Interview with Dr. Neal M. Friedberg

Interview with Dr. Neal M. Friedberg

Friedberg, Neal M ; Gashurov, Irene

Harpur College – Sixites alumni; Harpur College – Alumni in New York City;

Neal retired in 2018 from his 49-year practice as a physician-hematologist in New York City.

2018-05-31

In Copyright

Neal Friedberg.mp3

2018-05-31

Oral Histories from 60's Binghamton Alumni

66:08 minutes

Alumni Interviews
Interview with: Neal M. Friedberg
Interviewed by: Irene Gashurov
Transcriber: Oral History Lab
Date of interview: 31 May 2018
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(Start of Interview)

IG: 00:01
Testing, okay, I think we are good.

NF: 00:07
I Neil Friedberg, class of 1962 at Harpur College, consent to this interview with Irene Gashurov and agree that it be part of the public documents about the 1960s and Harpur College.

IG: 00:31
Excellent. Thank you. So perhaps we can start with your identifying yourself when you graduated, and what you do?

NF: 00:53
I am a retired physician. I grew up in New York City, in the Washington Heights area, and went to the Bronx High School of Science, and I think that is what led me to be accepted at Harpur College in 1958. It was a new school at the time in terms of its imminently new campus in Vestal New York. In the year that I entered, most of the classes were held in former military huts that had been left either on the Binghamton or Vestal campuses or in Johnson City. It was a preferred school for me at the time because it was a school that I could afford and at the time, New York state and the federal government were generous with scholarship and scholar incentive awards, which essentially allowed me to go to school for practical purposes free for the four years that I attended Harpur College.

IG: 02:27
That is a good introduction. Very good introduction. So, you mentioned that you grew up in Washington Heights. Who were your parents?

NF: 02:37
My parents were second generation Americans. I am an only child. My mother was born in 1914 my father in 1908 they--my mother worked part time when I was an adolescent, but not prior. And my father was a part of furrier working part time when the industry allowed him to work. Neither, neither of them finished high school, I may add.

IG: 03:17
That is tremendous. I mean, given your achievement. But did they encourage what was the culture like at home? Did they encourage your education?

NF: 03:30
The emphasis was always on bettering oneself through education.

IG: 03:39
So, you were in Bronx High School of Science. Did you show a predisposition to the sciences over what did you want to study?

NF: 03:51
I always believed that my mother whispered in my ear from the time I was four or five that I would be a doctor. There was some precedent in the family. With one of my cousins, there was no other person in the family who was a physician. I always enjoyed science, but I always also loved literature. And there was a debate in my Harpur education about whether I was going to switch into literature, but ultimately decided that medicine was probably a better profession, and one could like literature independent of.

IG: 04:39
That is a very wise decision to make at such an early age. So, what was your first impression of you know, I mean, you are a city kid, and most of the students were from New York City and-and Long Island, but there must have been a few from upstate New York, and so what-what was your impression of the students?

NF: 05:07
At the time that I entered Harpur, there were only two dormitories extant. One was Refuse Hall for the boys, and I forget the name of the girls. The ground floor of Refuse Hall where I boarded each room had two people, two boys, and it was interesting that most of the boys were not New York City boys, but rather upstate boys with a couple of Long Islanders and as a quote, unquote sophisticated New York city [phone rings]

IG: 06:06
Okay, so we have resumed with our conversation with Neil Friedberg.

NF: 06:17
So, as I said, most of the boys were from upstate New York, and boys being boys, we would often assemble in a room and shoot the breeze. And it was remarkable for me as this quote, sophisticated New Yorker, how intelligent and in their own way, sophisticated these other young men were. And it was an eye-opening experience that has stood me in good stead over the many years, where, in the field of medicine, you meet people from all walks of life and all sorts of interests that I could find a way and accommodate my own interests and conversations to their needs.

IG: 07:28
So, what kind of things did you talk about?

NF: 07:32
Well, I think it was the common things that boys talked about. Needless to say, we talked about girls, we talked about the classes that we were attending, and we talked about the society as a whole. And it was, it was not a particularly violent period of time, but it was a rather conservative period of time, and I, having come from a New York City Jewish background with a fairly liberal parent and family based would often argue with many of the guys who had much more conservative views of what the society should be and was like.

IG: 08:39
So, you know, what was a society? What was your what was your vision of this society and what it should be? Was it about diversity? Was it about, you know, greater democracy, reaching?

NF: 08:55
Well, this was, I think, the major issue at the time, I think was still civil rights right, and I had always, even at that time period, time of my life, thought it was outrageous that there was still such animosity. And difficulty for the what we call the black population at the time, or negro population at the time. In 1959 I began to date a young woman at the college who was a freshman who was much more radical than I was, and I think she awakened in me a much more active role in the civil rights movement. I not sure when it was. I think it was (19)60 or (19)61 when the Woolworth sit-ins began. And though we were not in the south, there was indeed a Woolworths in Binghamton, New York, at which we sat in at Woolworths.

IG: 10:23
So, tell me what I have heard of sit ins, but not specific to Woolworths, because they-they, why-why were you sitting in?

NF: 10:34
Woolworths would not allow Negroes, Blacks to sit at the counter in their stores, and the counters were the place where individuals would sit and have their sandwiches or coffee, etc. Those kinds of counters seem to have faded now to a great extent, though there are still some around.

IG: 10:58
Right. So, what did that look like? I mean, a group of college kids would come in and where would you sit?

NF: 11:09
We would, we would take the seats at the counter and that order. And that, of course, undermine the economics of Woolworth's. Not of course, for the day or so that we did it. It was not a major issue, but it was a measure of the support at the college level for what was going on nationally.

IG: 11:34
And so, where were you sitting in which Woolworths in upstate New York or?

IG: 11:41
In Binghamton.

IG: 11:42
In Binghamton Woolworths, New York. Um, was- did the police come?

NF: 11:47
Good question, I do not remember.

IG: 11:49
You do not remember. So, you know you say radical. I am just interested radical girlfriend. How was her radicalness expressed?

NF: 12:02
Well, mostly in thought. I mean, I do not think she, you know, was doing creating bombs or things of that sort, or robbing banks, right, you know, anything of that sort. So, I think it was a philosophical radicalism right at the time.

IG: 12:29
So, what notions you know? I would like to probe a little [crosstalk] What ideas did she instill in you, or she exposed you to?

NF: 12:48
Well, I do not recall that. I do not recall particulars. I think what she did was to extend my own quote liberalism, maybe into a more substantive vein. More than that, I cannot say.

IG: 13:19
Maybe to enact your beliefs or?

NF: 13:22
Well, in the sense that, in the sense that I would go to a sit in, which is probably something I would not have done as the only child of anxious parents.

IG: 13:35
Yes.

NF: 13:35
Right. And as time went on, got more involved in the anti-war movement and went to Washington to march in the anti-war marches, or Washington in the Civil War marches.

IG: 13:53
Was this after Binghamton?

NF: 13:55
Well, I do not remember exactly when they were. It must have been while it while I was at Binghamton, because there was not a lot of time to do that in medical school.

IG: 14:06
Right-right. So, what was that like? You know, a bus-

NF: 14:12
Yes, bus, right.

IG: 14:13
Students [crosstalk] or drove up

NF: 14:15
Several busses would drive down to Washington and spend, I presume, the weekend, marching on the mall.

IG: 14:31
With-with many other people?

NF: 14:34
Yes, both people from the school, as well as the innumerable other people who would show up

IG: 14:42
And innumerable other people were people like Martin Luther King, or any leaders there that you recall?

NF: 14:50
Well, I seem to remember a Philip Randolph, and there was somebody else. Um, I do not remember attending King's speeches, but I might have, I just do not recall.

IG: 15:14
So, do you think that overall? Well, you know, in 1958 Harpur College was just earning its reputation.

NF: 15:23
Right.

IG: 15:24
Because these are just the beginnings.

NF: 15:26
Right-right.

IG: 15:27
But what kind of you know was it already sort of the rigorous liberal arts school that-

NF: 15:37
The-the- okay, the-the education that I achieved at Bingham at Harpur was much more in the desire for knowledge than the actual high-powered knowledge that I might have gotten at a quote, unquote better school right at the time, the Biology Department was vastly understaffed and with professors who were, for the most part, out of date. I think the best department that I recall was the English department. In particular, I had a wonderful experience with a professor named Dr. Wald, Dr. Weld [John Weld], I am sorry, Weld, who was just a remarkable professor for teaching both the drama theater and poetry and literature, very exciting. And uh-

IG: 16:55
Do you remember what you were reading? Was it-

NF: 16:58
Oh well for-

IG: 16:58
-temporary or was it-

NF: 17:00
-well, for instance, the Shakespeare course that I took with him, or maybe it was only a theater course, but Shakespeare was one of the plays, and he was teaching King Lear at the time [crosstalk], and he would stand in front of the class and say, "Do you think I could be King Lear?" And he was about five, five or five, six, and scrawny. And then he would get up on the desk, climb on the desk, and, you know, act out King Lear. And it was just a way of exciting students.

IG: 17:41
Was he an actor at some point?

NF: 17:43
No idea, no idea.

IG: 17:45
The theater department, until this day is remarkably strong. So, he made an impression. And this is this, is this why you were at one point leaning toward,

NF: 18:02
Well, I think the department as a whole, well, let us go back. I mean, from the time I was a small kid, I was a voracious reader. I would get into bed when I was, you know, 12-year-old, and take a flashlight, cover my head with a quilt so my folks would not see I was awake, and read under the covers. And I did that throughout that period of time, so that I always liked literature. It was a way for the world to open up to me, over and above the community I had grown up in. And so, when the literature courses at Harpur were exciting, it was a reason to think about entering that field.

IG: 18:51
Of course, of course.

NF: 18:53
But I was, again, probably a little smarter than I should have been, because I thought I was going to be a physician at Bronx Science. I took Latin because I thought you had to have Latin as a physician. And the sentence structure of Latin is so formal and convoluted that when I would have to write papers for the English department. I recognized that I was not a writer. And I thought you have to be a writer if you are going to be in the English world, in the literature world.

IG: 19:36
I mean these, well, I mean it is, it is, it is a good recognition at the at the time, not, you know, but, I mean, these are also skills that can be developed, you know, but you just did not have the inclination, you did not have the inclination that is amazing. So-so this was your Harpur experience. And, um, you mentioned, you know the faculty that made an impression, but you were determined to pursue your medical career. And so, did you apply to graduate school right after that? Or and did you get any advisement from your teachers?

NF: 20:20
I did not really need much advice from the teachers.

IG: 20:25
Right.

NF: 20:25
It was pretty clear that I had the grades necessary to get into medical school. And again, the problem of finances arose, and at the time, there were probably three medical schools in the state that were state schools. There was downstate in Brooklyn, upstate in Syracuse, and Buffalo.

IG: 20:50
And Buffalo.

NF: 20:51
Right. And I certainly had no desire to go into what was thought to be a what sort of should I say, Alliance pit in Brooklyn, where-

IG: 21:07
Really?

NF: 21:07
-where it was said that some of the students would change the location of the pins in the guinea pig or animal that was being, you know, dissected so that the students who came behind them would get it wrong and they would look outstanding.

IG: 21:28
That is a really good story. That is a really it was that competitive,

NF: 21:33
Yes, right, right. Whereas Upstate was not terribly different from Binghamton, except one had to live in the cold and nastiness of Syracuse.

IG: 21:45
of course. So, you went to Syracuse. You went to Syracuse. So, you know, did you have any idea about specializing, or did you

NF: 21:57
Uh, okay. Good question, when we started to think about specializing after the first year, which were all the usual anatomy, physiology courses, I think I basically decided that I was going to go into hematology, because nobody understood anything about blood, and nobody, none of the other students cared about blood, and I thought it was a ubiquitous fluid, and it also served one of the things that I really had liked, and that was biochemistry. Most of the other disciplines depended upon physiology at the time right and hematology and endocrinology were those disciplines that had an underlying biochemical foundation. So just to pursue that. So, when elective time came, I took hematology, and I also worked one or two summers with a professor who was in the Department of Medicine, but was not a physician. He was a PhD, learning some techniques of electrophoresis, but also going out into the community of Canandaigua County, is that Syracuse, where they were testing and looking after some migrant laborers that would that was taking place at the time, so we would sample their blood and measure different vitamin levels, etc.

IG: 24:18
Did you find that they-

NF: 24:20
I were in-

IG: 24:21
-any way deficient because-

NF: 24:23
I was not around long enough to find the answers.

IG: 24:30
So, you know, you spent this rigorous you did this rigorous degree, and you probably were very much immersed in your studies, and were you paying attention to-

NF: 24:46
-the rest of the world?

IG: 24:47
Yes.

NF: 24:51
I have no question, right. And it was also true that--I need to go back actually. It was in 1964 which is after my second year of medical school. In this in the second year of medical school, my good friend said, you know, the government is giving out a lot of loans. You know, rather than working at the local hospital, which we were doing at the time, perhaps it would be a good idea to take some loans. And needless to say, that the loans were granted. And he said, as we got the loans, you know, we have all this money. Why do not we go to Europe?

IG: 25:38
That is a great way of thinking.

NF: 25:47
So, so we did that and ran our full heads off in the summer of (19)64 and that is where I met my wife. We met in the Athens airport.

IG: 26:10
Is she American?

NF: 26:13
Yes-yes, she was doing the same thing I was doing. And so, I was certainly extending myself beyond my medical interests, but Kennedy got shot in (19)63 and Robert a few years later, etc., and King got killed. It was hard to not be aware of the chaos in the society.

IG: 26:53
So, did you see that? You know how? How was it visible to you that society was, in fact, changing from, you know, the more I mean this. These are general.

NF: 27:08
Well, this was, this was a radical change. As I said, the (19)50s were rather conservative and the (19)60s were rather liberal. And it was not only sexually, but it was socially as well. (19)53 had been the Board of Education thing in Little Rock as just one manifestation of a major change which was ongoing. I do not remember how many years it took for many of the other southern schools to integrate, and there were always barriers to that integration, from the governors to the local citizenry. I think if you look oh and (19)61 was Cuba, right? It is interesting. If you look at, look at Robert Rauschenberg's art, you see pieces of news clippings from that era in the paintings, but testing to the awareness and the sense that art was a contributing factor to changes in society.

IG: 28:37
Yeah, I think that is I believe that too. That it always is in dialog with its time. What about the Vietnam War? You were in medical school, so you were kind of not impervious, but you were protected against the draft.

NF: 28:57
Well, here is you are here is your real story. So, in the must have been (19)65 the war is heating up, and the military offered doctors, potential doctors, the opportunity to defer their training, I am sorry, to defer their entry into the military until they completed their training. Actually, maybe this occurred a little later, and so we were offered to go in as either a first lieutenant or as a captain when you finished your training. So, I did elect to take that opportunity to defer my-my entry, because maybe the war would be over, whereas colleagues of mine were going after the internship or first year residency, and then as the war carried on and became increasingly unpopular and embittering, I decided I was not under any circumstances are going to go. So, I had a few options, Canada, jail, or what I decided to do was to apply for conscientious objector status. Now, in order to do that, you have to prove that you had some measure of that prior to your deciding that. So, because of my anti-war activity, etc., I thought I had the criteria. And the military criteria is that you have to be interviewed by a military officer, a religious person, and I am missing one military, the religious, it will come to me anyway, all three people approved of my sincerity. That was the criteria. You had to be sincere and convincing. So, the military turned me down, even though I met the criteria. So, I went to court and at the what do you call it, the lowest level of the federal courts,

IG: 32:00
The city?

NF: 32:10
No, well, whatever-

IG: 32:15
Where was it? Where-

NF: 32:16
In New York.

IG: 32:16
In New York City.

NF: 32:17
Yeah, I was turned down two to one, so we went to the appellate court, where I did win again, two to one, and the military gave me a discharge.

IG: 32:37
How long did that process take?

NF: 32:41
Let us see from probably from (19)68 to (19)71 or (197)2.

IG: 32:52
It is a long time.

NF: 32:54
Yeah.

IG: 32:54
To be fighting.

NF: 32:56
Yeah.

IG: 32:56
What- were you already practicing as a doctor?

NF: 33:01
When I know well, that is not exactly true when-when I finished my training, I needed a job, and I applied to different institutions in the city here we were going to live in the city. That was a decision made,

IG: 33:21
And were you married at the time?

NF: 33:23
Oh yes-yes, married in (19)65 I had to tell each of the different institutions what the status could I could disappear at any time. And most of them did not care. I mean, they said, that is fine, yeah, you know, we want you. We will take you, and I took a position.

IG: 33:54
What were you doing?

NF: 33:55
Hematology.

NF: 33:56
Yes.

IG: 33:57
Still. So, what did that? What did that involve? What did your work involve? Were you an MD? You are not an MD/PhD?

IG: 34:01
Right.

IG: 34:01
No, just an MD.

IG: 34:08
Just, yeah.

NF: 34:11
It involved teaching, some administrative work, running the blood clotting laboratory at the hospital, taking care of patients.

IG: 34:25
Right. So-so before you said that so institutions did not care about your wanting to be a subject and being snatched at any moment.

NF: 34:42
Right-right-right.

IG: 34:43
Because you must have impressed them with all of your training. And-

NF: 34:47
Because I had good training.

IG: 34:48
Right. You had a good training. May I ask where you had your training?

NF: 34:52
Sure, when I graduated upstate, I went to Montefiore Hospital.

IG: 34:58
Oh, that is okay. Yeah.

NF: 34:59
And spent three, three years there, and then, including one year fellowship. And then I went to NYU and spent two years there.

IG: 35:15
Did Montefiore, at the time, have its reputation of providing, you know, first rate care to the poor.

NF: 35:23
Yes-yes. They are both terrific institutions in terms of care, of course, right.

IG: 35:30
In terms of that.

NF: 35:31
Yes, sure, yeah.

IG: 35:34
Okay, so-so you know, the-the Vietnam War was your participation in it was you narrowly, kind of escaped. And so, tell us about, we are entering into the (19)70s. So, tell us about, you know what, what your life-

NF: 36:03
So, the (19)70s were the time of my beginning my career. Yeah, I took my first job in (19)71. And I had my first child in (19)71 my wife, who is probably very much smarter than I am, who was getting her PhD in biochemistry, environmental medicine at NYU. So, she had a little more leeway, I think, in terms of childcare, but I was pretty diligent about coming home to see the daughter. See my daughter and our son was born in (19)74 and my wife, who kept looking at what I was doing and what she was doing, thought she really wanted to be a physician as well. So, after some contention, she went to she got into NYU in (19)74 in medical school as a sophomore, so she did not have to compete with all the new kids on the block. And finished, I guess, in (19)76 and became an ophthalmologist. So.

IG: 37:45
So, in some way, this is the (19)70s, especially the late (19)70s, or the beginning of the feminist movement, but you were already practicing that in your married life.

NF: 37:55
Yeah, a little bit reluctantly. I must confess.

IG: 37:57
Why? Because you had expectations that she would take a different route, or?

NF: 38:03
Well, I guess, because she already had a doctorate and to now go to school when we have, you know, a child in the crib and one on the way, seemed like a lot of burden would fall to me.

IG: 38:27
You were the one to do the child rearing.

NF: 38:30
Well, to a certain extent. I mean, we hired a wonderful woman who stayed with us for innumerable years. But nevertheless, there are weekends and evenings.

IG: 38:45
Right. Of course, of course. So, did you-you know your wife when she became a physician, did you go into practice together, or were you working with a completely so what is her specialization?

NF: 39:04
Ophthalmology.

IG: 39:05
ophthalmology, of course. I am sorry. I am sorry, of course, of course, I am sorry.

NF: 39:11
And we live here, yeah, we, we were living in an Edmonton here in a one-bedroom apartment. And then we came into Manhattan, because we both wanted to live in Manhattan, and we had a very nice two-bedroom apartment, but, you know, we had a boy and a girl, and we thought we would need to do something about that eventually. And we had taken, we had taken a European trip and went to Scandinavia, and she took a social tour while I did some other thing. And what she had learned was that in Sweden, you had to wait about. Seven years before you could get an apartment. So, she said, that is going to happen here. We better buy something. So, we have for several years. We bump it around, looking for something that we could afford, and then ultimately came up with this.

IG: 40:18
So, you have had this in your position? [crosstalk] Well, that is, it is, was it a ground space like this? Renovate over the years?

NF: 40:31
There was there was only this column, a kitchen here, a small bathroom. And perhaps, as a measure of the feminist movement, we hired a woman architect who was just wonderful, probably the best architect we have had since we have been doing things.

IG: 40:55
It is a gorgeous it is a gorgeous apartment. So, did you, you know, did your activity- did you have any activity in politics, or you had no time for that? But you-

NF: 41:11
I had no time, and I have no inclination.

NF: 41:15
It is not that I am concerned about it, very diligent about knowing what is going on.

IG: 41:15
No inclination. So, um-

IG: 41:25
Did you did you keep in touch with any of your fellow students from Harpur College?

NF: 41:32
Good question. The- in those days when we assembled in one room and, you know, shot the breeze, my roommate was a six-foot three tall guy who used to wear a red cowboy hat, and he lived many places upstate, because his father was in the military, and they would shuttle around. And I really got to like him. The irony, of course, was that he taught me all about contemporary American classical music and about Bach and-

IG: 42:23
How interesting.

NF: 42:24
Yes-yes. So, we remained friends for a while, and then we lost touch over the years, and then when our 50th reunion time came, I contacted him to ask if he was going to be attending. He was a scholar, political science scholar, well, particularly involved in Korea, and he was still a professor at the time.

IG: 42:56
Where was-

NF: 42:57
At UC Irvine.

IG: 43:01
Oh.

NF: 43:03
And unfortunately, he could not come to the reunion. He was too busy. But we have been in contact and visited since.

IG: 43:12
Very nice, very nice.

NF: 43:14
So, I saw him just a few months ago.

IG: 43:17
Oh, here or in California?

NF: 43:22
Actually here. Yeah, his wife has family on Long Island.

IG: 43:28
I see. So, when you get together, how do you remember Harpur? What do you say about-

NF: 43:34
Oh, we do not talk [crosstalk]

IG: 43:36
You do not talk. No-no-no.

NF: 43:39
You know, our lives have moved on.

IG: 43:40
Of course, of course.

NF: 43:42
I must say that I enjoyed attending the 50th reunion. I was surprised because I had not liked my reunions at Bronx Science. Had not liked them at all, and I was not particularly enamored of reunion at Upstate, but I like the 50th that.

IG: 44:08
Why do you say that? Because of the kind of people-

NF: 44:11
Yeah-yeah, right.

IG: 44:12
Yeah. I think it is, it is a very strong group of people, you know, at least the ones that I have been talking-

NF: 44:22
It is interesting that of the people that I remember, I do not know that anybody became that famous from my class.

IG: 44:36
Well, you know, as I said it, from your class, from (19)62.

NF: 44:41
Yeah.

IG: 44:42
The class of (19)62 you know, I-I do not know about the class of (19)62 but I think it is sort of, you know, a quality of a turn, a certain turn of mind that, you know, people were very engaged in their time, and they accomplished something with their lives. You know, whether it got them fame or, you know, they wrote books or they you know, their circle of influence may have been, not as you know, not conspicuous, but, I mean, it was circle of influence in their community, but maybe it was not known about to you know to others.

NF: 45:32
Well, you have to remember that the class, I think, had a max of 200 students, and by the second year, it was down to, I think about 105 it shrunk considerably through dropouts and transfers, I guess.

IG: 45:50
Dropouts and transfers and the maybe the war, or that the war was true.

NF: 45:57
No, I do not think so. Yeah-yeah. And also, there were, I mean, the male female relation ratio. There probably 65, 35.

IG: 46:13
65 female, 65 male.

NF: 46:15
Male.

IG: 46:15
Oh.

NF: 46:17
Yeah, there were- there were not that many women.

IG: 46:22
And there probably were even fewer international students, minorities.

NF: 46:28
Very few. Yeah, I think there were two black kids in our class.

IG: 46:35
How do you think that your classmates remember you?

NF: 46:38
[laughs] I well, I think other than the ones who I would have re met in the 50th most of them do not remember me at all. I was not uh-

IG: 47:06
But what how do you think that they remembered, if they you know, certainly the person that you-you know, who teaches at Irvine, remembered you?

NF: 47:16
Oh, yeah, sure.

IG: 47:17
You know how did he you know, you did not really discuss how you each remembered each other.

NF: 47:28
No, it was like there had been no interval time.

IG: 47:35
I see, that is wonderful. That is a wonderful feeling. And you met on campus.

NF: 47:42
No-no-no. We met here in the city.

IG: 47:44
You met-

NF: 47:45
You mean originally.

IG: 47:46
Originally. You went to the 50th reunion, which was on campus. So-

NF: 47:52
No-no, but he did not attend.

IG: 47:53
He did not attend.

NF: 47:54
Right.

IG: 47:55
So, but- okay, so I was going to ask you, know, how was how did Binghamton strike you 50 years later?

NF: 48:09
Well, Binghamton, I think, was a pretty rundown city. The two things I remember most specifically about it, or it had a wonderful art movie theater, and it was a very significant factor in my arts world, even to the present. And the second thing was it had a reasonable black community, and it was always fun to go down into the black community to the bars and drink there.

IG: 48:52
Well, that is great. So, Binghamton is still a depressed city.

NF: 49:02
Yes-yes, correct.

IG: 49:04
It is still a depressed city. But at your during that time, there was, perhaps, when you were in college, there was more industry there. I mean, no,

NF: 49:14
I was not aware of that.

IG: 49:16
You were not aware of that.

NF: 49:17
No, the-the, I mean, the only industry I think that I was at all aware of was the Johnson shoe factory.

IG: 49:27
Right.

NF: 49:28
And they were basically gone already.

IG: 49:35
Yeah, I have met people who worked [crosstalk]

NF: 49:37
And then IBM was in that area there. And in fact, the botany course that I took often would go to their grounds. The botany professor was a terrific professor, and I guess he got permission to meander. So [crosstalk]

IG: 50:02
So, it must have been a beautiful headquarters that IBM [crosstalk]

NF: 50:07
You know [crosstalk]

IG: 50:09
So-so, you know. Do you think overall that Harpur College prepared you for your future career, not directly, of course, because-

NF: 50:19
Well, what I think I started off with was that Harpur prepared me to learn. It made learning exciting and interesting, and whether it was the professors or the courses or the student body, totally does not really matter, but it was- did not quell my interest in learning. And I thought the social milieu, the excitement about politics and what was going on in the larger community of the US was I was very much involved in what was going on at the college at that time, and I think that was also very important in broadening my experience and opening my eyes to what was going on.

IG: 51:23
So-so, you know, I am curious, how do you spend your time now? What are some of the pursuits that you are engaged with?

NF: 51:32
You mean, as a retired physician? [laughs]

IG: 51:36
Yeah-yeah, yes.

NF: 51:38
Well, let us give a universal overview. We spend nine months of the year in New York City and three months in a home that we bought in California.

IG: 51:51
Where in California?

NF: 51:54
Santa Barbara. Not bad, huh?

IG: 51:57
Not bad, not bad.

NF: 52:00
We have been very fortunate. And so, of the nine months here, we also have a house upstate New York, so [crosstalk] we are just east of Rhinebeck, Hudson Valley.

IG: 52:19
That is lovely. Been there recently.

NF: 52:23
So, we spend weekends up there. So given those three parameters-

IG: 52:30
You probably [inaudible] well, I mean from one house to another.

NF: 52:36
When we, when we bought the Upstate house in 1973, I said to my wife, who has been the real estate agent in the family, "Well, it is okay. We will buy this house, but we are not going to not travel on vacation," and so we have traveled extensively over the years.

IG: 53:01
Where have you gone? Some of the places-

NF: 53:04
We have gone to, most of the countries in Asia, standard European travel. We came back from Safari this year in Botswana, Zimbabwe. We have been in Colombia and Argentina, Morocco.

IG: 53:28
What stands out in your memory? What-what is, you know, what are some of the most impressive places that you have seen?

NF: 53:38
I think if you spoke to each of us, the most exciting time we have ever had was in Cambodia. It was just wonderful. But sometimes getting out of the country revolves around people, and we have very good friends in Turin Italy who we see on a reasonably regular basis and go around Italy with them. So that is also wonderful having known somebody for over 50 years.

IG: 54:19
You know, looking back at the decade, at the (19)60s, are you sometimes you know- do you sometimes recognize that you know the world has changed in your dramatically in your lifetime?

NF: 54:38
We only hope to live long enough to see it go back to the (19)60s. [laughs]

IG: 54:46
That is a great answer.

NF: 54:49
I mean, that was the most exciting era that most of the exciting decade that I remember.

IG: 54:56
I think so in in every way, almost-

NF: 54:59
Yeah. Yeah.

IG: 55:00
I think I would, yeah.

NF: 55:03
But you had asked me in another- oh, and how I spend my time now.

IG: 55:07
Yeah.

NF: 55:08
Okay. Well, as you can see, I collect photographs

IG: 55:15
Yes.

NF: 55:15
Okay, and those the ones you are looking at are not the prime example of what I collect. I collect panoramic photos. It is my niche. I do not-

IG: 55:31
These are these are prints. These are prints that you have on the wall. They are not photographs.

IG: 55:37
They are photographs.

IG: 55:39
So, do you go to galleries, or do you go to antiques?

NF: 55:48
Mostly antiques.

IG: 55:49
And where do you find them? In New York City, or all over?

NF: 55:53
All over.

IG: 55:54
All over.

NF: 55:55
Yeah, so that is one thing. Secondly, when I started to retire in 1960 [inaudible] [laughter], in 2000 [laughs] Mr. Freud.

IG: 56:18
Yes-yes.

NF: 56:19
I started to play the piano, and I am not a very good pianist, but I enjoy it. So.

IG: 56:29
So, you, you never had music lessons before?

NF: 56:32
Well, I played the violin when I was 10-year-old for a couple years.

IG: 56:36
Okay.

NF: 56:36
I play golf. I go to a lot of museums and galleries. For several years, when I was in California, I worked at the Santa Barbara Museum in the photography department as a volunteer.

IG: 56:58
How wonderful. How wonderful. So, you learned a tremendous amount about photography.

NF: 57:03
Yeah, but unfortunately, the curator died.

IG: 57:08
Have you read Susan Sontag On Photography?

NF: 57:12
It is on the table on my upstate New York [crosstalk]

IG: 57:18
It is an obvious question.

NF: 57:20
Right.

NF: 57:22
What else do I do? We entertain a lot. We have a lot of friends here, upstate, California, and then I am having my family.

IG: 57:39
And your kids are-

NF: 57:40
My daughter is in walking distance with her two grandchildren, and my son, I have to get on the subway and take four stops.

IG: 57:48
You are very lucky. You are very lucky.

NF: 57:50
It is really a burden, yeah.

IG: 57:54
So-so, you know-

NF: 57:57
I do not think it is luck.

IG: 57:57
What?

NF: 57:58
I do not think it is luck.

IG: 58:00
You know, it, I do not think it is luck, but luck, you know, chance and luck does play a part, you know? I mean, it is, well, I mean, this is a [inaudible]

NF: 58:11
They could migrate.

IG: 58:12
They could migrate. This is a philosophical question. I think, I think, you know, certainly, it is a lot of what you have, the life that you have created. But I think that there is an element of luck or not, you know, it is, it is the historic it is the context in which the historical time in which you live, you know, it is the environment around you, you know? I mean, there are a lot of contributing sure forces that are outside of our control,

NF: 58:44
Right. [crosstalk]

IG: 58:50
If you were to, I would like you to tell us, if you - what lessons did you learn from your-your years at Harpur College? What would you like? What advice would you give to current students who listen to this tape? What-what are important qualities or, you know-

NF: 59:20
The problem as I see it, in answering that question is the-the insular nature of our life compared to youth. So, I-I could say things that I think are maybe more universal, and the first one would be not to dismiss people who are so different from you, but rather to take in their experience and way of being and try to enrich yourself from the way they are. The second would be trying to listen to what people have to say, even those that are like you, if their views are different than yours, but not to be so passive as not to argue. My one of my hematology professors, who is a just a wonderful gem of a man, always said that you can always argue with me, as long as it is not an ad hominem argument. I-I guess the other thing would be, just keep on learning things you know your own enrichment is at least as important as what you do, because as you age, you need to, you need to be excited about the life you are living.

IG: 1:01:26
Yes, and you need to fill up the spaces that that were taken up so much by your profession.

NF: 1:01:33
Sure-sure. I have always told people who are getting ready to retire, because I retired pretty young was the hardest thing to give up. Is not the work you do or your clients, it is your comrades here that the, you know, two second interaction that you have with somebody in the hallway or, you know, is vital, is how you feel?

IG: 1:02:06
Yeah, I-I could not agree with you more. And these interactions may be even more important for young people, you know, whose world is. You know, I well, I mean, I remember that in graduate school, my best education, my greatest education, was talking in a coffee house with my-

NF: 1:02:31
Sure.

IG: 1:02:31
-with my fellow-

NF: 1:02:32
Sure, Hmm-mm.

IG: 1:02:33
-students. So, do you have any- well, what were, for example, we can expand on this, what were the most important less, what was the most important lesson in your life? I mean, this is, this is sort of answering the question that you have just answered is

NF: 1:03:01
Not answered. [laughs]

IG: 1:03:03
You cannot answer it.

NF: 1:03:04
No. Did not I not answer it?

IG: 1:03:06
You did. You did. So, this is, this is not a question that we need to ask. So do you have any concluding remarks, any words of wisdom that you want to impart to our students, anything that you have not said.

NF: 1:03:32
Well, I think yes, I would say that in the midst of your most industrious work when you are at the height of your career and apparently overwhelmed by the amount of work you seem to need to do, you have to have some other outlet, something that interests you, whether it be reading a book or taking a photograph or playing tennis or something, has to intercede in the times of stress. I do not believe in stress, so let us take the word out of it in times when you are busiest and most focused, I think you need to unfocus.

IG: 1:04:26
I think you are right. I think you are right. Well, thank you very much.

NF: 1:04:32
Just add one thing that I forget that have mentioned when I was in the twilight of my career, somebody from Harpur called and asked if I would be interested in not entertaining, but having a student from the college who was interested in potentially going into medicine. Would I mind if they came to the office? Had watched me work, and I-

IG: 1:05:07
It is really good idea.

NF: 1:05:08
I did that for a couple of years, and had a wonderful time. Just wonderful. The students had a wonderful time. And I did too, because it was like, invigorating.

IG: 1:05:20
Right.

NF: 1:05:21
You know, because it again. One, you are doing something, I think that is useful. But two, it is teaching. And teaching the young is just a wonderful thing.

IG: 1:05:39
It is, it is, even when you were young and you are teaching.

NF: 1:05:44
Yes-yes-yes.

IG: 1:05:45
It is still a wonderful thing. It is still a wonderful thing. So, I think that we can conclude our conversation, and I thank you very much for a content full discussion, something to-

NF: 1:06:07
Thank you.

IG: 1:06:08
Thank you for-

(End of Interview)

Irene Gashurov

1962

Dr. Neal M. Friedberg

Neal retired in 2018 from his 49-year practice as a physician-hematologist in New York City.

Audio

Harpur College – Sixities alumni; Harpur College – Alumni in New York City

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Harpur College – Sixities alumni; Medical school; Hematology; Civil rights; Anti-war Movement; Student life; Retirement activities