So, you, you know, any-any noteworthy academics that you can think of, in addition to those three profs that you mentioned.

SC: 19:53
No, there were some I did not like at all. I had a calculus class that I went to one day and dropped out, mostly because I did not understand the subject right away. And the woman who taught the class was Indian, and I had a very hard time understanding her. So, I said, Okay, I do not need this class. So, I got out of that class.

IG: 20:27
Um, was- were most of the professors’ locals, or were they from- they-they were from other countries? Was-

SC: 20:40
They were not. I do not remember anyone from another country, except that-that math teacher, I think most of them were local. In fact, I worked for Professor Dodge. She was one of my sociology professors, and he had a couple of small children, and he needed help at you know, he and his wife needed help at home with the kids, and I remember doing some lighthouse work for them too. So, I did work, and that is another place I met a lot of people. I worked in the linen room. They would bring down their dirty linen, and I would give them clean linen. And I mean, and that was everybody in that dorm.

IG: 21:27
So that was a way that you would make pocket money.

SC: 21:30
Mm-hmm.

IG: 21:31
Were you a Regents scholar?

SC: 21:33
Yes.

IG: 21:35
Do you remember what the college cost you at all? Were you- was it paid for it entirely?

SC: 21:44
You know, I kind of remember $12 in credit hours. That sounds about right?

IG: 21:50
I do not know.

SC: 21:52
That is what I remember. I did not come from a lot of money. I must have had some scholarships. I won prizes in- at graduation from high school, and I know some of them were partial scholarships. I had a grandmother who used to give me money all the time when I came home and went back to school, and my mom would send me $5 every once in a while, but that was that. So, I did the linen, and I worked for Professor Dodge. And there, I cannot remember who there was another professor who brought their kids over from time to time, and I would babysit the group.

IG: 22:39
For their- were there other students doing similar things to you? Were they making money outside of campus or?

SC: 22:52
In my group, I do not [crosstalk], but there has always been kids who worked in the cafeteria, but in my little circle, I do not remember anybody. I know one-one girl who started out being a roommate. She spent her last three years, I think, living with the Andersons. He was a math teacher. She was a math major, and she would help out around their houses. He was in a wheelchair, and she helped out around their house and for room and board, she lived with them. They lived like right on the edge of campus, which is no longer the edge of campus. [laughs]

IG: 23:38
Did you feel that you were more grown up than the others because you had to pay your way?

SC: 23:44
No.

IG: 23:46
No. How did that make you feel better? Bigger?

SC: 23:52
I never-

IG: 23:54
Self-sufficient?

SC: 23:55
I never felt that. No, I just felt like this was what I had to do.

IG: 23:59
What you had to do.

SC: 24:00
And I did it.

IG: 24:03
What-what kinds of things would you talk about with your roommates, with your classmates?

SC: 24:10
Well, a lot of times it had to do with classes. If they had the same classes that that I did.

IG: 24:17
Right.

SC: 24:20
We would talk about our families back home and kid stuff, mostly, you know, clothing. It was

IG: 24:37
Dating?

SC: 24:38
That too.

IG: 24:39
Were you dating?

SC: 24:40
A lot. a lot.

IG: 24:43
You were dating a lot.

SC: 24:45
Yes, it was fun.

IG: 24:49
It was fun. And you and you would spend your time off campus, on campus?

SC: 24:55
Mostly on campus, because there were no cars there. You know, the buses were mostly for going back and forth to Endicott to school. If somebody had a car, we would go to the movies, like I said, we would go roller skating, but it was mostly on campus. We would have dances in the gym.

IG: 25:18
Right.

SC: 25:19
And that, that type of thing.

IG: 25:23
Did you feel that you were going to meet your husband-

SC: 25:27
I did.

IG: 25:28
-during- You did?

SC: 25:29
Yes.

IG: 25:29
Well, tell us about it.

SC: 25:32
I do not know very much. [laughs] He was, he was very popular. He was, at one point, he was the president of the Student Government.

IG: 25:42
Are you still married to him?

SC: 25:43
No, I was married to him for 16 years. Yeah, but no, maybe not.

IG: 25:49
I mean, since he is an alum, could you mention his name?

SC: 25:52
Yeah, his name is Ed Yaw. Y-W-W.

IG: 25:54
Okay.

SC: 25:58
Yeah, I do not know how involved he is, and I have never, I have been to a couple of college reunions, and I do not, I have never seen him there. No, and we are in touch because we did have four children together. And we go to all kinds of things that kid, you know, for the kids, you know, all the times up until this day.

IG: 26:25
Was he from New York?

SC: 26:27
Yes, he was from a small town to Potsdam, upstate New York. His-his father was a music teacher there. He taught French horn and cello. Yeah.

IG: 26:40
So, uh-

SC: 26:43
I think we met, and he was a year younger, so the first time we met each other, it was, you know, I was a sophomore, and we got married when he was a senior, and I was teaching in Vestal.

IG: 27:03
You were already teaching?

SC: 27:05
Yeah.

IG: 27:05
So, you-

SC: 27:05
I went to-

IG: 27:07
[crosstalk] slightly older.

SC: 27:08
I was a year older. I went to an intensive Teacher Training Program at Oneonta during this my- the summer after my graduation.

IG: 27:19
I see.

SC: 27:19
And then I got a teaching job in Vestal and taught for two years.

IG: 27:24
So, how long did you remain in Vestal?

SC: 27:30
Teaching in Vestal for two years, we lived in Johnson City. And then when he graduated a year after I did, in (19)60 he graduated in (19)64 he started working in the admissions office, and I believe he worked in the admissions office for two years, maybe three, and then we went to Carbondale, Illinois, so he could get his PhD in college administration, Southern Illinois University.

IG: 28:10
What kind of um, so, what kind of work did you- what was your career in? Teaching?

SC: 28:16
Mostly teaching. I did not. I was a stay-at-home mom for a long time, for a really long time. I mean, I did the two years of teaching in Vestal, and I had, you know, two little guys when we moved to Carbondale, and I taught some out there in a federal program for adults.

IG: 28:38
I see and what kind of federal program.

SC: 28:42
I cannot remember what it was, but I remember teaching. I just remember this one 85-year-old woman, a black woman, a cotton picker. We taught her how to write her name for the very first time. It was that kind of thing. It was just amazing. It was amazing. And when we came back to New York, we came back to Long Beach. I did a lot of little nothings. I sewed for somebody, some little shop, but I did not really have a career until I got divorced, and I got my MBA at Adelphi, and I went into the payroll business. I-I was a Customer Service Manager at a payroll company, and started out in Manhattan, moved to Queens, and that is what brought me out here. I got transferred out here.

IG: 29:35
Could you mention the companies that you worked for?

SC: 29:37
I worked it was called Payroll Plus when I first started.

IG: 29:45
When-when was that?

SC: 29:46
That was in (19)86 No-no-no-no-no-no, (19)81. Yeah, because I moved out of New York in (19)86. Yeah, in (19)81 I started there, and they moved me out here, and then Bank of America bought that payroll. So, I worked for Bank of America until they sold it to ADP, and that is when I said, "No more."

IG: 30:14
So when-when did you when did you retire?

SC: 30:16
I never retired.

IG: 30:18
You never retired [crosstalk].

SC: 30:21
No [crosstalk] doing that. I-I started my-my own. It was not my own business. I started; I was a licensee of a company in Texas. They do not exist anymore, though. I started this. I always wanted to be a florist. I started a candy bouquet business, and I had a retail shop for 12 years, and then I moved it home, because my mother came out to stay with me. She stayed with me for three years before she died. But that was perfect. I moved it home, and when I made deliveries, she came with me. So, I-

IG: 30:45
Do you still have a business?

SC: 30:58
I just stopped accepting credit cards. I closed down my website, but I still have some customers that call me. So, I-

IG: 31:09
What was the name of your business?

SC: 31:11
Candy and bloom. I think I saw it somewhere on your list, Candy and Bloom.

IG: 31:17
But this is for, this is for our listening audience,

SC: 31:21
Okay.

IG: 31:21
It is not for me.

SC: 31:22
Candy and Bloom. And it was a licensee of a Texas company when I-I was working in Texas for Bank of America for a while, for I cannot even remember if it was a whole year or not. And I found this little shop, and I fell in love with it. So, I bought the license, and away I went.

IG: 31:45
That is very interesting. I would like to circle back to your college days.

SC: 31:52
Okay.

IG: 31:53
And ask you, what were the politics that if, if any that were being discussed on campus?

SC: 32:02
I remember falling in with a group that I do not know if they identified themselves or we all did, as the original beatniks, and I remember being encouraged by that group was a very artistic group, if you ever get a chance to look at a yearbook from that time, there was a club called the outing club, and it was mostly those people, and it was not real friendly with them. I just knew them, and I do not know how they kept encouraging me to do sit-in or sit-out when there were bomb drills and that kind of thing.

IG: 32:50
You were doing bomb drills-

SC: 32:51
We were-

IG: 32:51
-on campus?

SC: 32:53
Um, yeah.

IG: 32:56
Against the threat of their Soviet empire? Is that what you were doing?

SC: 33:00
Maybe it was not, maybe it was not, I do not know, we were not doing drills, but something was going on, and they were doing these great big sit-ins on the lawn in front of the Student Union

SC: 33:19
Protesting what?

SC: 33:20
Protesting nuclear bombs, nuclear weapons. They were very active, very vocal.

IG: 33:31
Did they protest on campus alone, or did they go out to town or Washington?

SC: 33:38
No-no, it was always on campus.

IG: 33:41
And so, this was a small group.

SC: 33:43
It was a small group.

IG: 33:44
It was a small group.

SC: 33:45
I would say, no more than, no more than 25.

IG: 33:50
So, did you feel an affiliation with them in some way? Were you also against the bomb?

SC: 33:55
Yeah-yeah.

IG: 33:56
Yeah. What kind of music did you listen to?

SC: 34:01
Folk music mostly.

IG: 34:03
Yeah.

SC: 34:04
Yeah.

IG: 34:04
Peter, Paul, and Mary.

SC: 34:05
Yeah. And we did Joan Baez. We did a lot of folk singing. There was a lot there were a lot of guitars on campus.

IG: 34:13
That is right. You are a singer.

SC: 34:14
One of my roommates played guitar, and she knew all the folk songs. And we did folk dancing in the gym. That was all new to me.

IG: 34:30
Did you feel that you were swept up by some kind of youth movement on campus, you know, that was the beatniks were part of-

SC: 34:40
No, I was a pretty independent thinker too. Yeah, I did not really submerge myself in-in that group.

IG: 34:52
What were some of the other groups discussing?

SC: 34:58
You know, I cannot. There was a group that tried to get me to play bridge. Those are the intellectuals.

IG: 35:07
I am thinking about politics.

SC: 35:08
Politics? You know, I do not remember anything political except for that one group, and I guess I remember a lot of political activity after (19)63 and I was trying to figure out what happened to me here, because I remember the day that Kennedy was shot, I was teaching, and I remember being on campus with a whole group of people watching TV for days, but my husband was still in school. He was not my husband then, but he was, he was still in school. So, I think that is how that happened, that I happened to be on campus then, and there was a lot of discussion at that point in time, but I do not remember anything very political.

IG: 36:11
But what were people saying? How awful.

SC: 36:14
Mm-hmm. Yeah, it is really all I remember, sorry.

IG: 36:22
Uh, what were- did you notice, you know, the changing mores? Did you know women feel that they have to? Did they envision any kind of future for themselves beyond getting married-

SC: 36:42
Oh, at that school, absolutely.

IG: 36:46
Tell us about that.

SC: 36:46
Absolutely. I mean, these were these-these were career women, these were intelligent women.

IG: 36:54
Right.

SC: 36:55
Yeah-yeah.

IG: 36:57
It is not to say that intelligent women did not streamline into getting married [crosstalk]

SC: 37:05
Right-right. And I, and I was not either, you know, but it happened, you know. It happens. But those were women who were, they were going to go out and be lawyers and doctors, and they were going to do stuff.

IG: 37:08
And did they do the stuff? Yeah, have you kept in touch with some of these women?

SC: 37:27
I have.

IG: 37:28
So, what-what you know, what did they do?

SC: 37:31
Bonnie Malecon was a chemist, and she became a chemist for NASA.

IG: 37:37
Wow.

SC: 37:38
And she worked in Boston. Stephanie Mandelbaum. She was Stephanie Singer at the time, and she did not even graduate. She was in my freshman year. She was a math professor at what was, what was the girls’ part of Rutgers. I always forget there is a girls’ school that goes along with Rutgers. There is a girl's counterpart-

IG: 38:09
Oh, Douglas College.

SC: 38:10
It was either there or Rutgers, one of the two where she where she taught math. I think they are both retired now, and Wren de Mattis, she was from Saranac Lake. She married. She and her husband started a computer company for municipalities. She now lives in France with her with another husband; her first husband died, and we visited them 20 years ago. [crosstalk]That was nice. That was nice, yeah. You know, I think most of the people that I am still in touch with those-those are the women, the others are all men.

IG: 39:07
So, all the others are all men, and where are the- I mean, how do you get together? Do you get together individually?

SC: 39:17
We do not- we mostly do it on Facebook- anymore.

IG: 39:19
I see.

SC: 39:20
That is how we keep in touch.

IG: 39:21
I see, I see.

SC: 39:23
And sometimes by telephone.

IG: 39:25
And sometimes by telephone. Are there any chapters for, I mean-

SC: 39:29
You know, there was a chapter here, but I think it just kind of fell apart. We-we started to get together. When was me, was it? Could it have been loved floor who came out here? It might have been, and she had a cocktail party at a local at a downtown restaurant or hotel, and several of us who graduated together got together, and we also had, we all met at another restaurant not too long after that, and then somebody organized a trip to a baseball game. They were all younger people, and I thought they would keep it going right, but I never heard another thing after that.

IG: 40:17
How long ago was that?

SC: 40:21
Oh, it has been a few years. It has been years.

IG: 40:28
Okay. So, when you look back at your years in Binghamton at Harpur, what do you think that the college gave you? How were you changed by that experience?

SC: 40:46
It grew me up.

IG: 40:51
Yeah.

SC: 40:54
I got a little bit more self-esteem, a little I got to be a little bit more outgoing. I was kind of shy in high school, even though I did not know a lot of people, but it was a small town. Yeah, more self-esteem, and you touched on something earlier, organizational ability. So many people are afraid of public speaking, and it brought you know that out in me, I would, I would speak up in class more than I more than I did before.

IG: 41:31
What kind of things would you speak up against? Or did you just answer questions?

SC: 41:37
I just answered questions. Or if we were in an, in a discussion, I would take part. But I know I cannot remember particulars. Come on, it was a long time ago.

IG: 41:46
The general tenor, you know, some people were confronted authority. Others argumentative.

SC: 41:56
I do not remember confronting authority at all. You do not know, except for that one group.

IG: 42:05
But they, but you were not part of that group.

SC: 42:07
I was not part of that group.

IG: 42:10
Right?

SC: 42:10
No.

IG: 42:11
But you were friends with them.

SC: 42:12
Yes.

IG: 42:14
You know, did you feel that there were different expectations for women than there were for men?

SC: 42:25
I never felt that.

IG: 42:27
You never felt.

SC: 42:28
I never felt that at all. No. I felt like we were treated as equals.

IG: 42:37
So, there were no greater restrictions on the freedoms of women as opposed to men.

SC: 42:45
I am trying to remember if the men had a curfew like the women did, and I cannot remember.

IG: 42:50
That is, that is, that is one of the restrictions.

SC: 42:50
We did have curfews.

IG: 42:50
That is one of the restrictions.

SC: 42:54
Yes.

IG: 42:56
What do you think? Do you- do you believe that your generation's experience can teach, can say something to the present generation? Do you think that there are any, you know, major sort of lessons or major experiences that-that you were just-

SC: 43:22
I think-

IG: 43:22
-that would be useful for the current generation.

SC: 43:26
Yeah, I do not know that they would listen. You know-

IG: 43:30
You have a captive audience. They are listening [crosstalk]

SC: 43:32
More civility. I mean, we did not confront authority. We had respect for our professors and each other; I do not see that anymore. We were kinder. I mean, there was probably an oddball out there who was not so kind, but I did not meet him.

IG: 44:05
Do you think this is true of this generation, or just the culture outside of Harpur College?

SC: 44:11
Oh, I think it is the culture-

IG: 44:13
Outside of Harpur College?

SC: 44:15
Yeah. Oh, yeah.

IG: 44:18
So, it is not; it does not really have to do with a generation, this current generation of young people, but it has more to do with a culture outside of Harpur College. What do you think?

SC: 44:35
Well, I think I, you know, I do not know what Harpur College is like these days. It is kind of a smaller college of my Harpur College, gosh, speaking to today's generation from Harpur College, my Harpur College. It, yeah, it is the authority. It is the respect for individuals that stands out in my mind, the respect for human life. Times have changed, and not for the best, and I wish we could go back.

IG: 45:26
What lessons did you learn from this time in your life?

SC: 45:32
I learned how to get along with a lot of different people, and I learned that you do not have a lot of money. Have to have a lot of money to have a good time and a good education, and you can be just as, just as good as somebody who has got a lot of money. I mean, I came from nothing, and I do not think anybody knew that about me, and I do not think anybody cared. Was a different time.

IG: 46:12
It is a different time, but it is also a different group of people at Harpur College; it might not have been the same experience elsewhere, or do you think would have been?

SC: 46:25
Might have. I do not know, [crosstalk], I kind of remember another person that I really got along with, really, really well. She was this big, she was a little person, and she lived on my floor, and we got along really well. I came to college wearing a, this is my Spitfire thing. I wore a kilt, you know, a little short skirt, big safety. She borrowed it all the time. And there was another one on my floor who was, she was a Hulk, and she was an RA, and she was not very nice, but she was nice to me, and I do not know why.

IG: 47:07
You must have drawn that out from people.

SC: 47:12
I do not know. I do not know I like people.

IG: 47:20
That is, that is, I think that is key. I think that is key. So, I am just looking back at you at your life so far. What do you know, some of the lessons that you have learned from your experience at Harpur and your life that you would like to share with you know, young people listening to this interview, what are some of the key elements to having a successful life?

SC: 47:57
Well, I think I have touched on almost all of them, as you know, just put yourself out there, and do not be afraid to mix with other kinds of people. And, you know, respect each other, basically.

IG: 48:16
Do you have any concluding remarks?

SC: 48:19
I do not, other than I loved my experience there. I really, really did. I had a good experience. I have, I have a cousin whose son did not have a good experience there, and I felt bad for him. He went to Harpur.

IG: 48:39
But when?

SC: 48:40
Probably was probably almost 20 years ago.

IG: 48:47
It was a different, a different time.

SC: 48:49
It was a different time, yeah, yeah. But, I mean, I was lost a lot of the time in classes where I mean, what am I doing here? These are smart people, but I persevered, and I got through. Just keep on trucking.

IG: 49:18
Well, that is great. That is great advice. Thank you so much.

SC: 49:21
You are so welcome. I talked a little bit.

(End of Interview)

2019-02-28

Irene Gashurov

1963

Sue Castaldo

Sue Castaldo, of Italian descent, grew up in Mechanicville, New York, and graduated from Harpur College in 1963 with a degree in sociology and anthropology. While at Harpur, she met her husband, Ed Yaw, and together they raised four children. Sue began her career in education, teaching in Vestal schools and later working with adult learners in Illinois. She went on to earn an MBA from Adelphi University in 1983 and transitioned into customer service at Bank of America in Phoenix. A successful entrepreneur, Sue owned and operated the retail candy business Candy in Bloom for 25 years. Now retired, she continues to live in Phoenix, Arizona.

Audio

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