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Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. 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Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Warski, John Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Politylo, Nettie Date of Interview 1977-11-16 Collection Broome County Oral History Project Date of Digitization 2016-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 31:22 Minutes ; 26:42 Minutes ; 4:42 Minutes Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56047">Interview with John Warski</a> Subject LCSH Warski, John -- Interviews; Austria; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Jessup (Pa.); Endicott (N.Y.); Immigrants -- Interviews; Carpenters -- Interviews; Endicott Johnson Corporation -- Employees -- Interviews; House construction Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: John Warski Sr. Interviewed by: Nettie Politylo Date of interview: 16 November 1977 Nettie: This is Nettie Politylo, interviewer, talking to John Warski Sr. of Cafferty Hill Rd., Endicott, New York on Nov. 16, 1977. Mr. Warski let us start at the beginning when you arrived in America. John: I came this country–-Beginning from little boy, something. Nettie: Yes, you can start at that time. John: Well when I was a little boy I was interested little bit in carpentry job. We had a little farm, not much. I can't make a living from that, my father dead in job, what they call Carpo now, he go to work over there they been 1907. Nettie: You came to this country in 1907? John: Yes I come in 1907. I come to this country in 1907. My father go to work over there and they kill him in job. I comes over here landed go through Bremen, Germany and landed in Baltimore. From Baltimore they bring us grandchildren, four or five, six people together they come to Pennsylvania, Olyphant. Nettie: Excuse me, did you come to Baltimore by train or boat? John: Oh, we came by boat—ship. Nettie: Did you go to Ellis lsland first? John: No, Baltimore they got Casa Garda in building. New York is different what they call Casa Garda, Baltimore is different. Comes over here brings in May 1907. We go together to Olyphant—those people they have father and cousin over there but I have address to my cousin in the Jessup next place over there. They get out of Olyphant. I go out with them too. I don't know nothing too much about it…how it goes. They go find those people their cousin and when they found out so I get different address I not belong to them. I take a walk about one mile from Olyphant they show me where to go up to Jessup. When I come to the Jessup I walk by the railroad tracks come to Jessup and sit on the bench between the bushes and grass—been thinking—what am I going to do? What am I going to ask for? You know what it is. Then I see man walking by the railroad track inspect the track they got hammer and wrench. I look over there well recognize he been from my village, he work on that track over there. He look on me that I sit over there he don't know me—he know me old country all right been me—been working for the priest been neighbor of the priest. Then after while he looked willow and I starting to call the name Mike! Mihal! Mihal! See I don't know the language, nothing. He stop, look, look stop and start to go again…I start holler again to by the name—he start I started to come to him and he started to come to me, we get together just been in front house where he been living—he rented house by the tracks. I told him who I am—he been surprised what I doing over here. I explain that few people they take up in Olyphant but my address been over here—they tell me to use what got address—I had address fellow been my mother's sister's husband his name Orayko. Well then comes there he takes me in a house he been married been village across river just like Susquehanna that woman been come from there… Well I take wash up every morning come from old country they have to wash themselves wash—all kinds of people, you know. She give me eat this, this. After while that cousin I have address to him he come from work. He live same house just other people rented boarding over there. When they come from work he find out I was over there and he come to me started to talk this, that—then he go to store, buy me some clothing—little bit cheap clothing so—I don't have just—what I had on myself, some shoes like that. Then in about 2 days he ask the boss about the job for me for the breaker, breaker that big building—so breaked the dumped coal in big lumps and when they break in pieces they screen it—they call it breaker, coal breaker. I get a job over there to pick slate—see they got of place. Sitting over there they keep the hands down—chute go down got little bench—piece board over there they keep their feet like that when (pold) roll down—see something—try they got another chute for the rock. I work there 10 hours a day I think so 9 hours a day. $1.00 on a day, yeah. I been working for little while and I ask that cousin, I come to him—figure like same job only different factory—dumped different type of rock. I ask him been needed man for the driver up the colander dump where they dump all rock they give me that job over there for the driver. I been working over there two to three years, maybe 2 years I don't know something like that before I started again to pick slate. I don't know how long that happened maybe one year something like that—I changed the jobs so on the rock. Then after while I don’t know how long I work the breaker burned down. No job. Been working at home. I have to do something. I have two guys been working in a paper mill near Watertown, Dexter, New York near Canada. I wrote a letter and they tell me come on up and maybe you will get a job there. So I come and two days later over there I look around I come later—I had friends and they take me on the board from my village and I wrote to him. I get up in the morning been living by the paper mill, by the factory. I just go there look it over how they make the paper so interesting. I asked them first should can I go inside—yeah, you go in there—nobody bother you. Take a look inside the shop. Then I saw some kind of guy—sport— well find out he been superintendent of that shop. He talk to me and asked—well that happened later, he talked to me and make ask—"You look for job?" Yeah. “Well come afternoon sometime tell me sometime in afternoon, then you come get your job.” I said, all right. Well then he go for a little while, well, half hour—well you better start tomorrow morning. All right—I come tomorrow morning ask—he look, look on me and don't say nothing. I ask him for what happened to my job you promised me yesterday? “Oh! I forgot it—” Well he give job to work down in the basement with water been in machine, lots to explain. Then after while l work I don't know how long I work, I been interesting been recognizing the building the fireman. I like look lots time how they work—Italian Jew boss engage on the boiler, that's all. Just the boss. Then I ask if you remember get the job get another boss in the same company, see. This factory where I go different building. They give me job, said you take the job if you want it. Well then—I want to wheel coal or ashes from the boiler—see they push cart inside boiler, they got regular tracks, open door coal run down, sometimes fireman when visit somebody gets close to boiler, if far away have shovel to them. Then clean fire, put ashes on pile—I have to take the wheelbarrow, my job to wheel like on a dump, other side of boiler. Then I work while I plan how the fireman throw the coal, how they look interesting. Then after a while been chance I ask the boss, I like fireman head per man—headman run all the business and helper get busy, too, work to do. Then after while chance coming somebody quit, something like that, they give me job, helper. I started fireman, started fireman work for little while, I don't know how long, I can't explain, never keep track of maybe year or something like that they been fireman, head man quit. They give me job—head man. So I have to know what start water pump, fill those tanks have outside the hill—they got lots of things, you know. They got to take care of boiler, clean the boiler inside. Every Sunday, I take every second Sunday you got to got go inside the boiler, drain water out, coal out, put cold water something like that… I been thinking this way—Well little while—two guys they telling that paper mill over there—they been working there—they quit—work Bridgeport, Conn.—Bridgeport, Conn.—the shipyard work. They wrote the letter—I think so I going to try it—maybe I'll get a job. I quit over there and go to Bridgeport, Conn. Well, I find some Russian lady from Russia, they board over there—I find board. Next day so I go to shipyards, well, when I come over there, there is a line people that with the tools, everything, carpenter, short wait for the job. Boss coming in the line just take maybe one or two, call us— look what he got, this and that and after while said—no job no more. Everybody pick up tools, mad, swear like hell. (chuckle) Well, I go out—he never ask me even and I go home where I been boarding over there—I think so no use staying over here. Might as well go back to Dexter. When I come back I remember it was like Decoration Day, I see it in Bridgeport—make the parade on Decoration Day. See I don't know what it been, I just know it was Decoration Day. And I come back to Dexter—I ask for job—they give me job for the other boiler room. The company have lot of factory not so far—maybe good size—the block away. They make a clear type of paper—the other one they make a rough paper—something like that. They give me the job for the helper—they wheel coal, yes, that's right, wheel coal just the same thing like before and said you going to get chance you going to get that job. And so some guy somebody going to quit job, helper, been quit, he don't want to work or something I don't know—he put me like helper. That fireman I before work in coal little bit I have change fireman sitting I took the shovel and I throw it, coal, shut the doors, I train myself. He show me how. He like me and he do something so he talked to night watchman been German ‘cause change every week, different shift, one week daytime and one week night time. He told something against those helpers say he don't want to work don't care much to working so he put me on there. One time the helper no come no more, they get fired. I don't know anyhow he no come no more. Last time I work with the helper, last time I work with the helper then those firemen get sick or something, I get head fireman. I been work 2 years or something like that. One time I get argument with the boss with the boiler room, ah, Jessup on account of big pipe—lift those clinkers what they call them they get banded too much to explain—I have on my mind to quit. To come to Endicott—then I quit them over there—I came to Endicott. In Endicott I got work with that carpenter. I don't know his name forgot his name he used to build those Burt Building contractor. So before that he work on houses living by the river, Susquehanna, few houses. After while we started build house get contract to build Cibulsky on Rogers Ave. See The Endicott Lumber Box Co. Make the contract The Box Co. make the contract on Saturday and about middle week U.S. declare war for the Germany. Nettie: What year was that? John: Oh, old country, yeah, U.S. declare war and they just start war business. Then I get job right away with the Box Co. He give me work he give me job carpenter so I work with Cibulsky house, Shefchuk house, and Prosmans… Besides working on other houses way up on other houses where the park (possibly Rabble Ave) pausing—thinking….That all right all right—somebody start talking about IBM—IBM they had just only had one building from that time had little building—supposed to be call ITR. I just try for the luck, so might get it job there. I ask for carpenter job there because IBM make clocks there. I go to office ask them there said maybe you get job but boss on vacation. Come back. You take the job, take anything to get inside, before boss come maybe they could show you job you ask for. I take the job where some kind of parts on machine on little machine they bend it you know. Work a little while then move (spare)—so IBM soon gonna pretty soon close it you know—no business—IBM—no IBM but I—well—Think so like that so I go to EJ—tannery. Before that I worked in the tannery too—forgot to mention see. But I get back the same job in tannery. Little by little IBM started to build up—but that too late. Nettie: Who was your boss in the Tannery? John: Where, EJ? Griffis just name I forgot but been old man but his son been boss too, foreman Lee Griffis I guess, I think so Lee. I work little while there sometime dinnertime had chance to go to boiler room over there to look around—I interesting in the fireman—all the time. I go over there to look around—been short U.S. take all men then for the war. Already they have been short. Asked boss about the job. He said here take this job, maybe few days, maybe so wheel ashes and coal and then I put you for regular fireman—they fire by the shovel at the time then after while they those put automatically. Then I started to work later two days or few weeks I don't know in the boiler room, one time I get sick a little bit—this had flu—start people get the flu— Nettie: Is that the influenza? John: Yes influenza, yes. I don't come to work—nobody been tell the boss, so I no show up—I been living at that new houses on Rogers Ave. See he come in the house—boss engineer room engine and the boiler, forgot his name. And said what is the matter? You sick? Yeah, feel been sick little bit not much well feel little bit. He said please if you can come to work—ain't got no men—all men been over there they take in the army be working on that job. Next day I come back to work. I came to work. I come back back to work until war was over. War was over that man on his job come back and put that man on his job on my place. They put me wheeling coal. I don't want it. Wheeling coal, I quit. I quit and then after a while I did not know what I did. Nettie: After the boys came back from service? John: From service yeah, same fella, they got job back. Nettie: So where did you work? John: I can remember—I guess I work spare time, carpenter and you know lots of steam heat-plumbing but I know little bit. Then I forget the track where I work. Nettie: Where did you live? Did you live with Cibulsky?  John: Yeah, I boarded up to Cibulsky—yeah—then war over—about year or year a half something like that—I take my wife over here and I move it up stairs—remember? Nettie: Yeah. John: I renter up there. Nettie: Your wife came from Europe. Did you get married here or over there? John: Ha! I got married in the old country. In old country before they said maybe I come second time over here—I forgot to mention—see when I come at 22 years—happen have 3 classes to join the army—Austria—I come from Austria. But then, after a while Poland taken—taken that—wife come from Poland because they Polish people, their country. So, I suppose to come before draft, last time, third time, two time no pass but third time pass—if no pass—you can marry—been low all the time. I couldn't come before third—finish it. They draft me to Army—Austria—well no call me—well I come I have to report to village right away. Next day I wait for call—they call me next year for doctor's like that. Nettie: You were in America when they called you? John: Over there old country. When time times got letter to go to doctor—to visit—they draft me that time and in fall or beginning spring. In the Fall they call me to doctor—to army. I been in army 12 months, no 12 weeks—you know why—the other way be 3 years. I make claim exemption—what they call—I make support—mother—They had village secretary they have to care few villages like that—she got voice—"a pull"—yeah, a pull—you just have to go for the training—something if happen bad you have to go just the same. They gave me release. When I come back—I marry after. I leave wife 9 months. Nettie: Then you came with Mrs. Warski to Endicott—is that right? Mrs. Warski and you came back to Endicott after married in Europe? John: Come to Rogers Ave. Nettie: How did you find the village there—not many houses in Endicott or buildings? John: Well, Cibulsky’s—North Side—no be many. Nettie: How about downtown, fire station—on Washington Ave.? John: They have State Bank—fire station—Endicott Trust Co.—fireman—fire— Nettie: Did they have many stores on Washington Ave.? John: When I come from Binghamton on a train—come from old country second time—I be mention to go back to paper mill—remember—yeah, after while I have little little argument with boss so I quit. I have in mind to come over here—I came to Binghamton—from Binghamton take street car to Endicott to Cibulsky’s—living up there. The street car—I told you I go old country back. In street car nothing—just street car—farms, farms, nothing—Johnson City—just little bit houses. I come to Endicott some places—lots of many have sidewalks from the boards—some places have no sidewalks, at all—No (greens). Come to Cibulsky’s rented house on Odell Ave.—they use have Greek Ice cream parlor, Trubach—they make a suit. Cibulsky—I lived up there—kitchen upstairs and two small rooms—Schuler live been with wife, have kids already—John been already there. (Chuckling) They put couch in the kitchen by the stove—he sleeping there, Cibulsky. When I got job with carpenter—I make in few different places—you know, Burt Store—you know they started before I worked there. Then we start talking about houses—Cibulsky, she say, “John, please talking maybe built house because he go away and spend money all the time.” “All right, I gonna try.” One time I talk to him, I say you make house, that no good. Well, if you want I help you. I told him—maybe give him money—I did not mention I gonna borrow money—but I help you. Then we start talk ‘bout plans and houses and lot. No place to build house. He work in Calfskin Tannery that time—I work in boiler room—no, I don't yet—that all right—I don't work in EJ yet—I work in Box Co. building houses—he said he didn't want go go to Sales Building to lawyer asking about lot—give it free. Nettie: Gave lots to workers free? John: Yeah. Sure! Well he says he don't want to go—just told me—just go take a lot—ask for lot. I go and they never ask me, “you work over here or not?” No lawyer ask me. They give me lot by the lot by the Miszaks—Squires Ave… When we start making contract—Box Co. ask for the lot. We give them deed told them where that lot is—he go Sales Building—Box Co. after we come back—later we get letter that lot somebody use it—ain't got no lot. They make plans for house already—just to build the house. They go ask Sales Building to ask to give you another lot. I go Sales Building—I told him—I told him something like that—you give lot to somebody else. They give Rogers Ave—They say Warski, you want that—that is the only place on all Rogers Ave.—they have no sewer but pretty soon they have sewers. We take that where house stands and they start to build that house and I get that job over there—I ask them—I work over there on that house. Nettie: When did you work in the tannery—after you built houses? John: Yeah, after while when they finish the building—something—Box Co. don't have no job—stop the building—so I go to tannery. Then I get fireman that man after while that man come from—I take his place—here I mentioned before. Well I go take—he take—to my job on machine inside tannery. Well, I work until—all you know how it happened—cut out—closed—no more tannery, there. Nettie: No more tannery? What? John: IBM they got.  Nettie: Now, but am I talking about before that?  John: I working ‘til pretty soon near finish—I go to retire—before— Nettie: Before you retired, you did not finish telling me about the time before you were building houses, all? When did your wife come— John: After that? Came from Europe.  Nettie: And you had your own home on Roosevelt Ave? John: My wife come in Rogers Ave. We live it already there—I rent upstairs and I paid board downstairs. Then I tell been in the hall—my wife—we live during winter time, we don't want to move it—people, see, I gonna move it out in spring, this people move out and I move it upstairs. Nettie: Did you have electricity, then, in the house? John: In Rogers Ave.—yes and then when I live it with Cibulsky come late—this and this—I don't want to talk over there about it—you know how it is—decided might as well build own house, have lot already. I hire contractor, dig cellar, put concrete wall, (petition), everythings I do myself, not myself, Cibulsky help me. Somebody else, somebody—some friend help me, plasterman—I have electricity, too well, all finishing work inside I do myself. I work in tannery, night time. Spare time I work house myself. I have no electricity that time like Rogers Ave. Nettie: What did you use for electricity? John: I use, borrow Pizur lamp go fishing before I get my electric. Then I put plumbing heat myself, some little help, myself. Nettie: What church did you attend? John: Well when I comes over to Endicott they have no church, they have Roman Catholic, I been board with Slavic people and they belong that Slavic church and she started, the lady, “What doncha come—to one time—big bunch of men go Sunday church.” Well, we say we try the church—we understand nothing—I do what they do, that's all. We come to here in Binghamton we go to Baxter Street one time and then I come to Endicott—they have there Cibulsky, was there—I started to go Endicott church.  Nettie: Many families or very few familes when you went there? John: Those (Hrodenski) they no like - you know. Nettie: Where they Carpo-Russians? John: No—from Russia—those from Hrodenski gubernia—no can explain—they don't like to go church much and they—we—mostly mostly those (oohorski)—Carpo-Russians—they ruin that church that time—the be boss that church that time—they after while they split. They call meeting, lawyer come, they make a splitting, they have 4 or 5 lots where school is—front of church and half cemetery—they’re take those lots. Nettie: Who took the lots? John: The Carpatho-Russians. See, they have safe—the Carpatho-Russians—those oohorski—like this something—they, Russian put make red ink. Nettie: When do they mean red mark? John: They mark something difference—last heard that, I never see that—they no explain they go to court, supposed to be go to court. That time, Russian priest been Borisoff—he had safe, small safe, in church now. He knows lock in safe and book, Bible, book record, by law. Nettie: Book of By-Laws? John: Yes, he look everything been side—Carpatho-Russian this side no good. Something like that. Take that book—destroy it—that priest—put someplace in the fire. They changed lock in safe and when come open it—you want to open it—try open—they open—they can't open—the leaders—they take those safe to court and courtroom open safe to show proof who boss. (Chuckling) And when come to court, open safe—hire somebody—I never been there—I don't know—then open it, was been surprised—nothing there—they find no record—no record—given to Russian—got be Russian, go away somewhere. After a while got to take safe back to church—I got motorcycle, side car, I take the safe in sidecar. Nettie: Did you put the safe in sidecar? John: I put safe in sidecar and was so heavy that pressed down and take back house. Nettie: Church was built—did they say—about monks built the church? John: Build church, like mostly cheap way, like shack, plaster like that—they don't have nothing much—have have (prestol)—built from the boxes like that—(this part in Russian—translation) lector reads below—the priest Rashtakoff had a book on instructions—he read up on it which told how the altar table should be built. That is difficult—this way, this way, put the top on (ha! ha!) make something like this—then monks hire from monastery—they build the bell and iconostasis—the iconostasis they build but posts—suppose to be—they make different—they have saw and hammer they got—they hire 2 men from Binghamton to make—do that—iconostasis—they just make post—no tsarski dverior royal doors—just opening—then I—left—they left—no finish, complain, don't make no money. Then I think to myself—I make the tsarski dveri—royal doors in garage Rogers Ave. Those posts—come plaster paris—those posts come—they design—they have to make hollow—that caps—lots of work—bottom have to be filled—inside cap hollow—some kind fit to even up—take time. Then I look around—new church—not much old church—repairs—bell—leaking around closet— Nettie: What year new church started? John: I think 1914—1916 been already. Nettie: When you talk of your house, how much to build your house fifty years ago? John: I never keep track because I do work myself—somebody help me—little bit I make checks to pay for material—just like that—pay cash—never keep track—never bother to keep track. One time have time to figure how much cost—I lost and forgot about it. Nettie: How many children did you have? John: Three children. When retire from EJ—66 years—I work—wait when my wife get pension—65 years old. Nettie: Did your wife work? John: No, she work in house—she get half—I had 66 years—77—89 years now. Nettie: After your wife died then you sold your home? John: I live there pretty near 10 years alone—sold 2 years ago. Nettie: Do you live with your son and daughter in law at present? John: Yes. Nettie: Were you glad you came here instead of living in Europe? John: I was glad to be get here what I have there—I got to work for somebody else just like I get eat twice a day—and 30 and 40 cents a daytime. Just like I come first like come go back to old country before—I try it I make one of those carpenter job business, in the house. I figure I work on the land for somebody—I want to make some money. Nettie: Where, here or there? John: Here. And where (spotty) work—I make those furniture—somebody in village give me make table, bed anything like that. I had neighbor work wagon make wheel—wagon—they call it—he know I handy—he need help. He said learn those things. He been good mechanic—hell of lot better than I, needs work on wagon—business then make table something, like that. Better come to help me—3 years—learn make wheel. Nettie: Like an apprentice? John: Yeah. This is better—you make table—something like that—he had store—little store, too—had a farm—little big farm—he can get—take so many jobs—he good mechanic—want to push for that thing it away—people waiting for—You learn it. You have better trade. Then I get neighbor—about block away—when come to work, eat sleep that's all—all right. I have my own bench. When I come to this country—I have been—brothers—they have somebody use—they need repair I make them new one—make new one—sometimes old one they throw away—bench take his house—he got his own if he have time—he got to work on farm—I come—first he show me—he give me job with a knife—to make a spoke. First thing plane on one end—scrape—then round it—give me—came from the farm—he been working farm. Well how wheels you make it on farm—look it over—I just finish it—look it over—I just been finish and he look over and said, “By gosh, you been make than I.” Then—this, this. I stay 3 months—finish my job—times come—I learn my job—I had just time—times come in—I go this country—have no change to work. Besides here I travel, Bridgeport. I forgot to mention—I don't like that job—I can't get into shipyards. I forget—I take walk in street—see sign “Wheel Wright”—make wagon repair. Like that sometime horses pull wagon—wheel go broke—take shop and repair it. They was one German and one Irish. I look them over—there they make ‘em body, first body they see just body of bus—school drived kids—before like taxi—bodies make there—Slovak work there on this body—Body like bus—like delivery—bus big one. We started talking with Slovak we mention—he asked me who I am—explain—what I did old country—this—this we need men like you over here—other man fixed wheel—sometimes broken wheel—sometimes he come to work and sometimes not. Those boss want to push him out but he afraid to push him out because no replace it—used to be got different job—see—like a regular school bus. Say, “Who want to take that job?” Said different work like old country but I fix you up—I show you—it easy—all right—you got a job. Come tomorrow—I have no clothes for that job—I loan you—you buy some. When I came those men no show up—get drunk—they never come. l work about 1 month—have no place to board—sleep like dog—any place—I no like it—I quit. I don’t want—I can’t eat, got to restaurant—something like that went—so many people in Bridgeport because they shipyard—so many workers over there. They say—I tell Slovak—try again—make me restaurant—boarding house—something like that—I take the boarding house—I have nothing left for me. What have nothing pay? I quit. I tell the boss—and he say, “MMMMMMMMMMMM—if I knew—I fire those men—what am I going to do now?” (Chuckle) Then I quit, go back to paper mill. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with John Warski Subject The topic of the resource Warski, John -- Interviews; Austria; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Jessup (Pa.); Endicott (N.Y.); Immigrants -- Interviews; Carpenters -- Interviews; Endicott Johnson Corporation -- Employees -- Interviews; House construction Description An account of the resource John Warski talks about his interest in carpentry as a young boy after emigrating to the U.S. in 1907 from Austria, and going to Jessup, PA. He describes finding his way in a new country on his own and finding working in the boiler room at a factory where he shoveled coal into the boiler. He tells of leaving to go work in Endicott as a carpenter, and later at Endicott Johnson. He also discusses building his home. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 62 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/6c3a5911be311ee7d89e4358271ce49f.m4a 80c9c9d748b5d9bf8b9d4788e565d48f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Weaver, Helene Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Dobandi, Susan Date of Interview 1978-03-20 Collection Broome County Oral History Project Date of Digitization 2016-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 13:25 Minutes Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56052">Interview with Helene Weaver</a> Subject LCSH Weaver, Helene -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Binghamton (N.Y.); Johnson City (N.Y.); Endicott Johnson Corporation -- Employees -- Interviews; Volunteers; Retired Senior Volunteer Program (U.S.); United Way of America; House of the Good Shepherd; Broome County Office for Aging Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Helene Weaver Interviewed by: Susan Dobandi Date of Interview: 20 March 1978 Susan: Mrs. Weaver, could you tell us a little something about your early beginnings, your recollection of your childhood, where you were born, what your parents did and that sort of thing? Helene: Well, I was born in Binghamton on Miles Street in the year of 1897 and a my father and mother parted when I was very young and then he had a business in a what was called Lestershire and a he remarried and I lived with—in Lestershire and I had a stepmother who was very good to me and a all her—she was a family of ten children and a I thought a great deal of my aunts and uncles and my father had a business for a good many years. He had to run a meat market in Johnson—in Lestershire and then it was changed to Johnson City in about 1916 I think. And I left school the third year of high school and went to work in a E-J office and while I was there they changed the name from Lestershire to Johnson City and then they christened a boat down in New York—Johnson City and I was one of the delegates to go. There was a delegate from each department E-J's that was taken and there was the ones by Mr. George F. & Mr. Harry L. took the second ones—the second highest and we went to New York and christened this boat. Had a wonderful time. (chuckle) There was a four of us girls together and we had—we didn't get any sleep all the time we were gone because we were having such a wonderful time and I worked until I was married. Then in 1920 and a we had—we were—we were buying an E-J home and when the home was finished we went housekeeping. Susan: Do you recall how much you paid for that home? Helene: $4,000—$4,000 and each month—yes you paid your rent—you paid some on your principal. Well, we—we a lived there 7 years and a my daughter was born in 1927 and in 1928 we sold our home and moved to Binghamton because my husband’s work was in Binghamton then and he had been an E-J worker and then he was working for Crowley Milk Co. is why we moved to Binghamton and he worked there two or three years and then he was—he went to work for Stow Mfg. He worked there ‘til he died in 1955 and a well my father sold his business the year I was married and he retired and he died in 1954. He would have been 83 years old in about two months and he died. (clears throat) Pardon me, then a—and then after my husband died I went to work at the House of the Good Shepherd. I had charge of the dining room and I worked there 4 years and then I retired at 62—and then I was a—they called me in for extra work whenever they needed me and then I knew some different people that they needed some help with meals and I used to go out and help them with their meals and do little things for people and then I took care of my grandson which was—he was born in 1956. I took care of my grandson and did this work and took care of my own home all at the same time and a I had a couple roomers in my home. They helped me with my rent and a then after my grandson was big enough so he could be left—I didn't do that anymore and then about 1965 I stopped doing any work for money and I moved here in the highrise in ‘68 and I got into the—into different things into volunteer work when they started the a Serve the ones that started the volunteer work and I worked for them until the R.S.V.P. took it over and I worked—I worked at the hospital every other week for 7 years and I have worked at the United Way for volunteer work and I have worked for the Office for the Aging and I worked for the A.O.P. Office, The Lawyers Reference and I was a cashier for the nutrition sight at the Y.W. for oh 6 years and a I've had to give it up because I didn't feel able to get back and forth to—to the project and I—the highrise I—I came in here when the apartment was brand new and I have been very happy here and it has given me more a chance to get to meet people and get out to do things and gives me something to occupy my time and help others and a I don't know as I know of anything more that I can tell you unless you have any questions you'd like to ask. Susan: Mrs. Weaver, could we go back a little bit and a tell us a what life was like in Lestershire when you were a little girl growing up and the changes that you have seen in the community since the early days? Helene: Well, when I was growing up it was—it's Johnson City now—but it was then Lestershire and I went to the Hudson Street school and I left my third year high school and went to work in E.J. office but when I was small I had cousins and we—we a had a big family and we were always together. The family was always together. We had good times and a if we wanted to amuse ourselves we had popcorn or pulled taffy or—or something like that we would play the piano and sing and we weren't allowed out at night until I think the curfew rang at 9 o'clock and we were supposed to be in by 9 o'clock and I can remember when if I was up to my cousins’ and I didn't get started home quickly enough and the curfew rang I was scared to death for fear the policeman would pick me up (chuckle) but I never did get picked up but a I always tried to be home. My folks were very strict with me and they tried to give me a good home and I had to mind my parents and I was taught that I shouldn't tell stories—tell fibs and not to lie and I should—should be kind to people and well as I say the—the a those times were so different from now I think but we thought nothing of it. I think that we were happier in our younger days than some of the young people now because before they’re 12 years old they've seen and had everything and we didn't. We went gradually getting things and so that when—and when we grew up there was still more things to take up our mind and our time and to for our enjoyment and a I was brought up to go to church and Sunday school and I thought I couldn't ever miss that was—that was one thing I didn't think I could miss prayer meeting or church or anything. I was brought up to live that way and a then when I worked in the E-J office I worked 10 hours a day 5 days a week that was from 7 to 6 and then on Saturday from 7 ‘til 5 and I got $8.50 a week and I thought I was rich (chuckle) and I gave my people $5.00 a week for my room and board and I used to think that well I was being punished that way but as I grew older I realized that my folks wanted me to know the responsibilities of handling money which I am very thankful for now and a I enjoyed working in this office there was about 50 girls in the office where I worked and I had—I did different jobs. I learned different things. I never was a bookkeeper or anything like that but I did—I did filing and I did orders and I did sample work. They made out samples with shoes and a I used to help on the inventory and when the First World War—I went out in the factories and sold Liberty bonds and I did I don't remember how many I sold at the time but I did very well. I did very well at that time. And a now that I see that E-J's have gone I—I feel very sad at times to think that E-J factories are not working anymore because they did so much for Binghamton, Endicott and Johnson City and a George F. built the libraries and started the libraries and the dinners for people to eat—where they could go eat and they did so much for us and we had our E-J Chorus. I was in that some of the time and a but as I say it makes me feel very sad when I go down to Johnson City which I was down there a couple weeks ago and I see how Johnson City looked it just made me sick. I just said to my sister, “Oh I can't imagine what's ever happened to Johnson City.” But I think it’s just the idea that E-J's have just gone out because the Johnsons are all gone practically and a so though the times have changed so well I'm glad that I'm my younger days were filled with the way they were rather than the times now. I think that my life was—I've had a very sheltered life really because when I hear the things that go on that I never knew existed before and I'm glad that I never did know cause I don't like the thoughts like that (chuckle) so I guess that's about all I can tell you right off hand now of what happened. Susan: Thank you very much Mrs. Weaver, it's been very nice talking with you. Helene: Did I do all right? Susan: Fine. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Helene Weaver Subject The topic of the resource Weaver, Helene -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Binghamton (N.Y.); Johnson City (N.Y.); Endicott Johnson Corporation -- Employees -- Interviews; Volunteers; Retired Senior Volunteer Program (U.S.); United Way of America Description An account of the resource Helene Weaver talks about her childhood in Binghamton, NY, her father's meat market in Johnson City. She worked in an office at Endicott Johnson until she married. After her husband died Helene finds employment with the House of the Good Shepherd, in charge of the dining room. After retiring she volunteered at organizations such as, RSVP, United Way, and Office for Aging. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 63 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/1a6b3a1fc4fb3e45eeee0a1ea4f14205.m4a a5d10e9b168478abf7d6e2d2d51e5f0d Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Woodward, Shirley Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Wood, Wanda Date of Interview 1978-08-16 Collection Broome County Oral History Project Date of Digitization 2016-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 48:32 Minutes Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56055">Interview with Shirley Woodward</a> Subject LCSH Woodward, Shirley -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Historians -- Interviews; American Revolution Bicentennial, 1976; Town of Maine (N.Y.) Historian; Nanticoke Valley Historical Society; Broome County Historian Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Shirley Woodward Interviewed by: Wanda Wood Date of interview: 16 August 1978 Wanda: This is Wanda Wood interviewing Mrs. Shirley Woodward, Town of Maine Historian, in her home at Union Center and the date is the 16th of August, 1978. Shirley, why don't we start at the beginning and find out where you were born and how long you have lived in this town here, etc.? Shirley: Well you may wonder about that because I was born in Florida, Gainesville, Florida. My father was a teacher, university teacher, and for three years he taught in the Univesity of Florida and I happened to be born in Florida. But he actually is from upstate New York, went to Syracuse University and taught there and then came back—after I was born—they came back and taught there for a while—and now lives in Auburn. Runs a museum there, he’s a historian, he was historian for Cayuga County for 25 years. He's retired. So—a I met my husband at Cornell and that's how I came down here, after we were married I came to this area. His family is old pioneer settlers. They came in 1800s to settle—one of them 1794 to this area. Wanda: In the Town of Maine? Shirley: Umhmm. Town of Maine in Union Center. This half of Union Center is in the Town of Maine. So—that’s how I came here. Wanda: So you had a pretty good—a background for—a developing this interest in historical things. Shirley: I guess so. I grew up in a museum, you might say. Our life revolved around a museum… historical…artistic and facts in the museum. And—a well I'm trying to think when I got started in history down here. That's another story, too. When our first child was born I was given a little baby book and in the baby book here's a part in the middle of it says: Parents, Grandparents, Great-grandparents. So l started to fill his out and as I was talking with various relatives and they would tell me about their parents and their grandparents, it just, I guess you'd say the bug bit me. (laughter). From there on I couldn't stop. And so I got into his genealogy dealing and of course being history, interested in history… The previous town historian here in Maine was a cousin of—a Gordon's mother and he was an elderly gentleman. Wanda: And what was his name? Shirley: Ollie Ketchum. Oliver, they called him Ollie. Oliver Ketchum. They lived right in the village of Maine and he had all the information right in his head. Anybody wanted to know anything, they'd just go talk to him and he would know everything and he was in his 80s or 90s when he died, and they were looking around for a new historian and Dr. (Clement) Bowers, who lived up in Maine at that time, happened to be a great friend of my father’s and he knew that I came from a historical family, I guess, and he knew I was interested and, I, of course, was going to the historical society meetings in Binghamton and I knew him there, so he…suggested my name. That was way back in early sixties. It was either ‘60 or ‘61, I’ve been historian that long. But I had to start from scratch, because there were no records. Wanda: Oh, the man had kept it all in his head! Shirley: They were kept…all in his head, uh huh. Yeah. Well— Wanda: —wasn't much of a help to you, was it? Shirley: No, but it's been fun collecting…and people give things to me and they will go either in the historian's office or in the new historical building. You know we have a historical society here in the Town of Maine called the Nanticoke Valley Historical Society and we've bought a house and fixing it up…should be open either this fall or surely by next spring…it will be open. And so a lot of the artifacts that have been given to me will probably go there. The—a documents and historical things pertaining to the town and its development along with the town historian's office which will be in the new town building when they build it. Wanda: Ohh, that won't be connected with the, historical… Shirley: No. Actually they're two different things. That's where the town historian has to be very careful of things pertaining to the town and the development of the town that are given to them as town historians go into town records and the historical society usually collects artifacts. Now a town historian does not collect chairs and plows and spinning wheels and things like that. That is the historical society’s business. Wanda: They're two separate entities. Shirley: Yes. And like the town historian does not collect genealogies of the town people because this, these are the people that lived in the town; this would go in the town historical society. Wanda: Then your main duties are collecting records, actually. Shirley: Town records, yes, and caring for the town records. Wanda: But anything you might collect, that would go to… Shirley: That would go to the historical society, like an artifact. Like if somebody gave me—a an old spinning wheel or something. This would go to the historical society because this has nothing to do with town records, but is something they want to keep in the town and, and they want to donate it. Now this is, you have to be very careful. Wanda: It's good that you have… Shirley: Oh, there's a line there. Wanda: …a cooperative feeling between the two of you. Shirley: Some town historians, everything they get goes right to the historical society or it goes right to the town and the first thing you know the town has got a, a museum in its town building and that's…unless they really want it that way. In a rural town they could do it, but in our town we don't want that. We want it to be separated.  Wanda: But there's a lot of—a lot of history in the Town of Maine… Shirley: You have to work together. Oh surely, surely. You work together. Wanda: It's an old, old town for this section, isn't it? Sirley: Yeah. Umhmm, 1794...first settlers were in here. They came to Union Center here this—a right here…in Union Center in 1790 & ‘92. The first mill…right down there on the creek… right on the creek was built in ‘92. Wanda: Is that where the bar is now? The… Shirley: Oh, no, ahm— Wanda: …one by the bridge? Shirley: Oh, oh, the bar? (laughs) Where the bridge is. Wanda: Yeah. Shirley: Yeah. Wanda: That must have been where the mill was then? Shirley: Yeah. And there was a sawmill there and a grist mill…rake factory and they were all very a well, Brazil Howard ran them and a this is his table… Gordon's grandfather. That chair there is his. Wanda: Brazil? Shirley: Brazilai. Good Bible name. They called him Brazil, or they call him Zilla called him Zilla—Brazilai, that's an old, old Bible name. So, well, that's how I got started being town historian. Wanda: What do you actually have to do—what—I know you do a lot that isn't required— (laughter)—but what does a town historian have to do, by law? Shirley: It's just maintenance, or caring for the town records or any records or pictures, photographs and records—written records—pertaining to the town. And now with the newspapers and things, you collect articles from the newspaper and file them away in folders under their—a headings. Like churches would be in one folder and schools in another and highway development. If an old house is torn down you get a picture of the old house and there'll probably be a newspaper article. Things like this, but there's no rule that says that you have to write articles or write history, or—a in fact you don't even have to do genealogy or any of this type thing. You just do it because you like to. Wanda: You get hooked into it. Shirley: But it's just really…you, you maintain the records and possibly gather new records pertaining to the town, that's…when there's a special event in the town…newspaper write-up, why then you cut it out and file it away. Wanda: Now this is separate from the records that the clerk keeps, like births and deaths? Shirley: Oh yes. Those are vital records, they have nothing to do with the historian’s office. Wanda: Then your main interest is in—a genealogy, I gather. Shirley: Oh yes, starting way back with the little chart in the baby book. Yes, we've traced o family, Gordon's family, the immigrants, Mayflower.  Wanda: And you've been doing wonderful things for the county historian's office, too. Shirley: Oh yes, we've been… I've been indexing records—a there. Making them available… I mean, if somebody has to come from California, they've got three hours to spend. And it takes three hours to read one census if it's…just to find a family. It's, well it's time consuming. But if it's indexed and they can look in the index and, say their family's in a certain town, all they have to do is go right to that town and look, look at it 'n then they can copy the original record and that's it. Wanda: Then you get these records from what—cemeteries and clerks, town clerks and that sort of thing? Shirley: Well—a, now the county records would be the census records and the surrogate records and the deed records. These—a these are public property. In other words, I say public property, they're, people can go in and look at them and research 'em. The cemeteries—I have collected 'em because they are important, but they have nothing to do with being town historian or anything. It's—a the cemetery stones are there, you go to the cemetery associations and they have the records…hopefully. 'Course there's a lot of them that are no longer in existence and records are gone and—a… Wanda: But all this goes into that genealogical file… Shirley: This, then is genealogical—umhmm, and—a church records—you go in and copy out the names of people, when they joined the church, baptized, married, deaths. You go into the old newspapers, which are on file in the Binghamton library on microfilm or in the Endicott papers, you've got them in the Endicott library and you read the obituary notices and the marriages in these papers, that’s genealogical. you can read the papers and the histories. The papers then were just like they are now, they had the local history and they used to have columns…who would come visiting. They don't do that anymore in the papers, you know, and it's, it's really sad, 'cause to me that's what a newspaper is—your local history and so somebody's aunt and uncle from out west is visiting and, I mean, you may not see them, but it's nice to know they came and visited…and hundred years from now it gives you a clue as to… Wanda: Where they were at what time. Shirley: Yes. Yeah. Oh they're so valuable. Of course they have vital records now which they didn't have a hundred years ago and I suppose it isn't necessary anymore to read the newspapers to find out who, who is having a baby and who got married and—(laughs) Wanda: But think of all the leg work you save for people who are coming from far parts… Shirley: Well that's, that's the reason for doing it… Wanda: …and trying to find these records. Shirley: …that's part of my job, is helping people…find the material. And the best way to find it is by indexing. Wanda: When did you start? Did you start this genealogical file at the county historian's office? Did you start that work when you were county historian?  Shirley: No, no. I had these files started long before, because I started with the Town of Maine— 'course you can't just do one town—you start doing the surrounding towns—first thing you know you've got the whole county done. But when, I started just with the local records then I began to realize how important it was and then I indexed the county histories because I was always looking…trying to find a name and 'twas, about the third time you read an article and you say, “This is useless, to read the same thing over and over again just to find one name.” So, you index it…and I just got in the habit of getting a historical book and just, as I went along, indexing it on little cards, 3x5 cards, just the name and the page number, then, then I'd stamp each card with a reference, name of the book and file them alphabetical and then—a a year from now when I'm looking up a surname, why I can go back and here's all these cards…this book on page so and so has got information of that man and this census on a certain page there's family information. Ah—on another book there's a write-up about his farm. It's—a, it's all indexed. Wanda: It's like a computer system, isn't it? Shirley: It is. And the newer historians now, in fact the county historians’ meeting in, in September, one of our lectures is going to be on on should you put things on computer or not? Wanda: Well how do you feel about it? Shirley: I think it's great. It's just that I've done it this way. So there's no need for it now…in Broome County. But—a for counties that have not done this and there's an awful lot of historians. I have gone around to several county historians and got them started. And I started them with the 3x5 cards and I got them started, set their office up so that they would do the same as I…I mean they come to my office and it's just so well organized… Wanda: It is. Shirley: I mean I'm not boasting, but it's just, just the way I have it organized. I just impressed them so, and I've had...county historians from all over the state...come here, look at the thing and then I have helped them set up their office. And…because records are useless without an index. Wanda: And using the same system with each historian is good. Shirley: And it doesn't matter what system they use, whether they put all their cemeteries in one book and have a master index to cemeteries and census in another book, with a master index. It doesn't matter. I put everything together. And one county I started, they, they did everything separate until they got quite a large collection. One day one of the fellas, I was there visiting. And he was setting up and says, "You know, we finally did what you did—put everything together.” I said, "I told you in the beginning.” He says, "Yes, I know you told me, but,” he says, “'We wanted to keep everything separate 'n it got too big.” He said, "I was looking in fifteen places," he said. "That got to be a chore." So he put everything together, all surnames together, you got all fifteen references right there in one little pack. (Laughs). So—you know how it is. Wanda: And it won’t be that much more complicated for somebody in years to come, too. Shirley: Umhumm. That's right. But if you put everything together in one master index and have it…in a file where you can keep adding to it without…taking pages out and putting more pages in, that would be a loose file. Wanda: Well you started this before...now how long ago? Shirley: Oh, I'd say around fifteen years. Wanda: When did you become county historian? Shirley: I was county historian for seven years, so, it would be, what? ‘71. I was appointed in January of ‘71. I'd been deputy for a long time. I—Robert Spencer was the county historian and—a he didn't care for genealogy. He knew I did so I, he would pass all the letters on to me— genealogy—and I helped him with other things, but genealogy mainly and then when he died I just, just appointed me, historian.  Wanda: And I hear you…did marvelous things for the historian's, historian's office while you were there—in reorganizing things. Shirley: Yes, well when I took over as county historian, it was, it all came to me in cardboard boxes and filing cabinets. And—(laughs) I said, “Now wait a minute, I can't have all this valuable stuff in my house." And—a between you and I… Wanda: You mean you were expected to keep it in your house? Shirley: Yes. Bob Spencer kept it in his house…all those years. He had a study—a bedroom—a study and—a here was all these boxes and boxes of stuff and books and things and ‘course I had two children at home  then. Each one of my bedrooms was full with a child, you know, three bedrooms and so the spare bedroom of course I had—ended up with the stuff in it. And I just said, "This can't be." And according to the rules and regulations from Albany it should be in the county office building. The county historian should have his records in the county office building —same with a town. They should be in the town building. And a, so I—see Ed Crawford was the supervisor at that time and I talked to him. And they were in the process of building the new buildings. And then he promised me I'd have a room in the new building. Well they got that all made and everybo—a the floors were all used up—with other people wanting to move over there, so I got a room in the old building, which was just fine. That's where the historian should be anyway—in an old building. And I had a very small room, but it could be locked and I—it was files one side and the other. You just walked down through the middle—you couldn't open two drawers opposite. You just—had to walk in there—and my desk was outside. Wanda: Where was that now, what part of the building was that in? Shirley: Oh—it was the fourth floor of th—a, of the new, of the addition to the courthouse. It was—the old executive’s office, really if you know where that was. Wanda: Mmhum—yes. Shirley: And—a the lawyer’s reference girl was there and she had her desk there and I had my desk there and then the records were all in the room that was locked. But I, I left the key with her because if anybody came and wanted to look in them she would…watch them, if I wasn't there. And it was, it was a nice arrangement. I could use her phone and so it made a very nice arrangement. And I got all the stuff out of my house. Oh, you should…they moved it, the county moved it. They sent a truck to Robert Spencer’s—a county truck. And they brought it up here and put it in the garage, gradually I got it in the house. And—a then they came and trucked it…back and so that was quite a job. I didn’t want it in the house. Wanda: No. It was very— Shirley: If my house burned, why all those things would be lost. Wanda: Yes. Shirley: 'Course if the court house burns they will too, but I don't think that'll burn.  Wanda: So then you moved from there over to the old courthouse, right? Shirley: Yes. Ah—one of the judges wanted to have that floor because there was a hearing room there, a big room. Court hearing. And so we moved over to the old courthouse then on the third floor of the old courthouse into a larger room, which was very much better. I'd been asking for a larger room for a long time and here…so they fixed up this larger room for me. But the lawyer reference girl and I still shared the room. But they put the bookcases in, 'n we chose the colors 'n I mean they just put the—the rug in and everything for us. It was, they were fixing it up but the way we wanted it. Wanda: It has a nice atmosphere. Shirley: And—a with the bookcases there, and, I asked for a small bookcase about half that size and when they come in and put all those big bookshelves there I thought, "Oh where will I ever find books?" But you know, you've been in there so…they're filling up… Wanda: They’re nearly filled, aren't they? Shirley: ...they're filling up fast. And—a all the cabinets there, there’s no room now for all the cabinets. They really need a bigger room. Wanda: Well I understand they are going to move into a separate…place. Shirley: I, I have heard that they're going to get, that he's trying to move into a bigger room. And that's great because he really needs a work table, for people to work on. Needs a—there’s some desks there, but only one person can sit at a desk. Whereas if you had a table you could get three or four people in a room. Most historians’ offices I go into there'll be one desk, but there'll be one long table with chairs around it people can work on. Wanda: You had volunteers that worked with you too, in the county. Shirley: The C.E.T.A., the C.E.T.A. girls in the summertime. And I would teach them how to type…and I would…teach them how to file cards…file them alphabetically and there's a lot of things to learn. And it's just little things, but I’m sure that some of the girls went on to much better jobs and the typing skills I'm sure, were… They couldn't type when they came to me and they…by the end of the summer they were real good. Wanda: And they had to be accurate, too. Shirley: Uh huh. Well, if they made mistakes they either throw the card away or start over again, or…erase it. But after a few weeks…you learn not to make mistakes, because that's a waste of time. And the—a volunt…the RSVP, and I never can remember what…Retired Volunteer Services—a whatever it is…RSVP [Retired Senior Volunteer Program]...and I've had several people helping me there. They would come in in the wintertime and I would teach them how to type the cards an , so they could come in and just—a I would leave their little chart. They had to sign in and sign out the hours and—a this was returned to RSVP because they're, they're not monitored, but they're—a… Wanda: Credited. Shirley: Credited, or whatever it is…they do. And after I taught them, why then they would come in. I, I would always leave their box of cards there to be typed and they would come in, do their hours and leave. Sometimes I’d see them, sometimes it’d be two or three weeks before I’d see them…again…where…but they knew the days I was coming in and some would be there on the days. Others… I’ve had one girl working there all last winter. I’ve only met her once. Wanda: Is that a fact? Shirley: Yeah. She comes in on Monday for some reason and Monday's the day I stay home and do housework. It's the only day, I save that for the house. The rest of the time I spend all my time on history 'n… Wanda: Well we know we have a new historian. You still will carry on this genealogical work? Shirley: I'm doing just genealogical work now. I’ll show you the files later. We'll go upstairs and see my files. Wanda: Is there anything else you could—a tell about being a town historian, Town of Maine Historian? Ah—how, how did you make out during the bicentennial year? That must have been a busy, busy time. Shirley: Oh, that year was a blur. I remember it, going through it, but that's all I remember, is going through it. It was busy, being a town historian, county historian. I don't think I did any housework all that year. I got meals and occasionally did a little ironing but that's about it. Wanda: Those things you can do anytime. Shirley: Oh, anytime, that's right. But it, of course, county historian we started about three or four years ahead of time planning and we had… I was an ex officio, bicentennial commission ex officio, there were thirteen members to the committee and then two ex officio. The county historian was one and the—a curator at Roberson…the other…ex officio. And—a so there were fifteen people and we'd get just about everybody out…there were two or three…there was always some that couldn't come every time and we'd…plans and each one would do their own thing. I mean I had…certain things I was in charge of and then…we'd make all these plans and then we'd go to all these meetings and then come the bicentennial year, we just went to all these things and we had… Wanda: Sounds well-organized. Shirley: It was organized. It was very well-organized and the two chairmen that we had—a, Michael Vanuga and Shirley Hess. You ought to—a interview them. While it's still fresh in their mind, the bicentennial. That's a…I hadn't thought about that. You know, we talked, the bicentennial, talked about interviewing people concerning the bicentennial, and right afterwards … and then of course the funding was cut off by the county when the new administration came in and—a so we…that's one project we didn't get finished, is the tape—interviewing people, specially on the committee and—a so maybe that's something that your committee could do. Wanda: That was quite a historical event. Shirley: Yeah. And—a, let's see, oh we had the quilt. I had people here at the house quilting for six weeks. I moved all the furniture out of the dining room and had the quilt frame in there and they would come…when they could and work. I kept, I kept a record of all the names and, and the hours and—a so we did that quilt and then we gathered fifty or sixty quilts from the county that went to this show in August. And we also, one day was Broome County Day up there and of course you had to supply the people to guard the quilts that day. And boy do quilts have to be guarded! You have to have people standing right there. Wanda: And that was where? Shirley: Up to Ithaca. Wanda: Ithaca. Shirley: And—a that was an experience. That was one of the things I was in charge of. Wanda: And the quilts were antique quilts, were they? Shirley: Oh and the antique quilts—and the new ones too. There was prizes for the new quilts. Wanda: It's marvelous to see these old—a crafts being revived, isn't it? Shirley: Oh, it's great, great. And I worked… they had a quilt up there … everybody who submitted—a quilts, all the counties, had to send somebody up to work on a quilt up there, during the week. There was a whole week exhibit and so there's a Broome County square. Wanda: Ohh. Shirley: Up there. And I submitted a quilt square and then helped with the actual quilting we did. And I learned how to quilt—real fast. (laughter) Since then I've made one quilt and I've got material for two or three others but I made one for my granddaughter. I made a genealogy quilt. Her name is on the bottom, her parents, her grandparents, great-grandparents. Instead of a flower design I made the names the design. I think it's in California. I didn't tell my daughter I was doing it. I just told her I was… Wanda: You mean the names are actually quilted into the… Shirley: Instead of having a flower or a line or a design, which you usually have on a quilt I… wrote the names and so that was the quilt, that was the design—writing, writing the name and the dates, and the place of birth. And I put a little heart on the bottom with the date of the marriage of my daughter and son-in-law. Wanda: That's really one of a kind, that's going to be an heirloom, isn't it? Shirley: And I promised my son that he'll have one for his progeny when he gets married. So let's see—quilts. Oh the other thing I was in charge of in the bicentennial year was the—a town historians writing their little pamphlets. You know, that we… Each town historian wrote a eight page pamphlet with pictures—a brief history of their town. And I had them all printed exactly alike. Different colors of the paper but you know, the same format. And then we had a cover made, we furnished a cover and it was sold as a book. People could buy it as a book or they could buy just the town, and this was quite a success. Wanda: I should think so. Wonderful idea because it's so handy for… Shirley: And the little booklets are in, in this cover separately. Wanda: …school kids to use. Yeah. Shirley: You could take… it wasn't all bound together as one book. In fact the idea was copied by several of the counties when they saw what we were doing they, they did the same thing. Their town historians wrote the little history and then it was printed by the same printer in the same format with the same headings for towns. Yeah. Ahm, what else did we do? Oh of course there were so many things going on in the bicentennial year. I can't even remember them (laughs) there were too many of them. Wanda: I can't. Shirley: Like the Freedom Train was here and, and the Barge. We had a big thing going at the Barge. Broome County was part of that. That was a three-county affair—four-county actually—it was four counties. And Broome, Broome County was a part of that. And I was, seemed to be the liaison for that. I was running up to Ithaca every month and meeting, planning that for a year. So I, I had a busy year. Wanda: Well the Town of Maine… Shirley: And the Town of Maine, and I was busy there, too… Wanda: …had a tremendous celebration, didn't they? Shirley: We sure did, we did it in May. And we had a three-day… I guess it was Memorial weekend, so we had the three-day holiday. We had our tour of the houses and the booths and 'n everything one has at a centennial…celebration, and everything in costume, of course. And we had a ball earlier, in costume. Gordon and I won first prize with our costumes. I was so, you know (laughs) I just…I shouldn't boast. Wanda: Did you wear family clothes? Shirley: No, I made them. Wanda: Oh, you made them. Shirley: Yeah. I made him a colonial suit and had the little short pants and the knickers and the coat with the old braid on it, made out of that washable velvet and—a… kind of velvet that can be washed. And I got a little piece of old polyester, but it looked like brocade, and made a vest for him. And what a time I had finding stockings, white stockings? You know, like they used to wear in the old days? Wanda: For men? Shirley: For men. Oh, I tried several different things. I finally bought some polyester and made these stockings and then right after, you know, I made the first pair. They had a seam right up the back (laughs) 'cause I had to sew them. And—a then I found a pair of knee socks… from Sears… white knee socks. 'Course they were for girls, so I got a very large size and they stretched and… that… they turned out just fine…but they went up over the knees. And they had to…because the, the stocking goes over the knee and the knicker comes down. And then I had on a blue—we were both in blue—and that's probably because we were a pair. And I had…I got—a, well what I used was lining, acetate lining for coats. And that's washable, but it's, it's shiny and it looks like satin, so I made my dress outta that. And it really, I was just proud of it. And I was very surprised when we, we got a prize for it. Didn't expect that. So that was then that I was on the—a when Tioga County had their ball. I was one of the judges. And Gordon and I went to the ball over there. We went to two balls. (laughs) Oh there was just so many things and… Wanda: As you say, it's hard to remember, isn't it? The activities that were going on. Every weekend… Shirley: There was something and all the different towns. I tried… and we had the… as the county committee, we had to—or commission, I should say. It wasn't a committee—as the county commission we had to, to really our job was synchronizing everything so that all the towns didn't have their event on the same weekend. And so we managed. I think they were all different weekends. Some of them, even with the rain, were postponed, but they still … were scattered throughout the summer, the spring and the summer and the fall. So we were able to attend… most of them, or some of them. Yeah, there were just so many things… going on. Wanda: Well, now is here anything more you want to say about the duties of a town historian, or what you, how you handled this at the same time? Shirley: Well the duties of the county historian and the town historian… are the same thing… It's just, it's main…it's keeping track of the records and keeping them so they're available for people to look at. And it's just constant collecting… from newspapers and… a town historian doesn't have that much because there's just a small entity. The county, I used to cut the papers every day because there would be something, somebody would have something going on every day. Wanda: You'd have to be a very interested person and you have to be also organized, don't you? Shirley:Yes. I'm, I'm pretty well organized (laughs) I, I'm not too good a historian, really, but I'm organized. I do know how to organize and that's, that's very important. Wanda: Yes, I should think so. Shirley: And these projects that I'm starting for the county should, for the future, should be really, really great if they're carried through and finished up. Wanda: Do you hope to carry on with the town historian's job now? Shirley: Well I… Wanda: Is it appointive? Shirley: Yes it's appointed…every two years. And the county job—I think that had to be every year. I can't remember. You just go in and you sign your appointment for the year. And if he decides to appoint somebody else, why somebody else does it. (laughs) But that's—a… Wanda: Well I guess if, if you have nothing more to add. Do you? Have anything else? Shirley: No. I think we've talked about everything on the list here that you—a… scrapbooks, you have on the list. These are very important because in the older days, see, we don't have the newspapers. Wanda: Yes. Shirley: But people themselves would cut scrap, cut scraps! (laughs)... Cut articles from the newspapers, making a scrapbook. And—a people nowadays don't do that so much anymore. Wanda: That's true. Shirley: And—a so these old scrapbooks will have family information, or they'll cut out a wedding with—a you know, or an obituary, or something that's going on in the town and there'd be a nice write-up on something going on in the town and—it would be in that scrapbook. And these are valuable because they just aren't available, that information isn't available. Wanda: How about photographs? Shirley: Oh they're very important. Wanda: Do you have them donated? Shirley: Oh sure, they donate them. People have them and—a sometimes they don't even know what they are, so they'll bring them in and get them identified and then maybe—a building is now gone. Roberson Center really has got a, a much better collection of pictures, but they've been doing it for years. Historical society. And a lot of the pictures and things like this go to Roberson and this is where they should be, I think. I think the county historian should take care of the county records and the current events for future reference. And the old pictures and the old collections and the artifacts and the…oil paintings and the rocking chairs and things like this, they should go to Roberson. Wanda: You were telling me the other day about—a writing down some of these—a inscriptions on tombstones? Shirley: (laughs) Yes. Wanda: Do you have any interesting things you want to put on tape about those? Shirley: Ahm—I have, I really haven't done much of that kind of work myself. You see the D.A.R. went through and copied all the inscriptions in the 1920s, but they didn't copy the new ones, just the old ones and in the 1960s the Mormon Church decided that the cemeteries were disappearing, the stones were going, you know, breaking and pollution from being moved and so they, knowing that these were very valuable, and they sent their people out and each…they just, there were teams went right out and did all the cemeteries. And they would take the D.A.R. records and then work from there. Or they would do the cemetery and then we would compare the two because a lot of stones would be gone. The D.A.R. just copied the very early ones. They figured after Civil War there were census records and vital records and things, so the cemeteries weren't, records weren't quite as vital. But the Mormon people have copied them right up to current times. So… I don't have too many stories to tell about cemeteries, but I, I get all my fun out of the census records, indexing the census records…because the sense of humor of some of these people. They—a there's two or three favorites I have where the census record would write down the family, the mother and the father and then start with the children and they'd get down to about eleven or twelve or thirteen and the last one's name was Enough! Or… I found one that the last one's name was Last. So here's a little kid goin' through life with the name Enough. (laughter) And there's one I found in Binghamton on—he must have been very proud of the fact that he was in the War of 1812. He was, I think it was in the '70 or '75 census. He was in his 90's. No, it was the ‘65 census, that's right, because hey were—a, there was a whole separate category in the ‘65 census on…the—a Civil War…records. So, for the last five years any man that had been in the Civil War, why he, he wrote down what his regiment was and when he served and if he was wounded or not he told about his wounds and if he was killed in the service there was a record of where he was buried. I mean, he family knew this because it was taken in ‘65 right at the end of the war. And here was this one man in his nineties and he served in the Navy and I was reading along and I said, "Goodness, a 90-year old man serving in the Navy!”—because there were Navy people in the, that was in the Civil War. And I stopped in the very end there and his term of service was 1812 to 1813. (laughter) And then I had another man who served in the Mexican Wars and here it is that he told about his service in the Mexican Wars. And the Indian Wars, there was one man in the Indian Wars. Most of it they just got in the Civil War, but every once in awhile they'd strike somebody that was an older person and very proud of it and it was written right down—in the census. Wanda: Rank, name and serial number, eh? Shirley: Umhmm and then the one, the one man that—a I copied out of the '75 census… and the enumerator… had written, they put a star by his name or a asterisk, so I looked down at the bottom in the margin to see what he had written. The man was in his seventies and his wife was about forty and there were about ten or twelve children living in the family. So it says, “This man was the father of eleven children by his first wife and nine by his second and with the prospect of more.” Wanda: Oh no! Shirley: Right in the census records. Wanda: Twenty kids and the prospect of more. Shirley: And the good prospect of more. So you never know what you're going to come across. One census-taker, the last family in the book, it had, it had an eighteen year old girl in it and her occupation, see he put down their name and where they were born and their occupation. Her occupation was “my intended,” so evidently this was the girl he was going to marry. That was her occupation, was “my intended.” But there are, when you're copying records like this… and the names, too. I have a whole list of them upstairs I—in fact in the 1830 census I copied a couple off. His name was Jack, last name was H-a-m-e-r Hamer, jackhammer. (laughs) So I kept a…list of those things. Wanda: I should think so. Shirley: You just, you just never know what you're going to come across. And they weren't afraid to put in anything, either. If they were just living together it was right there. If they weren't married, they were just living together. Wanda: Yes, I remember coming across a census record where the man was called a thief. That was his occupation. Shirley: That's right, or a convict. That was his occupation. In all the copying I've been doing for the last fifteen or twenty years I have found one horse thief. Wanda: Admitted, eh? Shirley: Yeah. He was a convict and he was convicted for—a stealing a horse. Wanda: Did that happen right here in Broome County? Shirley: Umhmm. And you go through the Poor House records and the—a Asylum records. A—the—a… Wanda: Inebriate Asylum? Shirley: The Inebriate Asylum and all of…the occupations, everybody in there was doctor, lawyer, insurance agents. You go through the jail and they were all Irish and they were in there for, for brawling…for alcoh—or drunkenness… 'cause when the census-taker we—on that day, he had to do who was in the jail. ( laughs) Wanda: Monday morning was probably all drunkards. Shirley: Oh boy. And the hotels with the—a men and women—it's right there, you know, all… Wanda: There were so many things I wanted to ask… Hotel records, ahm are those ever preserved? Do you ever have anything like that, come down to you? Shirley: Well they should be. Ah, I found one in the county—a not too long ago. I was going through some things from a… a hotel. It was a ledger of the people who were in the hotel. It was rather brief, some of it was after 1900, but it should be saved. Wanda: Oh yes.  Shirley: Who knows, who knows where they are. I mean, maybe they are in Roberson, like the Arlington Hotel that’s gone. I have no idea where those… records are. Maybe the family has them. Wanda: Well you'd see some very famous signatures on some of them, I'm sure. Shirley: I'm sure there would be. But that… I mean it's nothing to do with the county historian's records, so that…this would be Roberson's job to… find out where they are, and get… kept… preserved. People are giving me, ah, old school books and the ledgers and the records of the old school places. And it's all right because—a they'll be saved, but if they gave me a desk or something like that I would say "no.” Wanda: Well, I hope you carry on with this wonderful job that you're doing. You're just exactly the right person for it, too. Shirley: Well thank you very much. Wanda: Thanks for the interview and your time. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Shirley Woodward Subject The topic of the resource Woodward, Shirley -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Historians -- Interviews; American Revolution Bicentennial, 1976 Description An account of the resource Shirley Woodward speaks about her  father's influence on her interest in local history, work as the Town of Maine historian and with the Nanticoke Valley Historical Society. She details the responsibilities of her work as the town historian. She discusses her years as Broome County Historian and her efforts during the bicentennial, as well as the nature of her work and how it impacted the community. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 64 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/b4d90ba1e9c94c5c2e6d1042172dc847.mp3 5c447201f92ca6814b58f595563085ff Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Templeton, Lena Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Dobandi, Susan Date of Interview 1978-02-01 Collection Broome County Oral History Project Date of Digitization 2016-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 13:26 Minutes Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56039">Interview with Lena Templeton</a> Subject LCSH Templeton, Lena -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Pleasantmount (Pa.); Binghamton (N.Y.); Ansco Company -- Employees -- Interviews; Volunteers Dance class Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Lena Templeton Interviewed by: Susan Dobandi Date of Interview: 1 February 1978 Susan: Mrs. Templeton, could you tell us a little about your early beginnings, where you were born? Lena: I was born in Pleasantmount, PA, on a little farm. A–and I lived there ‘til I was about seven years old. I started school there and the school teacher used to live with us during the bad winter weather, which we had piles and piles of snow in those days. We lived down there and my father used to hitch the jackass up to a little sleigh and we would go to school through the woods and then he’d have to come and get us and it was a one room school house and uh just sometimes the fire was out and we would freeze ah it was really something. Well, I went to school there a couple of years and and–ah then ah–my family–we moved to Pleasantmount in the village. That was outside about 3 miles where I started school, so we moved to the village and my father was in the livery business–raced horses around to the fairs and ah–I went to school there–a–I went to high school–I was in the eleventh grade and my father he moved to New York State. Ah–was working for a realtor–oh Mr. Hoffman and they had a lot of land up to Conklin and they said they were going to fix it up and that lasted a few years and a when I was–a–18 years old I went to work to take care of twins and I stayed there nine months and then ah Dr. George Fox, a skin specialist in Binghamton on Main St.–ah–he wanted me to come and take care of the office for him. They had no nurses those days, you know. They they took care of their own. So, I went there and I was there for 5 ½ years. So, when I was 24 I was married and still around Binghamton and had four children–had twin girls and I a got married of course when I was 24 years old. And something interesting too, my father-in-law came over from Scotland, Ireland in a boat and I can't tell how many–a weeks or months they were coming over but just in an open boat. They came over from Scotland, Ireland and I never did see him but ah it is ah my father-in-law used to tell about what a rough time it was and that it was a miracle that they made it you know. At that time there was no transportation by water. That was a good many years ago. Well, I brought up my family and went to work at Ansco's. I was 42 years old and it was during the war and I ah loved my work. I did everything. I did packing. I took a man's job at one time as stock girl and I did perforating the film ah but the last 12 years there, I was a group leader and I enjoyed it and I missed it when I retired, very much. I enjoyed the friends I made and a it was a good place to work and it was those days a lot different than it is today. I started out at about $25 a week and when I finished up I was making better than a hundred clear. So–ah–that a was a very a interesting work and I made a lot of friends and I still have them so now I ended up retired and working here 8 years and I–really my life's not too interesting. (chuckle) Susan: Well, it’s nice to–to be useful and that you’re helpful keeping house for this gentleman. Lena: Oh and he appreciates it a lot. You know, one of his daughters is married to Dr. Gilmore. Susan: Oh, did she? Lena: Yes, that’s her coming in now. Susan: Where does he practice? Lena: Oh, he’s had a heart attack. He’s not practicing anymore. They’re in Florida, they’re just up here for business. That’s his wife. That’s his daughter—they don’t come too much. Susan: Mrs. Templeton, let’s continue when you retired from Ansco. What you did with your life? Lena: When I retired from Ansco the first year I was lost for something to do so I took up dancing took lessons for a year and I enjoyed it so much. It was something that I wanted to do all my life and a we traveled around and put shows on here and there and a it was very enjoyable and I use it now I feel so relaxed and free if I go out now, you know, I’m able to do most all the dances. And then I was–a–just a by myself and I thought there is something I can do. So I watched the paper–they wanted somebody to come in to take care of an elderly couple so I started down there and I enjoyed it and a I’m still there. It will be 8 years this month that I have been here and it gives me something to do and it’s very satisfying to think that you’re helping somebody each day. Susan: And now I don’t think you’d mind telling us how old you are? Lena: No. I’ll be 77 April 27th. Susan: Well, that is wonderful. Lena: Ha–ha–But those dancing lessons, I really got a lot out of them. You know my daughters were so happy when I did it. All my life I–I wanted to I could dance, but not really good you know. But a–we went all over Elmira and put on dances. We had a ball. We had dance frocks and I felt so elegant. And you know, if there is something a–a–if there is something in your mind that you’d like to do–you have the opportunity to do it, it’s good to do it get it over with because you’re so satisfied with yourself that you accomplished it you know. Susan: That’s right. Lena: You’d be surprised those senior citizens how beautiful they dance just marvelous and some of those old ladies they’re in their 80s, they can just step around there like a feather beautiful, do all the new dances, the Bump. They do everything not just the waltz and foxtrot and what have you. They do everything. You should see it would be worth it just to go over and see them. Once a month they have a dinner and a dinner dance and they have live music, you know and you’d be surprised to see them, it’s really marvelous. Susan: Well, I think I am going to make a point to go and watch some of the activities since I have been talking with people. Lena: Sure, you just enjoy watching them. I haven’t been up recently. I had a bad knee. I had bursitis in it and I didn’t get–I got into work and back but I didn’t take in any of the you know–activities. I went to the State Hospital every month like that, but a– Susan: Is that part of your voluntary work in the community? Lena: Yeah–uh ha–yeah. Susan: What did you do there? Lena: Where? State Hospital? Susan: Yeah. Lena: We took refreshments there were about five or six of us went up a and that was from the Moose Club. We were members of the Moose Club and we took refreshments, sandwiches and cake and we–a–played bingo ‘til nine o’clock and then Easter we gave them a party, Christmas we gave them a party and in July we gave them a big dinner–half a chicken, watermelon and baked beans and salads. You never saw such a happy crowd in all your life. And we have about 75-80 of them that are able you know enjoy it and play bingo and what have you. It was really–is satisfying when I first went up there it was kind of depressing but now, I wouldn’t miss it for anything because when I go home I feel so good. They are just such happy faces. When you go there they are all waving at you you know and if you have different jewelry on they’ll say where’s your cameo, where is this or where is that you know they really are–they really are so happy to see you and some of them they–they you know aren’t able to come but that picnic–they look forward to it. They are talking about it for weeks before we go up there. If it’s nice we have it outdoors, if not, we have it inside. But that’s a big job. We fix the chickens at the Moose Club you know and take them up in roasters and we fix salads and watermelon usually–they do love watermelon but they have a ball. They feed them good up there but there’s things that they don’t get you know. They get good substantial food you know but not–not any goodies up there that you ordinarily get at home. So, I really was busy before I came to work but it’s like my daughters say to me, you know they kid me a lot they say, “Mother you know what, it’s gotten to the point where we have to make an appointment with you in order to get you on the phone or anything,” because I’m never home. Susan: Tell us about how you go bowling with them. Lena: How I go bowling with them? Susan: At your age. Lena: Oh well I bowl once a week and I bowl with my twin daughters and two granddaughters and we have a ball. I look forward to it every week and I’d miss it if I didn’t go. It really is relaxing and no matter how tired I am when I bowl I feel relaxed. I go home and I feel like a new person. It’s always been that way. I bowled when I was at Ansco’s too you know so I don’t bowl as well as I used to but we’re second place we were last year so we don’t mind. Susan: Well, you certainly have been a very active woman in the community. Lena: Yes, thank you I have and I was active when I brought my family up too you better believe it. I had twins and I nursed them 8 ½ months without a bottle and did my own work and had one 2 years old at the time too so I had three babies. Susan: Well thank you very much for the interview Mrs. Templeton. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Lena Templeton Subject The topic of the resource Templeton, Lena -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Pleasantmount (Pa.); Binghamton (N.Y.); Ansco Company -- Employees -- Interviews; Volunteers Description An account of the resource Lena Templeton talks about her childhood growing up on a farm in Pleasantmount, PA and her early education, and eventually moving to New York state. She discusses early work taking care of the office of a skin specialist in Binghamton, NY then getting married and having children, and finding work at Ansco's during the war. She details working at Ansco's including tasks she performed. She speaks about her interests and activities (dancing) as a retiree and her volunteer work in the community. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 60 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/fae5e8c3dc1101b635850789aeb00a19.jpg 48f954797628c95227b50d19fb635186 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/5d45b2dac1e54b653beb17f29e3d9d41.jpg b719d032b5af087a359d7a56e9d24c7c https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/23f6e15657293bc2201a050d6512df91.jpg 58c11caf2deaba314563226eeb766ce2 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/1fbf0507d143257ccb7f6f9a44cfc07c.mp3 e5fe76f3b65d75f4bb4390a3fa6797f7 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Bloomer,Harry Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview O'Neil, Dan Date of Interview 1978-03-16 Collection Broome County Oral History Project Subject LCSH Bloomer, Harry -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Johnson City (N.Y.); Cortland (N.Y.); Santa Claus Bicentennial; Uncle Sam; Blinky the Clown Date of Digitization 2017-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 00:23 Seconds ; 33:45 Minutes Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56063">Interview with Harry Bloomer</a> Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interviewed with: Harry Bloomer Interviewed By: Dan O’Neil Date of Interview: 03/16/1978 Dan: This is Dan O’Neil, and speaking with Harry Bloomer. 263 Main Street, Johnson City. The date is March 16, 1978. This interview is being, taking place at Wilson Memorial Hospital in Johnson City, where Mr. Bloomer is a patient. Will you start out giving me the, the date and...where, the place of your birth, a little of your childhood days, why you came to Johnson City, and while in Johnson City or in this locale, how you earned your living? Harry: Well, well, I mean, I came to Johnson City when I was a small boy. I lost my Dad and my Dad put me away, and so, ah, my Mother didn’t want me. So, when I got to a certain age, after I got to a certain age, then I got transferred to another institution, and I ran away from that one. And then I, then...then the depression came on, so, I…depression come on, so I was, I couldn’t read, couldn’t write. It was just my own name, so I joined, ah, joined the Army. And, ah, and [cough] after I joined the Army, why, I come out with an Honorable Discharge, and…and I, four years and seven months, I was in the Artillery first, then from the Artillery, I went to, ah, I went to the Medical Corps, and from the Medical Corps, and then I got discharged. And then I come home, and I couldn’t buy a job, so I’ve been a clown all my life. Used to clown up to the soldiers and every day that I could, and after I clowned up and everything. And then one day, they wrote a, couldn’t find the guy that was, that was going to be the Santa Claus. And, ah, so they couldn’t find him, so after, so they’re, so after the Chamber of Commerce, ah, got ahold of me. And after they got ahold of me, said, “I’m gonna make a Santa Claus out of ya.” I said, “Whoa, wait just a minute - difference between a Santa Claus and a difference between Santa Claus, and, eh, difference between, and, ah…a clown is between day, day, ah, day and night. Dan: Right. Harry: So… Dan: Okay. Harry: So, I said, “The difference between day, a day and night,” and ah, “What do you mean, you like children?” Well, I knew how to handle ‘em. “You’ve been a clown. And, eh, you know what…how to act with ‘em.” Stuff like that. I says, “Yeah, I know I do. But it’s, difference between, ah…” I says, “Well, I’ll try it.” So, I says, “You got a suit?” He says, “No, I haven’t got a suit. But,” he says, uh, “we’ll get you one.” And he got me one, and it was the worst one I ever saw. It was handmade, and it was a rubber mask, with a, a hot cotton, batten beard on it. And it was the hottest thing I’d had ever got ahold of. And I begin to like it, and so, happen next year, so I says, “Well," I says, who’ll be it next year?” “Well, you did such a good job, we’re going to let you have it.” Then I found out where this school was in Albion, New York. Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: And, ah, so I went to Albion, New York, and I, I said, “Is this the place where you get your, your wig and beard?” He says, “Yes, this is the place. But I only got one left - I’m going to New York, but I guess I can wait on you.” So, he says, “You want that wig and beard real bad, don’t ya?” I said, “Sure, I really want it, no matter what the price is; I don’t give a care. I want the suit, and I want the wig and beard.” So, Charlie showed me how to put it on, and he said to me, ah, and he said, and Charlie says, I kept feeling my pocket, looking at the suit; feeling my pocket, looking at the suit. “You really want that,” he says. “Really want it?” “Charlie,” I said, “I’m not married and nobody has to bawl me out when I come home. ‘How much money did you spend?’ And, ah, ‘What kind of, what kind of good time, good time did you have?’ and stuff like that. And if I come home broke…well, that’s my business ‘cause I’m all by, I’m all by myself.” And so, I went then and bought the suit and brought it home. And Charlie says, “If you, if you’re gonna make it your professional out of it, I’d advise you to have two, two suits in case of an accident - the show, it gotta go on.” And I said, “By the way, Charlie, what do you use for your makeup for your face?” He says, “See, you’re a better salesman than I am. Well,” he says, “You, ah, need three things - your powder. Use, ah, a white lead pencil. And, uh…when you use rouge, and then you, then you use your mirror. Mirror. And you take your time putting it on, in mirror - you don’t plaster it on. When, when you take your…you put it over your eyes, you don’t plaster it on. You just go very, very lightly. Very lightly. Like you just come in, out of, out of the cold ‘cause your face been frostbitten or something. And then on your face, you put rouge. And after you rub that all off, you rub that all off because, uh, it makes you look pas- you come in with rosy cheeks. And so, uh…then, then...then I, ah, I floated around. I went 25 years to that school. And one year, 25 years [inaudible], and, well, I, I took sick. I didn’t want to miss the school, but my Doctor said I’d better, I’d better miss it this year, then I might be alright the next year. So, I said, “Okay, whatever you say, Doc.” So, I, I missed it. And the day the school opened, I cried like a baby [begins crying] because I never missed a year. Dan: 25 years? Harry: Yeah. My profession. Dan: And this was the school in Albion? Harry: Albion…it was in Albion, but it was- Dan: Pardon? Harry: It’s in Bay City, Michigan now because Charlie died, see. Dan: Now you talk about - what’s Charlie’s last name? Harry: Charlie W. Howard. Dan: How do you spell that last name? Harry: You know what? I never went to school, so I couldn’t tell ya. Dan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah… Sue: Howard. Dan: Howard. Sue: H-O-W-A-R-D. [spelling] Dan: Okay. Harry: So anyway, through going up there, and he said, “Don’t worry, Harry. You’re not gonna lose any time for it because you’re, you’re a real goodness, professional Santa Claus. And when I mean you do it…you don’t come up here for thanks just to put it on to scare the kids or give them a lot of hooey or stuff like that; you tell ‘em the truth. And, and you’re willing to…what you learn.” So, I went up the year after I took sick and I said this really…I can’t remember her name, but anyway, she was my nurse and she took me all around, and she really stuck by me, and she still sticks by me. Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: And, ah, then I hear…ah, I called him up again this year one time, and I said, “They’re gonna make me again, Charlie.” “Well, no, you’re not gonna…you’re not gonna lose anything over it because you, you’re always…you know your business.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: So, anyway, come home…and, ah, when I come home from there, a guy comin’ over, a guy come over to my my house one night from the newspapers. And he wanted, ah, tape…tape a couple of tapes off how, how I got to be a Santa. “Well,” I says, “There’s all my books here, there’s over 35 books of pictures of everywhere I go, everything I take. And when I’m not playing Santa Claus, I’m playing Blinky the, Blinky the Clown at the Pairs.” I used to work at the grandstand and sell apples and peanuts and stuff like that. I sell ‘em, “Here, here comes the lousy peanut man, trying to get rid of them just as fast as he can.” Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: And then one woman said to me one day, “What have ya got?” I says, “I’ve got candy apples; they’re dipped in glue; a couple of worm holes; it’s all up to you; sweet on the outside; sour on the in; the red gets all over your chin.” Dan: [chuckles] Harry: Then I’d come back the next day: “Hey, you’ve got nothing but popcorn.” “Oh, yes - I have,” says I, [inaudible] and I came to spend my rotten corn. “Last year a kernel, this year a pop; when we get to you, it won’t be so hot.” And, ah…one woman says, “Ya talk like that all the time.” And I says, “Yeah. If I don’t get ya, my voice will; I’ll get your money before you get over the hill.” Dan: [chuckles] Harry: And she says, “See? You’re not only a poet like that,” and when you write it in the paper and it says, “He’s not only a poet, but he’s also a politician.” And so, the kids one day, says, “Hey, Santa. How’d you get here with no snow?” “I fly high and I fly low; and I find land; that’s how I go.” Dan: [chuckles] Harry: Now…[inaudible] And then this family says, “Did you bring Rudolph?” I said, Yes, I brought Rudolph.” But I says, ah…hm, “He won’t want to go this year.” “Why not?” “Did you ever see a deer go why, why, without snow?” “No.” “Well, then Rudolph won’t go.” Dan: Hm. Harry: But, I…next year, I told ‘em I’d try to play it again as, as...as sick as I was. And so, ah, I put my outfit and suit on - played, ah, quite, ah…clubs, and the big clubs and stuff like that. And did my best. And then they says, “Hey, did you bring Rudolph this year?” I said, “Yeah.” I said, “But I’m having trouble.” “What you mean?” I said, “Tricky Dick won’t give me no gas; I can’t get the helicopter off the grass.” Dan: [lightly chuckles] Harry: And I says, “Did you bring Rudolph?” I says, “Yeah. I can’t use, use him, either.” “Well, why can’t ya?” “‘Cause,” I says, “Tricky Dick, he, he shut off the lights; can’t light up his nose…” Dan: [chuckles] Harry: “Can’t see which way he goes.” Dan: “Uh-huh.” Harry: “I, I hope Tricky Dick is out of the office ‘cause next time, everything will be, will be alright.” And this year I tried to play…I said, “Well, don’t gang me this year because Santa Claus is in tough shape.” One little boy came to me: “What do you mean, ‘tough shape’?” I says, “Yeah, I brought Rudolph, but he’s awful mean this year. Terrible mean.” Dan: Yeah. Harry: “What do you mean?” I says, “Awful mean.” I says, “I went up to feed him…when I went out to feed him, he hauled right off from me, and he kicked me. So, I can’t let nobody sit on my lap th-…for this year.” Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: I said, “You’re not mad at Santa because you can’t sit on Santy’s lap?” “Oh, no.” I said, “We’ll find him just the same.” Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: And like that. So, I went through my act the best way I could. And I got bleeding, and… Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: …Sick again. And they… Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: And they put me back in. Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: And that was my Santa Claus days. Dan: Whe-where were you born, Harry? Harry: I was born in Cortland. Dan: Cortland? Harry: Uh, yeah. I was born in Cortland. Dan: Now, you mentioned your Dad put you away. Harry: My Mother put me away. Dan: Your Mother put you away…away, where? Harry: In a home in Cortland. Dan: In a home in Cortland? Harry: Yeah. Dan: For, for, uh, children? Harry: Yeah. Dan: I see. Harry: And then, uh…I started a certain age, they put me up on the Hudson to a feeble-minded home, and people said, “What is that guy? Is he a nut?” “Well,” I says, “If I’m, if, if I’m not, if I’m a nut, I’m a tough nut if I was cracked.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: And I said, “I make, what do you make?” I says, “You’re making a lot of noise.” I says, “I…I’m making a buck or two.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: “So, make all the noise that’s…and call me anything that you want.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: “‘Cause I’m making a buck between as a nut.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: “And if you want to learn what I do, I’m a member of a trade.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: And so… Dan: Mm-hm. Now, uh, you mentioned the Chamber of Commerce wanted you to play Santa Claus. What Chamber of Commerce? Harry: In, in Johnson City. Dan: In Johnson City - how did you happen to come from - uh, where was this? The…? Harry: This was after the War. Dan: Yeah, but you - where was it on the Hudson that you were…? Harry: Up on the Hudson. Dan: Yeah - how, how did you to-? Harry: That’s good news: I ran away from that place. Dan: You ran away from there, and how did you happen to come to Johnson City? Harry: Well, I worked my way toward home. Dan: Towards Cortland? Harry: Yeah. Yeah, ‘till I found my folks and then my folks didn’t want me. I couldn’t find a job, so I…I picked up my own work. Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: Mowing lawns, and anywhere I could pick up a penny here or a penny there, and try to make people happy. Dan: Right. Now, you appeared, of course, before a lot of groups and organizations as Santa Claus. Harry: Yeah. Dan: Now, did you go to individual houses? Harry: Mm-hm. Dan: Were you out for hire? Harry: Um-hm. Dan: And what was your busiest season? I mean, was it the week before Christmas? Harry: It…it was, ah, Christmas Eve night. Dan: Christmas Eve night. Now, you weren’t - you, you don’t drive a car, do you? Harry: No, I don’t drive. Dan: Now, how did you get from house to house? Harry: Well, I had a good driver. I decorated my sleigh all up, and I named, and I named him, “Rudolph.” Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: I says, “Well, Rudolph is now all ready for a night.” Then, we keep the same addresses every year. Sometimes we get new ones, sometimes old, younger ones are growed out of it. And so, I always had new ones coming in. Dan: But, I mean, how did you get from one house to another? Harry: In the car. Dan: In the car? Harry: Yeah. Dan: I see…uh-huh. And, ah, Harry, would you mind telling me, I mean, how much you got for each one of your performances - I mean, to go to a residence? You know, to play Santa Claus? Harry: Well, sometimes I got nothin’. Dan: Sometimes, you got nothing. Harry: I didn’t get a penny. Dan: Is that right? Harry: But it ain’t, it ain’t for the penny. Dan: It’s, it’s…that’s right - it’s self-satisfaction. Mm-hm. Ah, what awards have you had, geh, Harry? Harry: Well, the highest award I ever had was, ah, was, ah…Red Ruby. Dan: Red Ruby? Harry: Red Ruby. From the Santa Claus school - I went there for 25 years. Dan: That’s in Albion? Harry: Mm-hm. Yeah. Dan: Uh-huh…now, what is the Red Ruby award? Harry: Well, Red Ruby stands for everlasting fire that never goes out. Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: For the, for the good deeds you did. Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: Towards other people. Dan: Uh-huh. Now, during the Bicentennial year, you, as I understand, you portrayed Uncle Sam. Harry: Yes. I went out, crazy enough. I went out, tried, bought myself an Uncle Sam suit. But, I didn’t have no beard at first. Dan: You’ve still retained the beard, haven’t you? [laughs] Harry: Yeah. Somebody, somebody said, “Hey, Uncle Sam’s supposed to have a beard.” I says, “I, I know that.” I says, I says, “Don’t worry about it.” I says, “I’ll put my razor away. And I’ll see what, then I’ll see what Uncle Sam will do.” First thing I know, it come out a perfect white and shaped right up - didn’t have to color it, tie it, or nothing. So, I said, “Here comes Uncle Sam; dirty old man; takes your money as fast as he can.” Dan: [laughs] Harry: “Takes your money and takes your dough - won’t give it back, where you go.” Hello. What do you want? [Interruption over Public Address system] Dan: Um, Harry, is there anything else that you’d like to tell me? You had a banquet here some time ago that the notables of the Triple Cities put on for you, honoring you for your- Harry: Well… Dan: -public service. Harry: Well, when I got out of the hospital. Dan: This was, what? About a year ago? Mm-hm. Harry: And I didn’t know nothin’ about it. Dan: It was a surprise party. Uh-huh. Harry: [crying; words inaudible] -light up the trees. And then they, they presented me with a live Christmas, Christmas tree. Dan: A live Christmas tree? Harry: Yeah, in the park. Dan: I see. Harry: So, then I told ‘em…I says, “Well, I tell you all,” I says, “When the tree gets big and tall, you can come in and decorate it all.” Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: So, I says, “Now, you’ve got a swing out there.” And I says, “When, uh…when the tree begins to, to grow,” I said…I said, “Out in the…out in my swinging, and now, and I’ll watch it grow.” Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: I told ‘em. Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: And so, I always had little ditties, little poems here for different people- Dan: Uh-huh. Harry -and stuff like that, you know? Dan: Were there any other characters that you portrayed other than Santa Claus, Blinky the Clown, and Uncle Sam? Harry: Well, the real ones was the…see, I’ve been a clown all, all of my life. And then I came in, in on the Santa Claus deal…and then, then...then I was up, I was up to Albion. Charlie said to me, “You outta, you outta make a good, eh…Easter Rabbit.” “A rabbit?” I says. “Whaddaya mean, a rabbit?” He says, “You make such a good Santy Claus…" Dan: [laughing] Harry: “…And you know how to act…you know how to [inaudible] without breaking into them, and you know not to talk when you don’t have to. So, you outta make darn good Peter Rabbit.” And so, I got the business for, of playing, uh, the Peter Rabbit for, for the Schweiners, and help to count them egg hunt Easter eggs. Stuff like that. Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: Sometimes, they’d give me something for it, and sometime they wouldn’t. But it all come from the heart. Dan: Yeah. Well, you, you’ve managed to be self-sustaining over all these, all these years, uh, Harry. Harry: Yeah. Dan: In spite of the fact that you can’t read nor write, I mean, I think you’ve done remarkable. Harry: Yeah. Dan: Is there anything else you’d like to add at all? Harry: Well, let’s see, uh… Dan: Is there any other awards that you received outside the Ruby award at the Albion? Harry: No, not exactly. Uh…some of the boys didn’t like me coming up there quite so many times - it took me 25 years. And Charlie - before Charlie died - he said, “If I know you, you’re gonna be the first man to walk out of this school with that Red Ruby on.” Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: He says, I said, “No, Charlie.” He says, “I’m telling ya.” He says, “Harry, if you’re not here - if you’re gone before I am - you’re gonna be the first man to walk out.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: And he says, “It’s because you’re gonna make a good Santa Claus.” Dan: Uh-huh. Now, when you went up there during these 25 years, when you returned, Harry, what did you do - teach the other…? Harry: Well… Dan: Fellas that wanted to, uh…the trade? Harry: Well, I wanted, I wanted to, to portray like that. If I still live and I get better, I might exactly do that. But, I, I never take away anybody else’s trade. Dan: I see. Harry: Never. Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: If they wanna learn, they can spend their money like I did. Dan: Yeah. Harry: I’ll always be glad to help ‘em, explain it to ‘em, and tell them where they make their mistakes. If they don’t like it, then they can save their money, and they can, they can go up to the school. Dan: How much did it cost for you to go that school? Harry: Well, when I first went to school there it cost me 20, $125.00. And then they cut it down to, ah, $75.00 - try to get more men to come. Dan: Yep. Harry: That was a refreshing course. Dan: Yeah. Harry: And then they cut it down to 50. And he left it that way - left it, left it down to 50. Dan: I see. Harry: And, ah…and Charlie says, “Don’t let anybody kid ya, Harry, at all: You did this alone.” Dan: Mm-hm. How, how, uh, many weeks was the original course when you went there? Harry: [inaudible] -cost. Dan: When you went, when it was- Harry: Hundred- Dan: $125.00? Harry: Oh, it was about…it was about two weeks, it started. Dan: Two weeks? Harry: Yeah. Because, see, the school was just startin’ to be... Dan: Yeah. Harry: He, he just started buildin’ it. Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: It was between Charlie (W-H-I) and, and, ah…and, and May. Maple Jone. Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: And he, ah…got them together. And he, he got them together. And he went to New York, helping him all over. We went to Macy’s, he says, “Oh, my God. I,” he says, “I can’t find better-lookin’ Santa Clauses than that.” Heaven bets. And Macy says, “Why in the world don’t you start a school? And put better-lookin’ men in this, in, in this school?” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: “Better-looking Santa Claus?” And so I go around and check ‘em. I see a boy – a fellow with brown shoes and black puttees, and I said, “By the way.” I says, “Did you ever go to Santa Claus school?” And he says, “No, why?” Well, I says...ah, “Don’t you want to go to school?” “Do ya have to?” I said, “No, you...you don’t have to. It costs ya money no matter where you go; you’re never gonna take a penny with ya when you go... Dan: Mm-hm. Harry:...But you’ll be...[begins sobbing] Dan: Okay, that’s alright, Harry...ah... Harry: He, he killed that. Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: I says, “Please think.” I says, “Playing Santa Claus; there’s not many that are very nice.”  So, what point they need is: “How much money you make playing Santa Claus? I looked at him, and I says, “Is that what you came up here for?” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: Make a little thing like that – go right back. Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: So, I says, “You’ll never make a Santa Claus.” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: Says, “You mean to tell me you see a Santa every three or four over there, and some over there, that you hadn’t, haven’t the opportunity to charge...” Dan: Mm-hm. Harry: “...then you’d never be a Santa Claus?” Dan: Yep; right. Not from the heart. Harry: Right. Dan: Not from the heart. Okay, Harry, you think that’s about all you’d like to tell me today? Harry: Well, you like - that’s how I got to be Santa Claus. Dan: That’s how you got to be Santa Claus. Harry: Yeah. Dan: And sold peanuts and popcorn at the ballpark. Harry: Yeah. And he says, “Come and get your stinkin’, rotten peanuts!”  Dan: [Dan laughing] Harry: And said, “The longer you wait, the rottener they get.” I used to tell them that. Dan: Uh-huh. Harry: [unintelligible] Dan: Well, for the sake of the archives, ah, Harry, why don’t we get your nurse’s name here on tape? Harry: Um... Sue: Sue Romanaski. Dan: Sue? Sue: Romanaski. Dan: Romanaski. Sue: Mm-hm. Harry: Yeah. Dan: And you’re a nurse, are you, Sue? Sue: Yeah, I’m an RN. Dan: You’re an RN? Sue: Yeah. Dan: At the hospital here? Sue: At Ideal Hospital. I’m- Dan: Oh, at Ideal. Sue: When Harry was having his operation last October, I was a student nurse. Dan: I see. Sue: And I went through the operation with him and everything. Dan: Mm. And you stuck with him. Sue: Yep. Harry: Good. Sue: I used to go over and read his letters to him, write his mail, and take him shopping, and things like that. Dan: Uh-huh. Well, God bless you. Well, Harry, would you like me to play this back for ya? Harry: Yeah. Dan: Okay. Article: Tribute Paid to memory of ‘Mr. Santa Claus’ By: George Basler "God knows the world needs more Harry Bloomers." This statement by Bernard Fionte, news director of WNBF radio, summed up the feelings of many today toward Harry Bloomer, who for 36 years played Santa Claus for thousands of Johnson City children. [Image Caption: 'Mr. Santa Claus'. Depicts Harry Bloomer in his Santa Claus outfit, looking down at a piece of parchment held in his two hands.] Bloomer, 71, who was nicknamed "Mr. Santa Claus" because he played the role for so long, died yesterday at Wilson Memorial Hospital after a long battle with cancer. "He was one of the most irreplacable people I've known," said Fionte, who emceed a tribute to Bloomer at Johnson City High School in 1976. "I think it's a dreadful loss to the community." Bloomer was sick for more than a year, but until the very end he never gave up fighting. Last January he was still looking forward to playing Santa Claus for local children next Christmas. But, for the last week or so, Bloomer knew the end was near, his friends said. "I saw him last Wednesday night, and he had put his trust in God. He said God knows best," said the Rev. Richard D. Christen, pastor of the First Baptist Church in Johnson City, which Bloomer attended for more than 30 years. "He was a man of good faith with respect to the community, and he was a man of real faith with respect to God," Christen added. Another close friend, Patricia Morse, said, "I'm glad it's over. He had suffered too long, and he was too good to suffer.” At his request, Bloomer will be buried in his outfit of Blinky the Clown – a character he created during his years as a circus vendor. He also played Peter Rabbit and in the summer of 1976 appeared as Uncle Sam at area parades and celebrations in honor of the Bicentennial. But, in a recent interview, he said, "Way down deep in my heart, I think my favorite character is Santa Claus. It’s a lot of headaches sometimes, but I like to meet kids." He identified with the role so much that at one time he thought about being buried in one of his Santa Claus costumes. But, he decided against it because he said simply, "Santa Claus lives forever. " Why was Bloomer so dedicated to playing Santa Claus? Christen theorized part of this dedication stemmed from his lack of parental love as a child. His childhood was spent in orphanages where, because of a stutter, he was overlooked by teachers and never learned to read or write. He finally ran away from an institution at the age of 15. "Maybe he felt what he lacked as a boy, he could give to others," Christen said. While Bloomer became a local legend during his years in Johnson City, an Evening Press article in July 1976 discovered that few knew the man behind the gaudy costumes and outrageous trappings. For the last 12 years of his life, Bloomer lived in a small $30-a-month basement apartment in Johnson City. He never married and never had any children. Ironically, the man who brought joy to so many persons at Christmas time usually spent his holiday alone. But, Bloomer never became bitter. He called the testimonial that local residents organized in November 1976 a high point of his life, and added, ''I didn't think I had so many friends, but I have a lot of them.'' Louis Augostini, who organized the testimonial, said he saw Bloomer 10 days ago at the hospital, and "he was preoccupied with expressing thanks to people for everything that's been done for him. “Of course, the real truth is that Harry did a lot for us," Augostini said.  "He was a very unselfish person. Playing Santa Claus was never a money maker for him. Maybe it just gave him a sense of pride to do something for the kids," Augostini added. Bernard Brown, president of the Johnson City Businessmen's Association, said Bloomer was "synonymous with Johnson City." "That was his life[,] to keep people happy...He was terrific. He'll be missed." Jean Kavulich, a friend of Bloomer's for more than 30 years, said simply, "He was the children's idol." Funeral arrangements are being handled by the J.F. Rice Funeral Home in Johnson City. Director James Carey said the home is expecting large crowds during calling hours this afternoon and evening. This evening the Frank A. Johnson American Legion Post, to which Bloomer belonged, will provide a special honor guard. The Last Man's Club (veterans of World War II) will also hold a special service at the home. Bloomer's funeral will be Saturday at 10 A.M. at First Baptist Church in Johnson City. His body will then be taken by a grandnephew, Terrence McCullough, for burial at a cemetery between Marathon and Cortland. McCullough was with Bloomer at the time of his death yesterday. But even though he's gone, Bloomer's memory will live on, his friends said. Morse said, “There is some talk of donating to Roberson Center one of Bloomer's Santa Claus suits and the certificates he received from the Santa Claus School in Michigan (a training school for Santa) that he attended for many years.” [Image caption: Harry Bloomer. Depicts Harry Bloomer facing the camera, garbed in his Uncle Sam costume, and walking up a city street.] For his part, Richard Barrons, curator of history at the center, said he'd welcome this donation. "Harry was a great inspiration to many people," Christen said. Morse noted simply, "He didn't play Santa Claus - he was Santa Claus.'' Article: Blinky the Clown will get the epitaph he wished for By: George Basler Thanks to the efforts of a friend, Harry Bloomer's final wish has come true. For 36 years Bloomer enchanted thousands of area children as Blinky the Clown and Santa Claus. He made a career out of bringing good cheer to others, and in the process became one of Johnson City's most beloved residents. Before he died last April, after a long battle with cancer, Bloomer made two requests: To be buried in his Blinky the Clown outfit because, he said, "As long as I've been a clown there's no harm in going out that way. I just might want to entertain someone on the other side.” And, to have a tombstone placed at his grave, with the simple inscription: "Here lies Blinky the Clown. Doesn't know if he's going up or down. He just has to leave town.” After Bloomer's estate was settled, there was no money left for the tombtone. [Image Caption: Harry Bloomer...in 1976. Depicts a portrait shot of Harry Bloomer in his Uncle Sam costume in a city environment; the white top hat is of prominence.] [Image Caption: Linc Haller polishes the tombstone of his friend, Horry Bloomer. Depicts Linc Haller squatting next to Harry Bloomer’s tombstone in a cemetary, which depicts an artist’s rendition of the character alongside the inscription that Harry wished for.] [Image Taken By: Frank Woodruff] But Howard L. "Linc" Haller, the former owner of the Binghamton-Johnson City Monument Co., remembered a promise he had made to his friend. "For the past 20 years Harry would see me in the post office or on the street, and he'd say, 'Don't forget when I die what I want on my tombstone.' It got to be an old story,” Haller said. “When he had his last sickness, I went up to see him in the hospital and promised him he’d get his wish.” ln July, Haller and Robert Traver, current owner[s] of the monument company, wrote Bloomer's grand-nephew in Syracuse for a picture of Bloomer in his Blinky the Clown outfit so it could be engrav d on the tombstone. They then ordered the tombstone, just like Bloomer wanted it from their factory in Johnstown. The tombstone arrived last week, and next week Haller and Traver will move it to Virgil, where Bloomer’s grave is. Haller made it clear he's not doing this for publicity, but because of the promise he made to Bloomer. He seemed embarrassed by the notoriety. ''Don't play me up too much,'' he said. "I told Harry he would have a marker, and that’s all there is to it.” The granite tombstone has the Blinky the Clown poem and the engraving of Bloomer in his clown costume on one side. On the other side is the simple inscription, “Harry Bloomer. 1907-1978." Haller acknowledged that some people might think the poem is inappropriate for a tombstone, but "that's just what Harry wanted.” And anyone who thinks it's inappropriate didn’t know Bloomer very well. Every Christmas for more than three decades the portly man, dressed in one of his three red[,] velvet suits and a fluffy white beard, walked the village streets handing out candy to the children. He also played Santa Claus for village merchants and clubs[,] and every year visited the Wilson Memorial Hospital pediatrics ward. Besides Kris Kringle, Bloomer also played Peter Rabbit, Uncle Sam during the 1976 Bicentennial, and Blinky the Clown, a character he originated during his years as a circus vendor at fairs thoughout the Southern Tier. He became known as "Mr Santa Claus,” but his own life was far from a fairy tale. A lifelong bachelor, Bloomer worked as a laborer and carnival barker. He spent his early years in an orphanage and his last years in a dingy, $30-a-month basement apartment in Johnson City. Those who knew him said he loved children so much because he was so neglected during his own childhood. Despite the bad breaks life dealt him, Bloomer was a man who enjoyed life, Haller said. “He certainly made a lot of other people enjoy it, kids especially.” Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Harry Bloomer Subject The topic of the resource Bloomer, Harry -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Johnson City (N.Y.); Cortland (N.Y.); Santa Claus Description An account of the resource Harry Bloomer discusses joining the Army as a young man and entertaining the soldiers. Upon being discharged he began working as a Santa Claus for local organizations and continued to do this for the rest of his life. He talks about attending a Santa Claus school annually. He was also a clown and was known as Blinky the Clown. During the Bicentennial he portrayed Uncle Sam. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. 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For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Universal Viewer / Rosetta Rosetta audio media Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Gruss, Michael Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Caganek, Anna Date of Interview 1978-01-05 Subject LCSH Gruss, Michael -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Johnson City (N.Y.); Pennsylvania; Coal mines and mining; Endicott Johnson Corporation--Employees--Interviews; Cigar industry; Polish language; Russian language; Slovak language; Ukrainian language Binghamton Clothing Company; Dr. Mary Ross Date of Digitization 2017-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 33:20 Minutes ; 14:01 Minutes Collection Broome County Oral History Project Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56071">Interview with Michael Gruss</a> Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Michael Gruss Subject The topic of the resource Gruss, Michael -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Johnson City (N.Y.); Pennsylvania; Coal mines and mining; Endicott Johnson Corporation--Employees--Interviews; Cigar industry; Polish language; Russian language; Slovak language; Ukrainian language Description An account of the resource Michael Gruss speaks of his youth in Pennsylvania and working in the coal mines there. He was a licensed black powder blaster and he describes what this entails. He moved to Johnson City in 1913 to work for the Endicott Johnson Corporation and acted as an unofficial labor mediator for the company. He reflects briefly on witnessing the overall factory [Binghamton Clothing Company] fire and trying to help the factory workers. He describes the cigar industry in Binghamton's First Ward and the workers' attempt to unionize. He worked with Dr. Mary Ross as her driver and assisted her on home visits. He was competent in Polish, Russian, Slovak and Ukrainian languages. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fa Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 67 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/f96dd7fa17305c122d51c5736a4f517c.mp3 6c435750b2c14a4c6c6584b33ff00adb Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Gruss, Michael Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Caganek, Anna Date of Interview 1978-01-30 Subject LCSH Gruss, Michael -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Johnson City (N.Y.) Willis Sharpe Kilmer; Swamp Root Medicine Date of Digitization 2017-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 12:35 Minutes Collection Broome County Oral History Project Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56071">Interview with Michael Gruss</a> Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Michael Gruss Interviewed by: Anna Caganek, Dan O'Neil, Joe Newcomb, Nettie Politylo Date of interview: 30 January 1978 Dan: Okay. Uh, when will this be, uh…? Joe: Oh, it’ll be, uh…it’ll be a little while. We’ll let you all know when it’s gonna be out; it’ll probably be a couple’a weeks. Dan: Couple’a weeks? Joe: Couple weeks we get to…permission. That, We’ll have a couple more to talk with, eh…some other people [unintelligible] Michael: And then you’re all through with that. Joe: Yeah, we’re all done for now. Michael: Yeah. Joe: Yeah. Dan: [chuckles] Nettie: That was really interesting, Mr. Gruss. Michael: Now, I thought maybe you’d want a picture there taken of that shrine in the back. Joe: Uh, what’s that? Michael: Huh? Joe: Shrine? Michael: You go toe - go through the- Dan: Y-y-you can show - yeah. You can show him the, the, the shrine; it’s right through the back door there. Michael: Wait, you go right, straight through - you look through that window there. Nettie: Through that window. [Cut to a bit later] Michael: In the town, Vixen. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: And that [unintelligible] was desperately, you know, against anything like that. Because yeah, he was one… [Background noise interruption] Dan: Huh, huh, go ahead. Yeah, it’s on now. Yeah. Yeah… Joe: Yeah, we’ll be going back to the, uh… Annie: Thank you very much. Joe: Back to the office. Annie: I appreciated hearing this story so - Endicott Johnson, especially. History. Michael: How did you like that in the back? That shrine? Annie: That’s part of your handiwork, huh? Joe: That’s very nice. Very nice. Annie: It’s a powerful tree. Michael: You know, I thought maybe if one wanted a picture of that sometime, they could go down and take ‘em. Joe: Yeah, okay. We- [Unintelligible mix of voices] Dan: Have you, eh…have you got any more of these here I could give to Joe? One to Joe? Joe: What’s that? Dan: This is a, this is a pin of the s-Johnson City Arch. Joe: Oh, yeah. Yeah, you got any of those? Nettie: We all got pins, but we all got one, yes. Dan: Yeah. Joe: Oh, did you? Good. Nettie: So you have to have one, too. Michael: There’s you. Dan: That would be for a man. Nettie: For a man, you gotta have the rum. Michael: And, and you just got the one head over, the other head [unintelligible]- Nettie: The rum, Mr. Gruss. Michael: You have to have one of those. [clears throat] Dan: Nah, that’s just- Nettie: This one here. [Unintelligible mix of voices] Michael: No, the, the other [unintelligible]. Mm-hm. Nettie: Oh, yeah. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Yeah. Michael: You got one? Nettie: Yeah, I have a small one. Yeah, I have a small one. Michael: That’s all I get out of 22 pounds. Dan: Yeah [laughing]. Michael: No, I see it. Eh, eh, I’d have to get it for, for every room. Well, anyway…they cost - you see that…it cost, er, the shoes and [unintelligible]- Joe: We don’t know if they can touch. Dan: Brass, isn’t it? Michael: Huh? Dan: Brass, isn’t it? Michael: No. Dan: Brass, probably. Michael: No, it was bronze. Dan: Bronze? Joe: Oh, yeah. Dan: I imagine you could take- [Unintelligible mix of voices] Michael: And I have to get from every room - for all the ages - how many male, how many female. Go to each room, and I put it in an envelope, and put mark that down there, and that’s - put on my suggestion: 10 cents a piece. Dan: Yeah. Michael: And that, that’s what it cost, ebeh, when I, eh, had to mail. Dan: Yeah. Michael: And that’s, everybody got ‘em because everybody was 100 back then for, eh, you know…E. J. Well, you know what they did years ago. My job was, eh - during the wintertime, they - every week there’d be two cargos of oranges or fruit. And, and we had four rows in, eh, Florida, you know. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: E. J.’s. Dan: Yeah. Michael: Yeah, so we, eh…I was down there. Well, Patterson. He used to be the market master. And, eh, they sent two cargos here: One for Endicott, one for Binghamton. Joe: Right. Michael: So they sold the tops. Joe: Right. Michael: 50 cents a pack for your oranges. Three if it was all, all right there on the tree. Because if it was on every car, there had to be two men. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: See, when your left floor - they’re in Florida, when they loaded, they had to put ice in there. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: But, when you got to the cold country, you had to dump the ice. And, uh, light these kerosene lamps to decide - so they wouldn’t freeze. Joe: Do you remember anything about the Kilmer, eh…Swamp Root factory? Michael: The what? Dan: Kilmer Swamp Root? Do you remember anything about the Kilmer Swamp Root? Michael: Oh, yeah. Willis Sharpe Kilmer? Dan: Yeah. Michael: Oh, yes! I knew him good. Dan: Hm, did you? Michael: Everybody said he was a mean - he had that, um…place there, eh…bought up [Route] 17…uh…Sky Lake. Joe: Mm-hm. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: Yes. See, my son was doing some floor work up in there, and I had to have some more tile. Dan: Yeah. Michael: And there come up - drove up in there. And Willis was up in there. And, eh…he said, “You got any business here?” I said, “I sure have.” Said, “I’m bringing some tile up here for my son.” He said, “Who?” I said, “John.” He says, “Is that your son?” I said, “Yes.” “Ooooh!” He grabbed, he said, “Let’s goin’ up in there.” He helped me to carry it there. He had four buildings here and two lakes. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: He said, “Gee.” He says, “I’m glad to meet you. I got every - take ‘em.” He says, “Anytime you wanna come in here, come.” And he said, “The place is yours.” Dan: Uh-huh. Michael: Yeah, he was awful, awful nice. Dan: George, George Ely was his Treasurer. Michael: Huh? Dan: George Ely was his Treasurer. Michael: Yeah. Well… Dan: As I understand it, there was- Michael: I think there was a, eh…wh-where, uh, there’s whatcha call there…? That Slovak cemetery. That whole place, all the way up to the top - that’s where his barns were for his horses. Joe: Did he have a race track there? Michael: Yes - big race track. Dan: That was on Riverside Dr., though? Michael: Riverside Dr. Dan: Yeah. Michael: There was no Riverside Dr. at that time because that was all fenced in up ‘till that hill there. Dan: Yeah. Michael: And there was all barns up in there. You take for instance, eh, the horses. [clears throat] You can see today, they’re all in bronze. Was you ever up to the Kilmer Ceme-Cemetery? Dan: Yeah, that’s, uh, that’s, uh, LaFrance Cemetery on Morgan Rd. Michael: Where? Dan: LaFrance Cemetery on Morgan Rd. Michael: Right. Yeah. Dan: They’ve got a monument to Exterminator. Michael: Exterminator. And the other one there is, eh… Dan: Sun Briar. Michael: Sun Briar. Dan: And, yeah. Michael: That was the fastest horse. That, that, the horse brought him money. Dan: Exterminator won the Derby. Michael: Yeah. Dan: That was a last-minute switch. Michael: Yeah. Dan: Yeah. Michael: He was, he was, you’ll see, you’ll see there’s other animals in there: Dogs, and cats, and everything. Dan: Yeah, yeah. Michael: Am I right? There’s monuments all around there. Dan: [clears throat] He’s got one big plot. Michael: Yeah. Dan: There, it’s very well-kept. Michael: Yep. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: You know, uh…everyone said he was a mean guy, and this and that. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: Well, I didn’t find him that way. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: What other association did you have with him? Michael: Wi’im? Joe: Yeah. Michael: Not - no kind of a personal association at all. Joe: I see, I just wanted to- Michael: It was just that way. Joe: Yeah. Michael: Meet him that way, and I always found him very, very good. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: Because you see, uh, here, when he died? Everybody was, yelled that there were out, said this and that. They told me, they said, “Well, why don’t you put your name in there? You’ll get something, anyway.” I said, “No, I don’t want anything.” Nettie: [laughs] Michael: “Don’t want anything that don’t belong to me.” But I’ll tell you, as far I was concerned? I thought Willis Sharpe Kilmer was a very good man. Dan: Yeah. Joe: Now, did he found the company or was it his father? Michael: Huh? Joe: Did he found the company or was it his father? Michael: Well, I’ll tell you the truth about it. He had a brother. And his brother, ah, eh, made that swamp root medicine. Dan: Right. Michael: Am I right? Dan: Right. Michael: I mean, he stole the patent. Dan: That’s right. That’s, that’s where he- Joe: Who, who did, now? Michael: Willis. Dan: Wi-Wi-Willis and his father- Michael: [chuckles] Dan: -stole the patent from [chuckles] the uncle. Michael: Am I right? Dan: Right. Joe: Well, wa-was it his father or was it Willis? Michael: It’s his brother. Joe: Yeah. But, who stole the patent? Michael: Willis stole it from his brother. Joe: I see, alright. Okay. Dan & Nettie: [chuckles] Michael: You see, they had to, whatcha call it…? Had it, eh…you know, to have, eh, have patents made, it’s quite tricky. Nettie: Right. Joe: Yeah. Now, who’s - who was Dr. Kilmer? The one they used in the advertising? They called it, “Dr. Kilmer.” Now, that was- Michael: That was Willis Sharpe. Annie: Thank you. Joe: Oh, was that Willis? Dan: Yeah, the thing- Annie: -we can talk to you then. Dan: Okay. Annie: Thank you very much for letting us- Michael: Yeah, it was nice here. Annie: Thank you. Michael: Yeah. Good talking to you. Annie: We’ll talk to you soon. Joe: Thank you. Annie: Bye, nice to meet you. Joe: We’ll let you know if there’s good - we’ll let you know if this is going to be on so you can watch yourself. [Shared laughter] Annie: We’ll tell you when. Okay? Michael: Well, that’s, that’s the whole story. [Unintelligible voices] Dan: I, I, uh, I’ve got, uh, I’ve got that on another tape. Uh, uh, about the, uh… Joe: Do you? Of Kilmer? Dan: Kilmer, yeah. Joe: Oh, okay. Dan: Stealin’ that, stealin’ that- Joe: Alright. Dan: -eh, patent. But, eh, as I understand, of course, in those days- Michael: You didn’t know it was a swamp root, did you? Dan: Eh, yeah, yes, I knew it was not a swamp root. But, eh, in those days, advertising was such that it was, eh, eh, it was, it was shady. In other words, somebody would send me on, and would advertise a yard of soap for 10 cents. Michael: Yeah. Dan: So you’d send in your 10 cents and they’d send you a, a yard of soap thread. Michael: Well… Joe: Yeah, it was- Michael: The thing is, know you take places like the First Ward. That’s where everybody came here to do their shopping. Everybody from whole [sic] Binghamton. Dan: Mm-hm. Michael: ‘Cause they had the stuff they needed. And you take for instance Dr. Mary Ross…she was 100%, she was, uh, as I said before, on maternity cases. Joe: Yeah. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Well, I think we- Michael: And I couldn’t turn anybody down. I couldn’t, you know? People were poor. There was a lot of poor ones who, they- Dan: [clears throat] Michael: But, I still say what they love - what we need over here…we need a good shopping center and a good drug store. We have no drug store. Dan: No. Joe: You keep plugging that. Michael: Huh? Joe: You- [Tape cuts to sometime later] Dan: This concludes a televised interview with Mr. Michael Gruss of 10 Phelps St., Binghamton, New York. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. 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Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Levine, Herbert Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Politylo, Nettie Date of Interview 1978-09-15 Subject LCSH Levine, Herbert -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Immigrants; Endicott (N.Y.); Russians -- United States; Jews; Syracuse University; Korean War, 1950-1953; Jewelry trade; Jewelry stores Ruby and Sons; Van Cotts Date of Digitization 2017-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 33:42 Minutes ; 14:36 Minutes ; 21:13 Minutes Collection Broome County Oral History Project Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56078">Interview with Herbert Levine</a> Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Herbert Levine Interviewed by: Nettie Politylo Date of interview: 15 September 1978 Nettie: This is Nettie Politylo, interviewer, talking to Herbert Levine of Hazard Hill Rd., Binghamton, [New York] on September 15, 1978. Herbert: Is the microphone in here? Nettie: Herb, will you tell us about your life and experiences in the community?  Herbert: Yeah, well, let me just use this as a guide. Okay? [clears throat] Um, first, I think we ought to talk about my father's background in, uh…in Europe. My father was born in Kharkov in Russia, actually the Ukraine. And, um…as a youngster, the family later moved to Kiev - where he grew up. My father went to school until age 12 or 13. He went to a Russian school during the day, and at 3:00 in the afternoon went to a Hebrew school where he learned to read Hebrew and to, uh, learn about the, you know, prayers of the Jewish religion. After, um….after leaving school, at about 13 years of age, he  went to work as an, uh, an apprentice to a German jeweler who lived in Russia - and just as we used to read about in the days of Charles Dickens, he lived in this man's place and slept on the floor and ate the food that was left over and that's, that’s what he did. And, ah, it's hard for us today to visualize just how they treated, eh, someone who was an apprentice. But he, he told of how one time he looked over the man's shoulder as he was working on a watch and fixing a watch - and the guy just knocked him for a loop and said, "Lookit: When I'm ready to have you know what I'm doing - I'll show you. Until then, you just sweep the floor and do what you're supposed to do." So, so that's what it was. Um, [clears throat] part of the interesting background that my father's family was that his mother died when he was eight years old, leaving four children. Uh, for a father to bring up four young children in, in Europe at that time was almost impossible, so he married a woman who was a widow. And she had four children. So together, there was, eh, four of our kids, and four, uh…four of my kids, four of your kids [laughs], and then they had three children. So there was a family of 11…uh, let me see…10 of whom came here. 10 children and a mother and father left Russia in 1905 to, uh, come to America. Uh, the reason they left Russia at that time was that, uh, unrest was already beginning. The workers were beginning to march in protest against  the Czar - the seeds of the rebellion, the revolution was starting. There was a  tremendous pressure against the Jewish community. My father tells of meeting out in the woods where they had protest meetings, complaining about the Czar, and what they're doing, and how the Cossacks used to come riding on horses with whips and swinging, uh, whips around their heads and chasing the people through the woods after them, so they used to, used to get out. So the young, Jewish people, at that time, were conscripted into the army - were just drafted into  the army - were put into the army for 20 - 25 years. His grandfather, he  recalled, who lived with them as a boy, 10 - 12 years old was conscripted  into the Russian army and served in the Russian army for 25 years. During  this period of time, on numerous occasions, uh, somebody, I don't know who - whether they be soldiers, whatever - were interested in converting him to Christianity. And to make him bow down to the cross. Well, one of the facets, tenets of the Jewish religion, is that our interpretation of the Ten Commandments is that you don't bow down to anything, and it means don't bow down. So it means Jewish people don't bow. And he - my father's grandfather - used  to show us the whip marks - scars on his back where he was whipped - to try to make him bow down and he just wouldn't do it. Never did. And so, that, that certainly re-enforced their, ah, feelings of religion because if their grandfather suffered through that, there’s something that you weren't going to give up in a hurry. But, he left Russia at the age 15 - together with, uh, with all his family. And they left, came, you know, steerage - they took every, almost all the money they had, um, to pay for their way to come to America. And, um, and to America, they came. They landed in Ellis Island, as did most of the immigrants at that time: 1905. And there was a slight problem with my father's health. They checked his lungs and they weren’t too happy about it; they were almost to send them back  because they were concerned about TB - tuberculosis. But, they finally let  him through. When they came to America, they were greeted by some sort of a cousin, distant cousin or something who was going to set him up in business. And they gave him whatever money they had left and he just ran off with it. So that took care of all the money they had. Like many immigrants at that time, they settled in the lower East Side of New York City. All these people - 10 children and a father and mother - in a little, tiny apartment. And everybody went out to get a job. My father, having worked in a jewelry business, went to work at age 15 in a factory, in a jewelry factory that made watch cases - pocket watch cases. And he was a polisher, just as you see a guy working on shoes in E.J. polishing all day long? That's what he did; he worked on a polishing machine. We have to realize, at this time, that he came here speaking only Russian, Ukrainian and German - those were the only languages he knew at 15 when he came here. So, uh, he went to night school in New York City to learn English to be able to get along as best he could. Incidentally, they never spoke Jewish or Yiddish because the Russian Jews who came to America thought it was nekaltoorne - it was not cultured to speak a low language like Yiddish. So in their homes, they spoke Russian. And they continued to. So at age 15, he, he worked in this factory. And, uh, did for a couple, three years until he started having trouble with his lungs. It was working in the sweatshop with no ventilation and so for forth - it wasn't good for his health. So his father suggested to him he oughta work outside where it's, uh, health, er, healthy and vigorous. So my dad went to a school that was organized at that time by a Baron de Hirsch - was a wealthy Jewish philanthropist - set up a school to teach agriculture in New Jersey. And went to this agriculture school for two years, studying agriculture and  horticulture. He said he didn't do too well in the theoretical parts of it because he did have trouble in the reading and writing, but when it came to the practical year - working with trees, vegetables, and so forth - he was top of his class. After taking this training, he was placed on a farm up near Rochester. And he worked on this farm, but he really found out that the farm life wasn't for him. He could remember that the farmer paid him very little and, and he really didn’t get much to eat. And he tells me how they used to go into the chicken coop and take a little pin prick and pick, prick a couple holes in the eggs, and- Nettie: [chuckles] Herbert: [chuckling] suck out the eggs, and put it back, in the egg, in the egg shell, back in the chicken's nest. Whatever.  But that, that didn't work out too well; he really didn't enjoy being a farmer. And so he went to Syracuse at this time. And his older brother - my uncle - married a woman in Syracuse whose family was in the jewelry business. And they were in the jewelry business such that they did business house to house - face to face with people. Not just in Syracuse, but around the upstate New York area. So my father was given a route and he went out with a suitcase full of jewelry. And he went one day to Rome, to Ilion, to Herkimer - in that general neck of the woods. And he developed a route, just like the Jewel Tea man did. Went to people's homes, and met them, and spoke with them. Now, one of the advantages that he had was his ability with languages because he came to America speaking Russian and Ukrainian very easily. He was able to pick up other Slovak languages enough to get along - Polish and Slovak. Uh, he spoke German because he had a background in German, and it wasn't too long before he was able to pick up Italian. And he was able to get along and, and…and if he didn't know what a word was, he would just show a thing to a person - an earring, necklace, whatever - he had to learn these words, you know. And the people told him what it was, you know. Koletso [sic]. He knew what it was, but in, in Italian they told him what a ring was, what an earring was. So he was able to sell the thing. In those days credit was very important because, uh, these were just working people, really. And, uh…so, they would buy something and pay for it a little bit each week - you would come back  to see them [cough], you were invited in the home - if a christening, a wedding or  birthday or gift was coming up or something, they would say to him, "Ruby, why don't  you bring something next week because I have a special gift coming up?"  My father's name was Rubin Levine - uh, Ruven (R-U-V-E-N), I guess is how it, how it was in Russian. And we have his birth certificate, and it’s interesting to see the name Levine spelled in Russian - because Levine in Russian is spelled with five letters (L-A-V-E-N). “E” is a hard sound; an “e”, a Russian “e,” is a hard sound, “e.” There was a meakhnozak [sic] at the end, you know? Nettie: Yes. Herbert: But anyway, there was a hard “e” sound. And so today, when you see people's names - “Levine,” sometimes it appears as “Levin” (L-E-V-I-N) because they just took one letter from each letter in the Russian alphabet and called it “Levine.” And it came out in English, “Levin.” To make it sound like “Levine,” in our case, they put a [sic] “e” on the end. So it would, instead of…it really sounds like “Leh-vine...” Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: If you pronounce it exactly. Some people spell it  L-E-V-E-N-E, with an “e” on the end. Nettie: Oh, nice. Herbert: Maybe keeping it “Levine.” But I, I've asked him if it ever was Levinsky or anything like it, but it  wasn't Levinsky. It was really Levine, which is an old, old Hebrew word; it comes from the Levites. The Levites, if you read the first testament, they were priests and Levites who took care of the Temple in the early days. And that's where the names Levi; Livi; Levin; Levine comes from - sort of a historic thing. But, [clears throat] where were we? He, he was working in Syracu-out of Syracuse, traveling to Ilion, Rome, so forth, when World War I came along. And, uh, having never served in the Army - boom! - first thing you know - away he went. Uh, let's just see what it was [clears throat] - in 1917, I think, 1917 or 1918 is when he went. So he went into the army at 27 - 28 years of age - no youngster. And, uh, went through training, was assigned to a machine gun battalion, was sent to France. In France, uh, he learned French because he had this ability to pick up languages. Uh, spent some time in France. He was wounded; received the Purple Heart. Spent some time in the hospital in France. And, uh, came back finally. And, ‘bout a year and half later, in 1919. Uh, from the army, a veteran. Decided, well, maybe he would go back to Syracuse where he left off and go into business - in the jewelry business. Uh, lo and behold, he found that, number one: He was replaced. [chuckles] There was a man who was traveling the same route that he was and he told everybody he was Ruby's brother. “Ruby’s in the army - I'll ta-I’ll take care, I’m his brother.” So he stole all of his customers; this guy took all his customers. Secondly, his actual brother, who was  the son-in-law in this business, wasn't that happy with him coming back to settle permanently in Syracuse. So my father heard of the Triple Cities - he heard of this place, you know, eight-80 miles away from Syracuse that was filled with shoe workers, and new immigrants, and workers, and there was, uh, a busy, thriving, growing community. So in the spring of 1919, 1919…he came to Binghamton. And he, uh, had a house - had a room, lived in a rooming house. I guess on Carroll St./Susquehanna St., someplace. And he opened up an office in the Press Building. At that time, there were many jewelers operating out of the Press Building - some with little shops, there manufacturing jewelers, watch makers - and he decided he would start from scratch. And, and as he did before out of the Syracuse area, he went house to house, people's homes- introduced himself; came in; sat down; told them he was a jeweler; he would be happy to sell them things; had nice things - and through his personality and his ability to get along, speaking all of these seven or eight languages…it was easy for him to make contact with, with, uh, immigrants. And, and by treating people fairly and honestly, little by little, his reputation  grew as an honest man. And, uh, and his business became established. He met my mother in  the early 20's…and, uh, [clears throat] let's see…1922, [cough] moved to Endicott. He decided Endicott didn't have anywhere as many jewelers as Binghamton did and perhaps, it  would be better to be in a smaller community and be more important than being  in Binghamton with a lot of jewelers. So, he came to Binghamton - opened a business and still continued to go visiting his customers door to door. However, i-it was difficult- tough on his stomach because in those days everybody made their own wine. And [coughs] when you were invited into someone's house, you had to accept their hospitality, and accepting their hospitality meant drinking whatever they had to offer was. After doing that eight - 10 - 15 times, you came home upset to your stomach and pretty sick. And my mother said, "Hey, you better cut this out. If you’re gonna be in business, these people better come see you. If they're not interested enough in comin’ to see you, then [chuckles] that's just too bad." Nettie: [chuckles] Herbert: So, so he stopped going out house to house. Maybe did on Sundays, but he, uh, but he did…uh, organize his own business and had a business where people came to him. One of his first drivers was a, a young man who liked to drive a car. His name was Sammy Moriello. Now, I don't know if you remember the name. But, he was a very notable youngster in Endicott's history. He was a, a [sic] Air Force ace. He was a pilot and, and an ace - I don’t know how many planes you had to shoot down. I think he was later killed flying. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: But, he was, ah, he used to drive my father from house to house and door to door so that he was able to, uh, have more freedom to take care of his business and his customers. During this period of time, you know, in the early 20s - Endicott was  sort of rough and tumble. There were all kinds of things going on, and it probably wasn’t the most, uh, civil, organized, uh, community way of life. If there was a police chief with one or two policemen, that was probably a lot. And there was a lot of robbery and, and such things going on. [coughs] He told a story, one day, of going to someone's home, he knocked on the door, and the man lets him in - some place on the north side of Endicott - and the man…my father has a little suitcase full of jewelry. The man pulls out a gun and points it to my father, and he says, "You know, Ruby?” He says, “I could let you have it right now.” He said, “But, I'm not going to because they told me that you’re a [sic] okay guy and to leave you alone." And so, that's just what they did. They, uh, they did leave him alone and never bothered him. Throughout the many years that I worked with my dad in 1953 - 1965, uh, I used to ask him about those times and what went on. And of course, he could understand everything everybody spoke: He could understand Italian; Russian; Polish; Slovak. Many people were speaking Italian…but he never repeated stories. I used to ask him  about Barbara and what- Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: -went on in those days, but he never used to talk about it. He said, "Some things you listen and ya, and you don't repeat.” And he said, “That’s how you [laughs] get along in this world." Nettie: [laughs] Herbert: And, and so, that's, that’s what he did. Um, just briefly on my mother's background - she was born in Syracuse. Her family came to America. Perhaps, uh, 20 years before my father's family did, coming from Austria-Hungary. And this family, also, again, 10 children. Her mother and father came and settled in Syracuse, New York…and, uh, were brought up there. These children had much more of an education. My mother went to high school; graduated from high school; worked as a secretary in the Syracuse area before coming to Binghamton. So, uh, culturally, uh, they were on a different plateau. Uh, they spoke Yiddish in their home. Especially when my grandfather died at an early age. But, the grandmother spoke to her Jewish and Yiddish quite often. Um, so my mother certainly had no ability to speak foreign languages other than, uh, a little bit of Jewish and, uh, and English. In our home growing up, the youngsters once in a while, the only time they ever resorted to a foreign language is when they didn't the children to understand. Nettie: [chuckles] Herbert: As happens in, in so many families. From the beginning, I think my father's whole concept of business was to present a feeling of interest in his customers. That he was concerned about them - that he gonna treat them right and be honest. And, and, uh…to his very last year, as I can recall in Endicott talking to people as we stood there, standing beside him - and, and he told customers in whatever language that he was speaking that he wasn't going to leave his children a million dollars, but he was going to leave them an honest name. And, and this was really his, uh, his whole concept. And I think, you know, a very valid one for, uh, for running a business today. Uh, my dad was very much involved in the community. Uh, during the war years, I recall…well, let's go back. He, he became a Mason and was involved in Masonry, which was a, a very big thing. Interestingly enough, although Masonry was a very strong Protestant movement, Masonry did allow Jewish people to belong to it. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: Catholic people didn't, but Jewish people did. And, uh, and so, at Round Hill Lodge in Endicott, my father became very much involved - was in Consistory, a member of the shrine, and took much pride in, in participating. I can recall that, ah, my father always was interested in going to adult education courses in UE High School, way, way back. Uh, courses were given on current events, and world politics, and national politics. And, and, uh, rarely did he miss attending one of those types of courses. Like many people who, uh, came up from nothing, my  father knew very little about hobbies. He didn't play cards, play golf, gamble - he, he really just, uh, worked. Had a little garden - took care of his garden. And, uh, between the energies that he consumed - bringing up his family; being a father; and working; and taking care of his house...that, that took care of everything. Uh, in those days, of course, a six day week existed in a retail business. There was no such thing as a vacation. We never went on a vacation for a week or two because to go on a vacation would’ve meant to close the business and that, that just was never done. So I have to admire greatly those people who came before us, such as my father and,and his many friends and customers. Because, you know, these people were of two worlds and of two cultures. They lived in, in America, in Endicott. And they were able to keep up with the problems of  the community, and the state, and the nation, and so forth. But at the same time, they never lost touch with what happened in the Old World. And they were able to talk with someone about Europe, and what went on there and what is going on there - at the same time as keeping track of what was going on in America. They lived in two worlds. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: And sometimes, we, who have an opportunity to go to college, uh, think that we have it all, but we really don't. We probably have, ah, just a finger, thumbnail full of background of knowledge compared to what these people did who were have enough, you know, to pick up their whole family. 10 children, a husband and wife - go to a place where they couldn't even speak the language and didn't know what was ahead of them. It was, uh, an amazing - it was an amazing chore, but everybody did it in those days. I guess, I guess it, you just took a chance. Today, people are worried about moving to Charlotte, North Carolina; and they’re debating and going - and you know, it's a, it’s a big challenge. Here, people left to go to a new country. And didn't know what was ahead of ‘em - didn't know, didn’t know what was coming  Uh…now, how did I happen to end where I am?  Uh, I went to college in Syracuse University in 1945. And, uh, my parents thought that certainly, anyone who is able ought to go to college and be educated and be something. My father said, "Well, why don't you become an optometrist? Ya know?” Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: “And I'll put a little place for ya in the back of the store. I'll tell all my friends-” Nettie: [laughs] Herbert: “-you know, my son’s here, you’ll take care of him." In those days, Rudolph's had an optometrist - uh, you used to get your glasses in a jewelry store. That was the thing to do. Hilkins, which was one of the oldest - the oldest jewelry store in Endicott - was originally an optical place and a jeweler. That's what Mr. Hilkins needs, an optician; and that's how they got into business. So in those days, at least on that particular point, I didn't argue. So I went to Syracuse University and took the necessary courses to go to study optometry at Columbia University. In those days, you went to college for two years and then studied optometry for two years.  And so, I underwent some courses in math; in calculus; in physics; in chemistry; in scientific German; whatever I needed to do. And, uh, applied to get into Columbia. Just at the time I applied, all the veterans were returning  from the war, and I was a youngster who just went to college at just being, just a little over16 years old…so that I was only 18 years when all the veterans of 24 - 5 - 6 - 8 were coming out of the service. They were given preference and I didn't get in. I really wasn't too sad because I, I really [laughs]…it wasn't my idea in the first place - it was father's. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: So I continued my education, and majored in sociology which I found very interesting, and studied about world population problems and, and ethnic backgrounds and all the things that we’re interested in today. Juvenile delinquency, criminology, and so forth. It, it was an interesting way to, to see life. I was very much involved in the  campus activities, and the dean knew my name, and the chancellor knew my name. And, however, very - hardly a teacher knew who I was. I wasn't the most excellent student. But, upon graduation, I thought certainly the world had - is looking for a guy  like me with all these talents, and abilities, and so forth. And, and I went out to look for a job. During this period of time, I’d met the girl who later became my wife, and, uh, she was interested in seeing me get established and get going. And so, the pressure was on. So upon graduation from college, I had to do something. And lo and behold, there weren't too many jobs available in 1949. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: But, uh, because I helped my father after school, and a, maybe couple summer vacations, in the jewelry business, I ended up getting a job with Kay Jewelers. Which at the time had its headquarters in Washington, D. C. In 1949, Kay Jewelers was the largest jewelry chain in the country. And they had a training  program for young people, such as myself. So, so I went to Rochester, N. Y. where I went to work as a trainee for $45.00 a week. And I worked six days a week; the store was open two nights and we trimmed a window one night. So I worked three nights a week and our manager liked to work every Sunday morning. So I worked every Sunday morning as well. So that was an interesting introduction to how- [Both laugh] Herbert: -how to have to work for a living. I didn't have a car, and I used to ride back and forth on a bus and lived in a room in a rooming house. And many times didn't talk to anybody from the day I left the s-time I left the store ‘till the next morning. Because I'd go to a restaurant and have something to eat, went home, and went to a movie, and that’s about it. But a year later, I was married. My wife and I settled in, in Rochester and she worked across the street in the Girl Scout office, and I in the, in the Kay Jewelers. And there I was until I was rescued from this terrible fate because I really didn't enjoy the level of the business. It was a credit business doing business with, um, uh, the black population. At that time, I felt they were really being taken advantage of - 50¢ down, 50¢ a week, selling things to people who couldn't afford it. It was, uh, it was not a nice thing to get off. But I was rescued by all this by Uncle Sam who said, "You'd better come with  me," because Korea had just started and I was about to get drafted. So I entered the U.S. Coast Guard where I went to Officer Candidate School - later became an officer and skipper of a Coast Guard cutter in Norfolk, Virginia. I stayed in  Norfolk, Virginia for two years. Didn't know quite what to do - maybe I’d go to law school, maybe I’d do something; go back to get a graduate degree in business. When my father wrote me a note one day- Nettie: [clears throat] Herbert: -that he was going to buy a jewelry store - Abraham’s Jewelry and, and Luggage Store - on Chenango St. And said, “You’ll come home - we'll have a second store, you’ll be en [sic], it’ll be terrific.” So we made plans to come to Endicott, and to move there, and to settle. And now we have a youngster: Our oldest son, uh, Rick. And we were all set to come when my dad called to say, “The deal fell through, but come here, anyway.” So come home, anyway, we did. And we lived in Endicott in a, on a house on McKinley Avenue. I went to work joining my father’s business in 1953. I stayed with him, working with him side by side from 1953 until he died in 1965. Our, after our parents died in ‘55 and ‘56, my brother and I remained owners of Ruby & Sons. And in 1969, uh, Kenneth Van Cott had decided to retire. At first, my brother Carl and I were both going to, uh, buy this store and run them together. But, as we worked out the details, it appeared that we would be much better off if, uh, each of us had our own business. So I bought Van Cott's, selling my interest to the Endicott store to Carl. So as of the past nine years, Carl owns Ruby & Sons and I own Van Cott' s, and we're best friends, and it works out, works out very, very good. Um, after getting involved in the jewelry business, one of the first things I did was to  start taking courses in gemology and diamond study because it appeared to me from the very start that, that Mr. Van Cott had the right approach on the, on the jewelry business. He was a professional and he was an expert; he was a registered jeweler in the American Gem Society. And it appeared that that's the kind of person you should be: If you’re going to be a jeweler, be first class in all the way. So we sort of copied everything he did in, in organizing our store and changing it from a credit store to what we call a fine jewelry store. And so we copied everything in Endicott to make our store as close as it could be to Van Cott’s. So now our two stores are similar in character. Uh, Van Cott's still has a tradition that goes way back to the early 1900s as the- Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: -quality store in Binghamton. And we still have customers coming in, uh, as a result of that. But we, I did become a registered jeweler in the American Gem Society, and for a number of years it was just Mr. Van Cott and myself who held this title. Today in our store we have two other young men plus myself who hold the title of, uh, of registered jeweler. Nettie: [coughs] Herbert: At the present time, I am on a board of directors at the American Gem Society- one of 12 jewelers in the whole country who was elected to this post. I am also serving this year as president of the New York State Retail Jewelers’ Association, uh, for the second year in a row. So I think being involved in, in organizations and in the jewelry business is very much important. Incidentally, uh, there's a third generation of Levine’s involved in the, the jewelry. Our son, Bill, who graduated from Syracuse University two years ago, is now in California at the Gemological Institute of America where he teaches  courses in diamond study and diamond grading. People from all over the world come to take these courses. And he's been there now going on two years and enjoys very much what he’s doing. He's become quite a speaker and traveled to Kansas, and to Missouri - addressing retail jewelers’ groups on how important it is to be a professional jeweler and, and have the knowledge and ability that is required to grade diamonds and gem stones. The jewelry business today keeps going on, and will go on forever because from day one - from the very first time when a primitive cave man looked down and saw a shiny pebble that shined just a little bit more than the rest, he put it in his little pouch  and saved it because it looked special. And if he liked someone extra special, maybe he even gave that little, beautiful, polished stone to him or to her to show his feelings. And jewelry throughout the years has done the, just that: It has conveyed people's feelings and emotions. I'm not sure that people even felt stronger about how much they would put into a piece jewelry years ago than today. My father had told me how to give, to be a godparent of a child was a very big  thing a couple generations ago - 50 years ago. When you were named as the godparent of a child, it was an honor that, that you know - above everything. You bought all of the children's  clothes, and you did everything and, and…if he was a boy, you bought him a pocket watch. And my father would tell me how people would buy a beautiful pocket watch - which today are back in style - and people would spend $50.00. $50.00 on a solid gold pocket watch. And these people didn't make good…$20.00 a week. Can you  imagine that? They spent 2 and a half weeks’ money on a christening gift. That’s today like giving somebody - I don't know - a $500.00 christening gift. You wouldn’t think of it. So…I'm not so sure that even though we give jewelry today, I don't think we stretch our, the limits of our involvement as much as we did way back when, when we realized that we wanted to give something extra special. And it would be nothing - I can recall in the early 50s when we did a lot of business with Endicott Johnson workers - for an Endicott Johnson worker to buy a Christmas gift for $50…for wife or husband to give a gift to each other…and in those days, usually both people worked in the factory. And they came in on a Friday afternoon with their paycheck; Friday afternoon, they came in and paid on their account with their paycheck, and they cashed their checks. Rarely was the check over $50.00. And they paid $1.00 on  their account. They paid $1.00. It would take a whole year to pay for their Christmas gift. And they never missed a week because the Endicott Johnson people had this  reputation for being most credit-worthy and being very, very responsible. For, uh, even though they didn’t make big incomes, when they accepted an obligation, they accepted it, uh, very wholeheartedly. And they very rarely backed down on it. One time, though, he, my father told me of an incident where a man didn't - wasn't quite so honest. And he bought one of these big, beautiful pocket watches I'm talking about which was $100.00 with chain and gold chain, a pocket watch. And…he sold it. My father sold it on credit, as he often did - this is without a credit bureau - nobody called the credit bureau, [laughs] nobody called anything. you looked at a guy - he looked honest, he worked at E.J., so you trusted him. What the heck! But o and behold, the next week, a man came in to my father and said, "Ruby, did you sell a pocket watch to such-and-such a fellow's name?" And he said, "Sure." He says, "Well, you know, he's going back to the Old Country for good. He's leaving town and he's not corning back, and he's taking your watch with him." Well, $100.00 is a lot of money, especially in those days. So my father got on the very early morning Erie train at 4 o’clock in the morning, rode all the way to New York City where the man had told him the name of the ship that this man was going to sail on. So he got there to the ship where the people were loading up - and lo and behold! There's the man. My father said, "What's the big idea? Where's my watch?" It was right there in his pocket. He said, "What kind of guy are you to take - steal that watch from me- take it all the way to Europe?" So he got his watch back. Another interesting story he told is: In 1934, one day, he got a call in the middle of the night from the police department that his store was broken into on Washington Ave. So that, uh, they went down and that’s just what happened; the front door was broken, people gained entrance to the store, and many of the rings, watches, and so forth were in trade, were all taken, strewn around. Almost everything was missing. Well, you didn't have insurance - at least, he didn't have insurance to cover himself that day, and he was really sick. However, the next day, he had a visit from a man, friend, a customer. And he said, "Ruby.” He said, "I know who robbed your store." He said, "And I'll tell you who it is." He said, "I was having a drink in a restaurant last night, and I heard these two fellas talking about doing a job.” “They were gonna do a job? Well, what were they gonna do?” And he [the customer] said, “I don’t know nothin’. They never mentioned the name of the place. But he said, “I’m sure that’s the people." So he told him who it was. And they were arrested, and they were able to recover, uh, some of the things. [phone interruption] Hello? Hello? [hangs up phone] So that was just another instance where my father's, uh, friendly relationships with people, you know, was, was such that, uh… Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: It, it really helped him. And, and, and I think that's probably the most important factor, uh, in the life of those people who, like himself, came and settled in a new country in the early 1900s. They came without a formal background, a formal education, but they, they had a sense of pride and responsibility. Um, when the American Legion had a parade, when Fourth of July came, or Veteran's Day, Memorial Day - it was a big thing. It was a big thing in Endicott and everybody was there. And even though these people, uh, didn't have roots that went back to the, to the Declaration of Independence in 1776, or the Civil War, or anything else… Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: I think these new immigrants felt more strongly about the pride in their country. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: And respect to the flag than, than many of  our children feel today. They take it for granted; we all, we all take it for granted. Um, growing up in Endicott was an interesting experience, and quite often I'm approached by people who are studying economics, and they hear about the terrible monopoly that existed in Endicott when the Johnson family took advantage of all the people, and re-surfed them, and became now - wealthy and millionaires. And I disagree with them heartly [sic] because growing up in Endicott as I did, I don't remember depressions or breadlines…I can remember a couple times people came to our house for something to eat, and my mother would say, "Well, why don't you rake up the leaves and do something?" So they didn’t feel like they were beggars. And, and they would do a little bit of work. And for that, in return she would give them something to eat. But, um…yeah, I think it was just a warm, friendly relationship. People used to sit on the front porches. This is a thing gone - of sitting on a front porch and saying "hello" to your neighbors, and talking to people as they wen up and down the street. Across the street from Endicott…ah, ah, in Endicott on McKinley Ave. was a little bend in McKinley Ave. where an alley is. An, an area was set up there where men used to pitch quoits every night. I don't know if you remember a family - Sutton. Sutton owned a drug store and there was a man named Kent who was an IBM’er…and a man named Bradley. Worked in the tannery; his son, Bob Bradley is head of Maine-Endwell. I think, uh, [of its] physical education department. His son, Tom, has a bar - redheaded - has a bar- Nettie: Yeah. Herbert: -on Arthur Ave., someplace. Anyway, they used to pitch quoits every night. And they went to Nanticoke Creek - we used to call that Nanticoke Crick. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: And I still do. And they got clay and they, they made these, uh, pits. And as youngsters, we used to sit there, they used to play, and we would keep score. Well, this was, this was sort of a community get-together. Everybody went there and, and it was just an informal get-together. But, everyone knew everyone. And I can recall as a youngster that you could go from one block - from Monroe St. to Broad St., behind all the houses on McKinley Ave. There wasn't a fence; there wasn't a fence. And little by little, the fences started coming - and the shrubs and the hedges. Whereas today, you know, we live in the backyard society. Now, if you want to have sun you, you sit in the backyard. And when you’re there, you don't see anybody and nobody sees you. That’s the way we live today. But, growing up in Endicott as we did, you sat on the front porch and watched everyone go by - it was a wonderful  institution. But, getting back to the Johnsons…when we went to a band concert on Sun, on Sunday night, as everybody did, and Mr. George F. used to come, sit in the front row and pass out nickels, or shake hands, or whatever he did…um, he didn't have a body guard that I know of. I don't think anybody was worried he would be shot, or hurt, or anything. Because he really, uh…the people had a love and respect for him. Everybody knew that his door was open; if you had a problem, you went to see Mr. George F. And if you wanted to have a church, a handful of families got together and said, "Look: We'd like to pray in our own, certain way.” And he said, "How much money do you need?" And you had a church. And when the people in the  American Legion wanted to have an American Legion, he said, “Here’s, here’s the money. You know? Build one.” And they had one in Endicott, one in West Endicott, one in Johnson City - wherever they wanted. He saw to it that, uh, the people's basic needs were provided for. It’s amazing how he understood people's basic needs. He knew they wanted their own home, a place to raise a garden, a place for recreation - built these beautiful parks and golf courses. I mean, who would ever think that the best golfers in Endicott 40 years ago used to be fellas who worked in the tannery? And they got out at 1 o'clock because they did all their work, and they used to go, and they used to go to play golf. The best golfers in Endicott used to work in the tannery. I mean, it’s unheard of. Today we think of people at a fancy Country Club who are going to be golfers - you know, the millionaires? In those days, it was the big strong fellows that could pull those hides out of the tanks and had all afternoon to learn to play golf. So that it, uh…it was a wonderful heritage growing up in Endicott. Uh, I think it was a melting pot - people of all, uh, backgrounds, uh, felt that they had something in common. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: And, uh, they shared and helped one another. I don't think there was tremendous bigotry. Uh, growing up as a person of the Jewish religion in Endicott, it was  certainly a tremendous minority. One thing I can remember most vividly is that, in eighth grade, we used to take a course called, “civics.” We used to have to take, “civics” and “citizenship.” It, it was always frightening because those were the first two regents things you took before ninth grade. And everybody had to take civics and citizenship. And I could remember in one of the courses - civics or citizenship - the teacher was trying to have us understand that, the concept of a melting pot. How America consisted of all these people from all different backgrounds who sort of came together. And she said, "You know? It would be a fun experiment if we could see right here in our class what countries are the backgrounds people came from.” So she said, “Let's try this: I'm going to mention these countries, and if you have a parent who came from one of these countries, why don’t you stand up and we’ll see what it is." So she mentioned England - a few people stood up. You know, Scotland; Ireland; Germany; Italy; Czechoslovakia. And they finally got to Russia. And she said, you know, "Anybody's parents who’re from Russia, stand up." And I stood up. Along with four, five, or six kids. And these kids looked at me and said, "Why are you standing up? You're not Russian! You’re Jewish." Nettie: [laughter] Herbert: So it was hard for them to understand that in Russia, some people were Jewish, too. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: They weren’t just, uh, Russian Orthodox or whatever church the Russian people belong to. But, uh, our children probably missed this. And they'll never quite understand what, uh, what it meant to grow up in a community where…I guess everybody started from base zero. And where they got, was closer to, to being close together. And now, after a couple generations, uh, perhaps in a sosh, socio-economic level, uh…some people's children are going off to private schools, and colleges, and living in fancy homes. And, and no longer come in contact with a general mixture of people of all different backgrounds. Of course, the people of the second generation greatly resisted their cultural background. I can recall how customers would come into the store with their parents. And my father would conduct the conversation with their  parent - in Italian, Polish, Slavish or whatever it was - and the kids would listen. And my father would talk to them in their native tongue and the kids would answer back in English. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: He said, “Don't you do that.” He said, “You’re going to be sorry if you don't take advantage of learning this language when you have the chance.” But, so many people - second generation - just wanted  to be Americanized. And they didn't want to be identified with anything old; they just  wanted to be identified with the new. In fact, some of the children, I'm sure, were embarrassed a little bit that their parents spoke with an accent and didn't speak perfect English. And, um, it certainly is nothing to be ashamed of. Because as I mentioned in the beginning, these people are heads and shoulders over us. They understand two worlds and we don't do too much of a job, uh, understanding one. As to my, uh, background and club affiliations? Uh, early in my life, probably one of the most important things in my life I ever did was to get involved with the scouting movement - in boy scouting. Much of my time as a teenager was spent concerning myself as a Boy Scout Troop, Sea Scout Troop. Which incidentally met at the First Methodist Church. And I can recall every Scout Sunday, during Scout Week - on Scout Sunday, I marched into the First Methodist Church with all the other scouts and sat and listened to this church service. Which, you know, was very, uh foreign to me. I listened to it; I wasn't 100% comfortable. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: But, I thought it wouldn't hurt if I did that. And then that was…that’s certainly what we did. On returning to Endicott in 1953, I became involved in Endicott Kiwanis Club - which certainly was a, a rewarding experience. Uh, throughout the years, l’ve been involved in many community activities. Uh, at this time, I happen to be serving as a trustee on the Binghamton Savings Bank, as a trustee on the Board of Binghamton General Hospital, I'm on the Board of WSKG TV and Radio as a trustee. I happen to be involved as President of the Jewish Cemetery Association, as a necessary job someone  has to do. I’ve served in the past year as a Vice-President of the Boy Scouts’ Council. Uh, Vice-President of the Temple of Israel. Uh…I, I try to get involved in as many things as I can. Years ago, I was, uh, President of the Endicott, Vestal-Endwell Chamber of Commerce when we had such an organization. I was Chairman of the Merchants’ Organization when I was in Endicott on Washington Ave. Few years ago, I was Chairman of the Merchants’ Association here on Court Street. But, when we opened our new store at the Oakdale Mall, seemed it wasn't right for me to be Chairman of the Court Street Businessmen…well, because I had two stores, perhaps competing with the Binghamton merchants. How much more time do we have on this tape? Do you know? Nettie: [unintelligible] Herbert: Let's just speak for a few minutes about the, uh, the settlement of the few Jewish families who did settle in Endicott. Um, in the early 1920s, there were probably a handful, maybe 10 - 15 Jewish families who settled in the Endicott area. Most of these were small merchants that had small shops. Some even started out on Washington Ave. with a little store front and, uh, lived in the back of the store. Uh, over the store. I think that, uh, Shapiro's did - Shapiro's Men's Shop. And Lachman's - Buddy Lachman's parents had a haberdashery store. I think this is how they started. Uh, with a store and a little house - a little apartment behind a store or above a store. So this little handful of people became very much involved…they were never large enough to have their own Jewish congregation. Although, the women saw to it that they got together on a regular basis - that the children were given Jewish education. Uh, we used to drive to Binghamton in a car pool, to a Sunday school every Sunday. And during the week, we went to religious instruction after school. The Endicott school system used to provide a classroom for the Jewish people to have Jewish instruction. And I can remember I had to go off after school. The other kids wanted to play ball or something. And Nick Paks, and Paul Kominos, and some of the Greek kids were going to Greek lessons and we were going Hebrew school. And, and we both had to do the same things after school. So the, um…the Jewish people did cling together because they had a common, common heritage. Common background. Uh, without a, a permanent place of religion to worship in. Uh, arrangements were made to rent space in the Odd Fellows Hall. And the Odd Fellows Hall - which was on Riverview Drive right next door to the American Legion - had big rooms above it. And so, during the High Holy days on Yom Kippur; Rosh Hashanah; the Jewish New Years, we would hold, uh, our religious services in this building. On those, these three days. Oftentimes on Sunday afternoons, uh, a get-together would be held. And using the social facilities on the main floor of this Odd Fellows Hall, we would have a joint, uh, dinner, or program, or such. And again, the children knew each other; everyone was sort of together. And, uh, it was quite a, it was quite an involved, close, closely knit community. The day finally did arrive - I believe in the late 1940s when Temple Beth-El was built - my father and a number of other people were most instrumental in seeing that a building was built. A permanent house of worship. And, uh, this building was built, uh, Jefferson Ave., in Endicott. Interestingly enough, uh, the St. Paul's Episcopal Church was going to do some remodeling and the  church had to be shut down. So that the two congregations got together and shared the use of Temple Beth-El on Sundays. The Episcopal people came to use the facilities, and on Friday and Saturday, the Jewish services were held. Uh, uh…for me to get totally into a discussion involving the basis of the Jewish religion probably would take three/four hours, and I don't know if I'm the most capable person to do that. But, I think it is interesting to note that, uh, many of these people who started out in this community have, have grown and, and settled in Broome County and found their way in prominence…uh, Herb Kline, son of Jim Kline Men's Store, is now a very prominent Binghamton attorney. Bud Lachman, also an attorney. Uh, happens to practice in Endicott; lives in Binghamton. Bruce Becker, whose father was an attorney - following in his father's  footsteps. He’s, uh, an attorney today, as well. Irvin Shapiro, who runs a very fine men's store - following in his father's footsteps. My two brothers are in Endicott running a jewelry business - it goes back to 1990. So that you can see that, ah, a number of these people came to the community, stayed and settled. Sandy Salerson, whose father was a, a well known figure on Washington Ave. now works at, uh, - had his own business for a while with his father-in-law, now works in Montgomery Ward in the appliance department. So that, many of these people are still here. Uh, Murray Shapiro - whose father was manager of Rudolph’s for many, many years - still lives in this community. He’s, uh, holds a position at IBM. And you can see that from this tiny, little community evolved a very strong background of, of people who were involved in the community, and they stayed here, and contributed to it. And were lucky enough to share in those early years when, when they got to know the community of Endicott, and, and they grew up with all, with kids from all over. You know, in those days, the north side was a sort of a no-no place. Today, the north side of Endicott has the most beautiful homes, the most beautiful golf course; it’s, uh, the most elegant, lovely place. Upper Taft Ave., is, is just beautiful. Nettie: Mm-hm. And downtown, which used to be so terrific is, is [chuckles] where- Nettie: [lightly chuckles] Herbert: -all the decay is. So it took 50 years for the tables to turn, but, uh, but it certainly did. And it’s interesting to look back on. Okay? Nettie: Yeah, that’s- Herbert: That would give us something to do. Nettie: Mm-hm. Herbert: How ya doin’? Nettie: Well, Herb, this was very interesting interview, I wanna thank you very much. Herbert: Good. It’ll be interesting to see what it all looks like when we’re done. Nettie: Mm-hm. Okay. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Herbert Levine Subject The topic of the resource Levine, Herbert -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Immigrants; Endicott (N.Y.); Russians -- United States; Jews; Syracuse University; Korean War, 1950-1953; Jewelry trade; Jewelry stores Description An account of the resource Herbert Levine talks of his father's family and their immigration from Russia to the United States because of the religious persecution against the Jewish people. The family initially settled in the lower East Side of New York City. Levine's father, who had apprenticed with a jeweler in Russia, was able to find work in a jewelry factory, but left due to ill health. He then went to an agriculture school and upon graduating went to work on a farm for a short period of time. He then settled in Syracuse, NY where he went to work for his brother as a jewelry salesman. Being able to several languages was advantageous in his sales. During World War I he entered the armed services and was wounded. As a result he received a Purple Heart. Upon returning home he settled in the Triple Cities where he became a successful jewelry salesman because he spoke several languages. He later married and opened a jewelry business in Endicott, NY. Levine briefly talks about his mother's family. Levine also discusses his own life. He attended Syracuse University and after graduation went to work for Kay Jewelers until he was drafted during the Korean War. After the war ended he went to work at his father's jewelry business, Ruby and Sons, which he continued to operate after his father's death. He later sold his interest in the store to his brother and then purchased Van Cott's. He discusses his life in Endicott, as a child and as an adult, the Jewish population in Endicott and the organizations he belonged to. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 70 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/669a47054fde83aa900d3d8045b2c49b.mp3 777d85c2963cd6e029a9f93e038d12cb https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/dcae8cb5a12052e457724e4d47cad181.mp3 a05fd0ec38da06260cbeecc347133da5 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Polansky, Joe Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview O'Neil, Dan Date of Interview 1978-05-30 Subject LCSH New York State Athletic Commission; Jack O'Brien; Jack Sharkey; Johnson Field; Kalurah Temple. Date of Digitization 2017-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 33:14 Minutes ; 5:31 Minutes Collection Broome County Oral History Project Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56087">Interview with Joe Polansky</a> Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Joe Polansky Interviewed by: Dan O’Neil Date of interview: 22 February 1978 Dan: This is Dan O’Neil, and I’m speaking to Joe Sheppe Polansky. 54 Glenwood Avenue, Binghamton, New York. The date is February 22, 1978. Okay, ah, Joe, would you, ah, relate to me your life and working experiences in the community with emphasis on your affiliation with the boxing profession? Joe: Well, the boxing profession? Dan: Yeah, you can start out with that. [Referring to outline that he had been given earlier] Joe: Well, first I want to say that I was born June 18, 1902 in Coaldale, Pennsylvania in Schuylkill County in the coal mining fields and, ah…at the age of 16 my Father died and being the first - the oldest - boy of the family, nine, I went to work in the mines. And, eh, my education consisted of first year High School and then I had to go into the mines. I worked in the mines for one year and during that time I was boxing as an amateur, and boxing as an amateur at that time was 1918, during the War, and we had amateur fights all throughout the coal regions and I participated in all of them. They had, ah, community sings which consisted of boys being draft- eh, asked to get into the service, and they had boxing bouts at all those meetings, and I participated in every one. And I was very successful in the amateur ranks, knocking out a number of  boys, and, ah, at one time, I had two fights in one night. The first fight and the last fight. Because winning them both - knocking both boys out and, ah, my employment at that time? Well, I worked sporadically, learning the barber trade which I worked at time and time again because I was busily training for the fights, and I started my career in Tunakwa, Pennsylvania Hall. I scored four knockouts in a row then I, at that time, I met a lot of tough coal region boys. I was trained by the Chief of Police of my home town Coaldale, P.A. His name was James Foagallagher. He took great interest in me and at one of the fights I knocked out a soldier boy, and the soldier boy was very popular at that time so I wasn't so popular myself by knocking him out, however, that night Tiny Maxwell was the principle speaker at the banquet and Tiny Maxwell was a great sportswriter of the Philadelphia newspaper, and after I knocked both those boys out, the following week I was in the Philadelphia - Jack O’Brien’s gymnasium in Philadephia - training. I stayed there for 10 days, taking my training course from the great Philadelphia Jack O'Brien. And, ah, after I got through there, I boxed in Allentown, Pottsville, Lansford, Flagstaff, P.A., Nesquehoning, P.A., and a number of others - Reading and on to Philadelphia. Again, to box. Ah…that was what I called my employment at that time, was boxing and ah…(will ya shut that off now?). After I got through boxing in Philadelphia, I came to Binghamton for a 10 day vacation and, ah, I was working out at the YMCA and Smut Smith, who was Sports Editor of the Binghamton Sun, came over to the YMCA to watch me work out and he told, after watching me work out he says to me, he says, "What do you weigh?" I said, "135 pounds." He says, "Would you like to fight next Friday?" Here I'm in town only 5 days and Friday night was the big Binghamton Sun Community, ah, Contest that was run every year by the Sun Bulletin for, ah, some charitable affair and, ah, he says, "You're on to fight next Friday night." I said, "OK." So, Friday night came and there’s, the Kalurah Temple was packed to the hilt and that night I knocked out a young fellow - a very popular Binghamton boy by the name of Billy Kinney - and that night was one of the most notable nights in my career because I met George F. Johnson. I met Mayor Tom Wilson and that time Senator Billy Hill - those were the three men I met that night I was in my, my first night in town. I, ah, and it was a great entry for me into the City of Binghamton. [inaudible] And, ah, at that time, I was living in Johnson Field right across from the ballpark and every morning I used to run around the ballpark to get my exercise and, ah…from then on, I kept boxing here in the City of Binghamton; Endicott; Johnson City; Syracuse; Rochester; Buffalo. And that was the start of my, my, ah, entry into Binghamton. Talking about George F. Johnson, I met George F. Johnson a week later. And, ah, I says to Mr. Johnson that I would like to buy one of the E.J. homes. Mr. Johnson answered me, and he says, "Joe, the only one man, people can buy an E.J. home, are people who work for Endicott Johnson." And I said, "Well, I'm sorry, Mr. Johnson," but I said, "I'm thinking I know a man who wants to sell me their home and, ah, on Carlton Street, and I'd like to buy it." Three days later, Mr. Johnson called me to his office and he says, "Joe." He says, "You asked me about buying the E.J. home." I says, "Yes, I'd like to get my Mother up here and my family." "Well,” he says, "you have a sister working for me, haven't you?" I says, "Yeah, she's been working for ya for the past 20 years." He says, "Well, have her sign on the Deed and you can buy the home." And that’s how I bought the home at 40 Carlton Street, Johnson City - where we lived for many, many years. [inaudible] Dan: Ah, what year did you come to Binghamton, Joe? Joe: May 16, 1921. Dan: Okay…and, ah, the reason was to, to…what was the reason you came to Binghamton, was for vacation, and you came to visit your sister? Joe: That’s right. [inaudible] Her name is Mrs. Anna Gavula. Dan: Gavula? Okay. Joe: She lived on Broad Street, right across from the ballpark. Dan: Okay, so you bought the house on Carlton Street? Joe: That’s right. Dan: Okay, and then from where then, then what did you do? After you bought the house - I mean, did you continue boxing? Joe: Yes. Oh, I continued boxing until, uh…until 1929. Dan: Until 1929. And that’s when you retired from actually, from actually- Joe: That's right. That’s right. Dan: Uh-huh. And then, wha - and then what? Joe: I retired from boxing, and then I became the boxing instructor of the YMCA. Dan: I see. Uh-huh. Joe: And after - during that time, though, I was a boxing commissioner - ah, no, a boxing commissioner, ah…the boxing commissioner at that time was, um…Tom Farley. Dan: Tom Farley? Joe: Jim Farley. Dan: Oh, the Postmaster? Joe: Brother of the Postmaster General. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And I was interested in getting on the boxing commission, however it didn't get on there for awhile. But from 1930 until 1933, I was a New York State referee of boxing and wrestling, and after 1933…in 1937…I was, ah, boxing instructor at the old Binghamton Police gymnasium. Then Senator Lehman appointed me as Boxing Commissioner, ah, Inspector of the State Athletic Commission. Dan: That was in 1937? Joe: That - 1937. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And I was on it, nine - from 1937 until 1972. Dan: Mm-hm. As a boxing commissioner - er, boxing instructor, rather? Joe: That’s right. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: That’s what I think is 35 years altogether. Dan: Mm-hm. Now Joe, as a boxing referee, were the bouts that you refereed locally or were they all over? Joe: All over New York State. Dan: And, and what, eh-? Joe: Buffalo, Utica, ah…Auburn, Elmira, Binghamton, and all the other cities that had boxing bouts at that time. Dan: Mm-hm. And, uh, in your travels, did you, ah, meet any, ah, notables? Joe: Well, the most notable was the, the boxing bouts that I had was some of Carmen Basilio's Championship fights in Syracuse. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And, ah…what'd I say? Well, Jack Sharkey was my famous, my favorite, ah, ah, man that I met in New York City at all the fights ‘cause he came down from his, ah, place in Boston, and I met him at all the fights in New York. And, ah, we always went out together, and we've been wonderful friends ever since. And, ah…Sharkey, to me, was a great fighter. He should, uh, when he was boxing Jack Dempsey, he was beating Jack Dempsey until Jack Dempsey really fouled him, and the he looked away and the first thing you know, Jack Dempsey hit him on the chin and knocked him out. Dan: In what year was that, Joe? Joe: 1928 or -29, I'm, uh… Dan: Uh-huh. Joe:I’m not sure. Dan: Yeah. Joe: I can't tell. Dan: Now, now Jack Sharkey's given name was, what? Joe: Za k- Z-A-U-K-A-U-S-K-A-S.[sic] Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: Zukauskas. Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: Joe Zukauskas. Dan: And they lived on the lower end of Clinton Street. Down, ah, where…where that shop is now. I can't think of the name of it. Dan: And how did, did, Joe happen to, ah, or Jack happen to get into the boxing, ah, profession? How did Jack Sharkey happen-? Joe: Jack Sharkey was in the Navy. And that’s where he learned to box. And, uh…after he got out of the Navy, he, he was one of the first boxers to box Harry Wills. Jack Dempsey was Champion at the time and the color line was drawn pretty close, and Jack Dempsey would not fight Harry Wills. Dan: In what year was this, Joe? Joe: In, uh, the early - the late 20s. Dan: Late 20s. Joe: And, ah, Jack Sharkey fought Harry Wills despite the color line and beat Harry Wills at the time, and that made him very popular because Jack Dempsey wouldn't fight Harry Wills, yet Sharkey did and beat him. It wasn't whether Dempsey was afraid of him or what, but Sharkey fought him and beat him. And that's what made him a very popular fighter at that time. And, ah…Jack Sharkey visited here immediately after he got out of the Navy in 1924, I believe, -25, and he was my guest at, uh, the Carlton Hotel at that time and, ah…we went out on dates together at the time. And, ah, he was boxing under the name of…well, I think it was “Jack Sharkey” at that time, too. And, ah, he fought in Syracuse. He fought in Syracuse, eh, I don't know, I think it was -26, -27 in 1927. And, ah…Sharkey was not the most popular guy in Binghamton at that time because of something that happened previous to when he went into the Navy, which I don't know anything about. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And, ah… Dan: Now, was - wasn’t he known, eh, as the Boston Gob? Joe: That’s right. that’s right. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Yeah. Yes, he was. Dan: And he retired in what year? Do you remember…Joe? Joe: After the, in the…late 30s, I think. Dan: In the late 30s? Joe: Sometime after  the - after 1930. Dan: Uh-huh. And what do you recall of, uh - the Max Schmeling training here for his fight with Jack Sharkey? Joe: Well, at that time he, uh, uh, as I just said, he wasn't the most popular, and that’s why George F. Johnson invited Max Schmeling to train in Endicott, and he trained at the old dance hall in Endicott. And, ah, I went down there quite often to watch him train because, ah, I knew his manager and some of his trainers through, ah, being on, ah…in boxing in New York. And, ah…I already knew him pretty well. I…I didn't get to meet, ah, Schmeling very often, but I met him a number of times down there and we talked. But the greatest athlete I think I ever met was a football player, and a baseball player, and a great Indian. And you know who he is? Dan: Jim Thorpe. Joe: Jim Thorpe. I met Jim Thorpe in Kalurah Temple. He came here with a wrestler by the name of Indian, Indian…Stock, I think his name was. and Bill Irving, who was one of the fi - allplayers here at that time…ah, was an old friend of Jim Thorpe. And we three of us sat in Kalurah Temple for two hours in the, the, ah…in the dressing room talking about old times, when Jim Thorpe played with the, with the baseball team in, in Ohio with Bill Irving. Ah…his early, ah, training in…at the…ah, University he attended at that time. And, ah, he was telling us about coming to Philadelphia for the ge - for the, eh, All-Star track events in Philadelphia, which was a yearly, was one of the, the biggest attractions throughout all, uh, colleges. And they waited, waited for the team to come in with Jim Thorpe from, uh, his university. It was an Indian School. Dan: Yeah. Joe: And, ah, I just can't think of the name- Dan: Carlisle? Joe: Carlisle College. And they waited for Carlisle College to come in on the train, and Erie, the Princeton team come in - they had 24, ah, runners. The Yale team come in, they had about 36 participants. And when the Carlisle team come off the, off the train, there was just 4 Indian runners and Jim Thorpe was one of ‘em. And he, that day, at the Philadelphia races, he won all the track events. And here they waited for ah ah the teams to come in and this team come in with only 4 men on it: Jim Thorpe and three other Indians - but Jim Thorpe was the main one that won most the race - all the races - all the track events that, that afternoon. So, it was a great day for me because I knew Tiny Maxwell - Tiny Maxwell was a sports editor of the Philadelphia Ledger, I believe it was at that time. And he was a personal friend of my manager's. My manager was a, a man who run a restaurant in Philadelphia and ah, and ah, him and Tiny Maxwell were very close friends, and that’s how I, I happen to…happen to know him.  Dan: Mm-hm. Now, who were some of the, ah, ah…fighters that you instructed here, locally? Joe: Well, Joe Banovic was one of my, my boys that I worked with, Johnny Haystack, Joe Zinck and, ah, and I- Dan: Ya have anything to do with Phil Shay - Phil Vanderbeck? Joe: Vanderbeck, I was his trainer when he went to, to, ah…New York to fight in the Golden Gloves. Tommy Curry was one of the trainers and I was the other trainer. And, ah…we stayed in New York that, that night, and Vanderbeck boxed the next day. And, ah… some of the other participants were, were, ah…well, I got a picture of ‘em there but I just can't think of any of them, but Vanderbeck was the outstanding one at the, Joe - I think Joe Matisi boxed in that- Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: -tournament, too. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Although, he didn't do too good at the time, but he showed up very well. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: But he didn't win any championship. Dan: Mm-hm. Did ya - how ‘bout, di - Joe Taylor? Did you have anything to do with him? Joe: Joe Taylor? No, I never - I refereed his bouts after I got through boxing, but I never had much to do with Joe Taylor outside of him being a, a member of our old-time boxers association - of which I was Secretary - and that was the only contact I had with Joe Taylor. Dan: Mm-hm. Ah, outside of Jack Sharkey, Joe, uh, who would you say would be the best, ah, fighter to come out of this area? Joe: Out of this area? Dan: Yeah, outside of Jack Sharkey. Joe: I would say Joe Banovic; Joe Matisi. Between those two… Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: I would say. I, ah, go ahe - the reason that I picked them was because, because they were heavyweights, more or less. Dan: Yeah. Joe: Or in that heavyweight class, which is one of the most popular classes. Tommy Curry, myself - we were of the lightweights - the lightweights were not too popular at the time… Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Because a heavyweight is always…a heavyweight match is always… Dan: Now, from the time up until you retired in 1929, most of the boxing matches locally were down at the Kalurah Temple, right? Joe: No, Johnson Field. Dan: Johnson Field? Joe: Johnson Field is where most of mine were and, eh, and Kalurah Temple. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: But, ah, during the summer, there was always 5 or 6 fights during the, uh, summer at the Johnson Field. Dan: Mm-hm. I recall one fight in particular, ah, involving a local boxer - I believe it was in Johnson Field. Did Jake LaMotta fight here at one time? Joe: Yes he did, yes he did. But I really can't think of who he boxed. Dan: I was under the impression that it was Joe Taylor. Joe: No, Jake LaMotta never boxed in Binghamton - he boxed in Syracuse. Dan: Oh, in Syracuse. Joe: And he boxed Joey Taylor. Dan: Oh, I see. Joe: Joey Taylor put up a wonderful- Dan: Yeah. Joe: -fight against Jake LaMotta. Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: I was at the fight - I worked there as an Inspector at the time. Dan: I see. Joe: For the New York State Athletic Commission. Dan: Uh-huh. So, uh, outside of Jack Sharley and, ah, who else did you, uh, who, who of the other heavyweights did you know?  Joe: Well, Jim Braddock was one of my great friends and everybody knows his history of how he became Champion. And, ah, Mickey Walker was, was another great, ah, friend of mine, and Mickey Walker came here the night I boxed Billy Kinney. And thats how I happened to go back to Newark, New Jersey with Mickey Walker. And I trained in Elizabeth, New Jersey, and, ah I boxed in Newark twice at the old Newark Airdrome, I believe they call it, or an Airdrome…and, ah, Mickey Walker's manager at that time was Jim Bulger (B-U-L-G-E-R), and he’s the man that took me to Newark and trained me there. But at that time, I broke my hand and I had to come back to Binghamton. Dan: Mm. Joe: A year later, I went, went out to Cleveland, Ohio, and I boxed in Cleveland, Akron and Mansfield. And at that time I was under the na - management of a, of a Cleveland man. And, eh… Dan: The [inaudible]. Joe:That’s where I met…can’t think of, uh…another great fighter. A heavyweight out there in Cleveland and I can't just think of his name. And I stayed out in Cleveland for a year. For a whole year. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And I boxed in those different… and I, I boxed in a place called Highland Park. Highland Park was a, was a racehor - racetrack, and they had a big gymnasium there, and they held bouts there at that time. Dan: Mm-hm. Now, you started to, to box when you were in the coal mines, um- Joe: That’s right. Dan: - in Pennsylvania. Now, when did you turn professional, Joe? Joe: Oh, I had about…56 amateur fights… Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Before I turned professional. And then, I believe I had about 55 professional fights after that. So- Dan: You don't know what that year was that you turned professional. Joe: Around -20. Around 1920. Dan: Around 1920. Joe: Because I, I boxed amateur. But I had more, more 56 amateur fights and only 55 professional fights, so- Dan: Yeah-huh. Joe: I had more experience as an amateur that I did as a professional. Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: But that’s what helped me out because I was a good puncher. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Had a good right hand and I scored a lot of knockouts. Dan : Mm-hm. And out of the 55 professional fights, how many did you win? Joe: Well, I only lost two. Dan: Only lost two. Joe: Yeah. Only lost two. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: But, the others, uh, at that time there was a lot of no-decision fights. So. if you were on your feet at the end of 10 rounds, there was no decision. You either won or you…either knocked your man out or you beat him very bad, at, or you win…but, uh, most, uh, in those days, there were no Boxing Commissions. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: in the early 20s. Ah, no boxing, ah, commissions to, uh, say that you had to make a decision, so there was no-decisions on many occasions. Dan: Mm-hm. Now, have you pursued the, ah, your barbering trade at all, Joe? Joe: Pardon? Dan: Have you pursued your barbering trade at all? Joe: Not much after, after, I just…sporadically. Dan: Just sporadically. Joe: Yeah. Dan: Most of your life has been spent, been spent in the boxing profession? Joe: With the Boxing Commission. Dan: Right. Mm-hm. Now, you, when you bought your house on Carlton Street in Johnson City, I mean, what disposition was made of that, I mean how, how did you happen to move from there to here? Joe: There to here? Dan: Yeah. You say you bought the house from George F. Johnson through your sister, right? Joe: Ye-yes. Dan: And, ah, I was just wondering, you sold that, did you, eventually? Joe: Well, after my Mother died. Dan: After your Mother died. Joe: After my Mother died, then we, we sold the house… Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And the children each went their own way… Dan: Yeah. Joe: And that’s how I happened to, I got in business with ah John Cupina, who was First Ward Councilman… Dan: Oh, yes. Joe: Here in the City of Binghamton. Dan: Oh, yes. Joe: I was his partner in the liquor store at 54 Glenwood Avenue for 18 years, where I, we are right now… Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: With the liquor store downstairs. And after he died, we got, we…the liquor store was sold to someone else. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And, ah, I was still with the Boxing Commission at the time, so I was kept busy doing my work there. Dan: Mm-hm. So, are you more or less retired as far as the Boxing- Joe: Yeah. Dan: -Commission is concerned? Joe: Well, I still go there on a…I'm still, uh, associated with the Commission - but the trouble is, when you go there, everybody's new, nobody knows ya. Dan: Yeah. Joe: All the ones that I, all the people that I know, I'm 76 years old. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And all the people that I knew are either dead or gone. Dan: [light laughter] Joe: Or not working. Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: And that’s quite a thing when you go to New York now and, ah, find one of the people that you know and that's about it. Dan: Uh-huh; uh-huh. Joe: That’s why it's always a pleasure to meet Jack Sharkey down there. Dan: Yeah. Joe: That’s why we always go out together. Dan: Uh-huh. Now, of course you have a banquet every year, don't you, for the old-timers? Joe: Yeah, we have a banquet every year for the old timers, and our next banquet is, is, uh…May 13, 1978 at Johnson City, American Legion. And, ah, at that time, we honor so many fighters who have paid, ah, their dues and, ah, have-did their boxing from the old-timers. They've got to be over 50 years old before we, before we, ah, honor anybody. Dan: I see. Joe: In other words, they, tha…that’s the age limit. Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: And, ah, so we honor so many people every year, and it’s interesting. The next one is May 13th in Johnson Field or Johnson American Legion. Dan: Mm-hm. Well, is there anything else you would like to add, Joe? Joe: Well, I, the only thing is, I say I belong to the Holy Spirit Church here in Binghamton, New York. And, ah…as far as club membership is concerned, I belong to the different, ah, memberships in the church, and that’s about all. I, uh, I used to belong to a number of clubs, but I just, uh, got away from it all. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And, ah, I want to say one thing that, one of the main things of my, ah, career was as Scout commissioner - Boy Scout Commissioner here in the First Ward during my boxing days because I was popular at the time and I was able to be a Commissioner, and at that time we had 7 Boy Scout Troops in the First Ward. It took a lot of work it took a lot of time of mine to be the Commissioner and meet each and every one of those seven Troops during the weeks that I was on the Board. And I'm very proud of that because today there is only one Boy Scout Troop in the First Ward. Which means that the work isn't being done. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And that’s why the interest isn't being taken care of as it should be. There should be more Boy Scout Troops because a lot of the boys are being, getting in trouble… Dan: Right. Joe:...they have nothing to do… Dan: Mm-hm. Joe:...and that’s why the interest should be in scouting. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And that’s why I am very proud of what I had done at that time, having, boy, ah…Boy Scout Commissionership. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And, uh, leading and raising a lot of the boys that I meet today are, ah, successful business men that were in my Boy Scout Troop. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: That time. Dan: Mm-hm. Ah, Joe, what, ah…just as an afterthought, going back to when you first started fighting, what did you usually get for a fight? Joe: Oh, $150.00… Dan: A hundreh… Joe: …two-hundreh… Dan: $250.00? Joe:...300. The best, the most money I ever made was $1,650.00. Dan: Is that right? Joe: For a 12-round bout. Dan: And that was at the height of your career? Joe: That’s right. Dan: As a professional? Joe: That was in 1923 - 24. Although $1,600.00 at that time was a lot of money. Dan: That’s right. Joe: If I had only invested it properly… Dan: [light laughter] Joe:...in E.J. or IBM stock… Dan: Right, right… Joe:...I'd a been alright today. Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: But, I, as a young fella, you don't think of those things. Dan: Joe: And that’s about the size of it. Dan: Uh-huh. Joe: Or if something come up like some stock that, ah, went world wild, why...I sure remember the 1929 crash here in the First Ward when Horvatt's Bank went up. And all the poor people of the First Ward lost their money. I, ah, I saw people crying down there at the bank. And those, those are things that a lot of the young people today don't, don’t remember because they, they naturally weren't born at the time. Dan: Right. Dan: Even born at the time. But, ah, when you see the way some of them are spending money today, it’s, ah, interesting to me because I've seen the hardships that people went through at that time. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Especially during the, the, crash… Dan: Mm-hm. Joe:...in 1929 and 1930. Dan: Yeah…when you were working in the coal mines, what were you getting a day? Joe: Well, it was, I think it was a dollar, an…close to two dollars a day. That’s about it. Dan: Mm-hm. Yeah. Joe: Yeah. Dan: You went to work at 16? Joe: That was in 19, uh…1918 or 19…1918. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Yeah. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: Right during the war. Dan: Yeah. Joe: Yeah, because I was only 16 years old at the time. Dan: Mm-hm. Joe: And it was quite…when you think of the wages today… Dan: [light chuckle] Well, inflation’s, er, inflation is eating that up. Joe: It’s hard to believe. Dan: It is, it is. Well Joe, I certainly thank you very much for your cooperation and, ah, ah…if there's anything that you couldn’t remember or anything that should come to mind after I leave, why, don't hesitate to call me - I will be glad to return. Joe: I’ll be glad to do it. Dan: Okay, I’ll… Joe: Thank you. Dan: I'll turn this off here.  Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Joe Polansky Subject The topic of the resource Polansky, Joe -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Coaldale (Schuylkill County, Pa.); Binghamton (N.Y.); Boxing; Boxing matches; Boxer; Boxing referees; Schmeling, Max, 1905-2005; Thorpe, Jim; Boy Scouts. Description An account of the resource Joe Polansky speaks about leaving high school to go and work in the coal mine in Coaldale, (Schuylkill County), PA after his father died. He stayed there for one year. During that year he became an amateur boxer and then attended a training course in Philadelphia under Jack O'Brien. He then had traveled thoughout PA for boxing matches. He moved to Binghamton and began participating in boxing matches in this region. The matches were held at Johnson Field and the Kalurah Temple. He boxed throughout New York, New Jersey and Ohio. He later became a professional boxer and retired from boxing in 1929. He discusses his boxing matches. He served as a referee for boxing and wrestling and was a boxing instructor. He was also associated with the New York State Athletic Commission. He recollects knowing notable boxers such as local boxer, Jack Sharkey, and Max Schmeling. He talks of meeting Jim Thorpe. He was a Boy Scout Commissioner in Binghamton's First Ward. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 72 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/c0a37c6a02baeb277abe5225bb767f50.mp3 4e8761f3994f9bd48a63c5e3fb2aa63d Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Rider, Arthur G. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Wood, Wanda Date of Interview 1978-02-23 Subject LCSH Watch making; Watch repair Collection Broome County Oral History Project Date of Digitization 2017-03-27 Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE56091">Interview with Arthur G. Rider</a> Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 27:37 Minutes Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Arthur G. Rider Interveiwed by: Wanda Wood Date of Interview: 30 May 1978 Wanda: This is Wanda Wood, interviewing Mr. Arthur G. Rider  in the Press Building. Binghamton, New York. The date is 30 May, 1978. [muffled: 78]. Mr. Rider, you've been a citizen around this area for many years, and we'd like to get some  of your experiences down on tape. And, ah, especially about  your, your jewelry. Wholesale jewelry business. And, ah, could you begin by telling us where you were born? Arthur: Oh, I was born up on, ah, River Road [Chenango Bridge], ah, about, ah, almost at the corner of the airport road. And, ah…my people lived there three…I think they were there three years before I was born. And then…and, ah, and I still own the, I still own the house. [clears throat] Well, they, ah… Wanda: And they - were they farmers, or…? Arthur: They were farmers, ayunh-yuh. Ayunh…farmers. Yeah, we had probably 20 cows, and 50 chickens, and, askah, three horses. Wanda: [laughing] That was a big farm, probably. Arthur: Well not, very big...I drove a horse to school when I was a kid, to Chenango Forks. Wanda: Chenango Forks School. Arthur: Ayuh. Wanda: Where was that, then? Where was the school?  Arthur: Well, the school was on the right hand side of, um…on the right hand side of, ah, Main St. in Chenango Forks. It's around, in where the new fire station is now. Wanda: Oh. The building is gone, is it? Arthur: Yes. The building’s gone. Oh, yes - it's been gone  for quite a while. Wanda: Did you have to go up that dug-road along the river?  Arthur: Yeah, I went up the dug-road. Wanda: [laughs] Arthur: Drove the dug-road. Wanda: That must have been pretty treacherous sometimes in the winter. Arthur: Well, yes. Ayuh, it was. Yeah. Horse jumped out of the one track into the other where we were in it. I  remember we all went down the, down the bank in the [laughs]  - horse and all. Wanda: [laughs] Overturned? Arthur: But, I made it. Didn't do any damage, as I remember. Wanda: [laughs] Oh, dear. Arthur: Yeah. Wanda: So you went to school up there until, when? Arthur: Went to school, and that's where I got an idea that I wanted to learn the jewelry business. Used to go in to see the watchmaker theres every day. Got it in my head I wanted to learn watchmakin’, so then…I… Wanda: Mm. Arthur:...Went to…took a correspondence course in it first, and then I went to Lancaster, to Bowman's in Lancaster and studied - took up the watchmaking. Then I came back and got a job, mmm…Russell O'Brien, 54 Court St. I was there about a year…a year, I guess. And then I went...a year, a year…  Wanda: Was that a sort of an apprenticeship? Arthur: No, no. I got a job, you know. It was, ah…I think  for that age... You see, that was in 19…no, 1918 or 1919. Right? At the end of the war. And, ah, ah, considering, I don't thinkin’ I got such a bad job to start with. I got $20.00 a week. Wanda: [chuckles] Arthur: Then I raised me to 25, and then I went  to thirty. I went down to 20 Court St., and I got, ah, finally got 35 after, after the five years. And, ah, I told you that I, about-a, the…I told you about living in the Hotchkiss? [Hotchkiss Boarding House, corner of Henry and Carroll Sts.] Wanda: Yes, I'd like to hear about that.   Arthur: Yeah, on the same...ah, that, that was the time that boarded up there, and I ate there.   Wanda: It was the Hotchkiss?   Arthur: Ah, three meals a day in this boarding house. Linen  tablecloths and, and, ah, colored waiters, and three meals a day for a dollar. So you see- Wanda: Yes, it is- Arthur: I wasn't doing so bad at, ah, on tw-25/$30.00 a week. And only paying out, eh, six and a couple’a, couple of dollars for a room. Wanda: [laughs] Arthur: In proportion, I was doin'... [Both laugh]   Wanda: -far better than you would these days, that's for sure.   Arthur: In proportion, I was doing much better.   Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: Uh-huh. But anyway, the watchmaking... there was a demand for them, must be, because I don't think - my wife's my same age and I don't think she got, as the secretary for a lawyer, I think she only got $6.00 a week when she started. Wanda: Mm-hm. Well, why - when you were - this job, the second job you had, were you watchmaking, or, or were you…? Arthur: Repairing watches. Repairing watches. Wanda: Repairing. And then how did you get from there into  jewelry? Arthur: Well, [sardonic chuckle] well I got mad that - ‘s’well, I got mad that-s, I wanted to travel on the road, so I applied for a job up  to the Pond's in Syracuse, the ones that sell Keepsake now? Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: And-a went up there and that's how I got a job.  They gave me a job. Traveled on the road…on commission. Straight commission. Wanda: Huh. Did you cover one certain area, or…? Arthur: Well, I covered New York State, mostly.  Wanda: Is that a fact? Arthur: Yeah, traveled around New York State. Wanda: What was that, by train or car, or what? Arthur: Part of the time by train. In the wintertime, I traveled by train, wintertime [summertime] I used the car, but, ah, I never traveled on the train too much. Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: Have some, but not too much. Wanda: And you took your sample cases and… Arthur: Ayuh, I took samples. Wanda: And went to jewelry stores? Arthur: Jewelry stores, yeah. Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: Well… Wanda: I imagine the styles of jewelry has changed a lot since then, hasn't it? Arthur: Well, yes, I guess. Not too, I don't think…not too much, as I know of.  Wanda: Wasn't jewelry quite, oh, ornate…in those days? Arthur: I don't remember. We sold - oh, used to sell cufflinks, lots of cufflinks, ah, and lots of cuff buttons, and lots of, ah, Waldemar chains [watch chains]'n…and, ah…oh, little  pins. Small, little pins for the ladies, a-and, ah…oh, I don't  know. Then we sold watches. See, a wholesaler those days sold watches. Wanda: Uh-huh. Arthur: Now, they don't. Wanda: Oh, they don't? It's gone too big now? Arthur: Well, it's gone... see, during the war in 1940, they all switched over from, ah…from wholesalers, direct from the manufacturer to the retailer…’bout 1940. Wanda: Oh. Arthur: So that, that, ah, that ended a lot of the big wholesalers. Wanda: Cut out the middleman, didn't it? Arthur: Yep. Few of them, few of them survived. And some didn't. Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: Down…so… Wanda: What, ah…how did you…? You must know a lot about diamonds. How did you get into that branch of the jewelry? Arthur: Well, I go - I guess…when I worked for the Pond's,  ah, I was interested. They seemed to be interested in, ah, I sold the - you see, they had the trade na- mark name, “Keepsake.” Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: And, ah…I sold the first assortment of them I sold  down in Honesdale, Pennsylvania. And, ah, Robert Pond sold the first one in, ah, the first ring in, in, ah, Mike Lisson's in Syracuse on Salina Street. Wanda: Hm. Arthur: Then I got it in my hea- I worked for them 10 years, then, then I got it in my head I wanted to try  it myself, so… [Both laugh] Arthur: Then I went to, then I went to work at that. Then, then I went to work for an outfit in Lancaster where I sold  the same kind of, uh, well, jewelry. Hamilton watches; Elgin watches; every kind of silverware and whatnot. And so then I, then I got it in my head I wanted to go to Europe. I thought, if they could go to Europe I could go to Europe,  so I [laughs] the Pond's - I figured, if they go to Europe and  buy diamonds, I could, too. Wanda: [laughs] Arthur: So in 19 - lessee…1938. I went, I went to Europe and bought some stones over there. Wanda: Well, where did you go for that? Arthur: Well, I went to, I went to, um…went to Antwerp first. Then I went, ‘n’, then I went from there to Amsterdam. Went to…they had offices in both places. And I stayed there four/five days and, ah, bought a few stones. ‘N’ I always, ah, I kept the contact for years and years...there. Wanda: So you've dealt with that same- Arthur: Yeah, I did for years and years. Wanda: -contact? Arthur: Yeah. So then I come back, and I didn't go to Europe again, ah, for another…see…not ‘till about 1960…probably not…what? ‘Bout 19sh…guess about 1970, I guess we went the second time. Of course, the war come on, you see. Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: And blocked ya from the, the second war, there. That blocked you from, from going over there. Wanda: Did you, was there trouble with supplying, uh, diamonds  from, ah, Holland during the war? Arthur: Hmmm, well, I… Wanda: Do you remember? Arthur: Well, during the war, you couldn't get  'em from over there. They were all bottled up. I mean, ah, eh…the Nazis took a lot of them and, eh, ah…you couldn't get - no. The man I knew, he was, happened to be in America when, when, um…when Hitler marched into Holland, He was in America. Wanda: Oh. Arthur: And, ah, he stayed here several years. Wanda: Hm. Arthur: Until the thing got quieted down...yes. No, you couldn't, there was no, no diamonds come outta there during the war. Wanda: Hm. Arthur: None, none at all...then. So I, uh…I dunno. I… Wanda: How did you, how'd you supply your customers, then? Arthur: Oh, it was very difficult. Of course, there's an awful - people have awful big stocks of them in America. And, ah, I dunno where they come from. The price was very high then. And, [sardonic chuckle] but it just - I couldn't supply them very good.  Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: Then of course, the government - you couldn't travel  because you couldn't get stamps to travel. Wanda: That's right. Arthur: Yeah. You had to bootleg- Wanda: Strange how we forget, isn't it? Arthur: You had to buy bootleg gasoline. [Both laugh] Arthur:God, you don't  remember any of that stuff! Wanda: Oh, well…a little... Arthur: A little... Wanda: Some of the fringes about stamping, stamps and so  forth. Arthur: That was a disgrace. That's the reason I, I didn't go for this, ah, about this gasoline business this time. I didn't believe there was any shortage. There wasn't any shortage then. They claimed there wasn't any shortage then. Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: All they were out to…try to stop you from travelin' or  something. I guess they… Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: There wasn't any shortage of gasoline; they had gasoline those days.  Wanda: And it doesn't seem as though there's any real shortage now.  Arthur: No, I don't believe there isn’t any, probably isn't any real shortage now. They just…they'd like to have you believe that there was, and... Wanda: Ayuh. Arthur: But there isn't - when you see the cars on the road,  you know there isn't. Wanda: [chuckles] That’s certainly- Arthur: They didn't raise the price of it much. Wanda: No. Arthur: No. Now, that’s been- Wanda: So now you, now you, ah, you've been in this one  particular spot here for, what? 35 years? Arthur: About…I guess about 35 years I've been here. I'm not dead sure, but I think about 35 years. Wanda: When you first started on your own, where did you set up business? Arthur: Over in the old Savings Bank building, back of the  Marine-Midland Bank. You know- Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: The one between City Hall and, and, ah...I, I rented a room over there for, ah…for, ah, $20.00 a month. Wanda: [laughs] Arthur: And I… Wanda: To start with? Arthur: And I finally got in two rooms, then three rooms. And, ah, they bought, and, ah…that's when the old, that's when the old Binghamton Savings Bank was there. Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: Then they bought, then, uh, then they took over the, ah…which bank was it there? Um…another savings bank pretty near went flooey? Um, or over in the location where they are now. I can't name the bank. I oughta be able to. Wanda: It wouldn't be the Citizen's…? Arthur: No- Wanda: …Bank? Arthur -the Citizen's was up along here. [Chenango St.] Wanda: The People's Bank? Arthur: No, the, um... Wanda: People's Bank? Arthur: There was a savings bank - another one, over there. Wanda: Huh. I'll have to look into that. Arthur: No, I can't name ‘em. But, they were going to go flooey, and, ah, the Binghamton Savings Bank…ah, took them over. Wanda: Oh. Arthur: Then they eventually moved over there. Eventually moved over there. Wanda: And that's now the Marine-Midland building, right?  Arthur: No, no, no. Wanda: Oh, you’re telling- Arthur: Over - where the Savings Bank is now. Wanda: Oh, I see. Arthur: There was, there was, there was, ah…another savings bank over there. Somebody could tell you that. Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: But I, I can't. Wanda: We'll have to look that up. Arthur: ‘Cause Citizen's Bank was right along in here some where. They went flooey, too. Wanda: They really folded, didn't they? Arthur: Ayuh. Wanda: Ayuh. Arthur: Ayuh, but the savings, the other one [Chenango Valley Savings Bank- 66 Exchange St.], was gonna fold, I guess. But they went.. the Binghamton Savings Bank took  ‘em over… Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: So that saved them. Wanda: How did, how did the Depression affect your business?  Were people willing to spend [unintelligible]? Arthur: They didn't have any money and you couldn't, ah…no. There wasn't any business, hardly. Wanda: Bad times, huh? Arthur: Yeah. Yes. Very, very...bad. 'Course, you could travel around the-then. I could travel around for, say, $35.00 a week. I could travel around and go, and be gone five days probably, for 35, $40.00. Wanda: Oh. Arthur: And, ah, now…now you go out 'n in one day you spend $50.00. Ridiculous! Wanda:...Motels and that sort of thing. Arthur: I stayed down in Corning the other night. And, ah,  their rate, um…normally, maybe I'd get in there for 24 or $25.00. But, I ended up paying 30. And, ah, they said that's all they had. Wanda: I hope that was a good night's sleep. Arthur: Well…[chuckles] I slept pretty fair. I told them they could give me a room on the back 'n they gave me one on the front, but it was all right; I slept. Wanda: [laughs] Arthur: It's a very beautiful  hotel - or motel. Wanda: Yes. Arthur: That Hilton in, ah, Corning. Wanda: Oh. Arthur: It's very nice. It's a nice… Wanda: Do you do much traveling now? Arthur: Oh, I travel. Oh, three or four days, three or four  days one week. And then maybe not much the next. Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: And, ah..no, I keep, I go around... keep goin'. Wanda: You to- you've had a very successful career, I should think. Arthur: No, I wouldn't say so. Wanda: Well, I know you're a well-respected businessman in  Binghamton. Arthur: [laughs] I don't know about that. Wanda: …Who do you think influenced you the most... during your life? Arthur: Hm…I…well, I think it was, ah, probably those people I worked for in Syracuse. I think, ah…they probably did, ayuh, in a way. Because they were quite, quite sucs, quite successful, and they were…kept themselves up in very good order, and, ah, and, ah…very, they were very successful. 'Course they, they built that business. When I worked for ‘em, they were doin', ah…oh, when I started, probably doing a half a million. And now they're doing 18 million. Wanda: That's Keepsake Diamonds? Arthur: Ayuh. Wanda: There's one right there. [laughs] Arthur: Ayuh. Yeah. Wanda: Well, it did- Arthur: Well, and so that probably influenced me. And the man in Europe taught me more about stones than anybody else. He’s… Wanda: What is there to learn? I'm absolutely...I don't know  anything about them. What is there to learn about diamonds,  cutting and all that sort of thing? Arthur: Oh, there's so much to know that it's, it's, ah, pitiful. I mean… Wanda: [laughs] Not enough time today, eh? Arthur: Oh, no. You couldn't, ah…but it's color, and, and, ah…color and make and imperfection and, and everything goes  into the, puttin' the value on ‘em. Everything. Very complicated, very complicated thing. Wanda: I notice you have some pretty complicated looking  machinery here, too. [chuckles] Arthur: Well, I - yeah. Yeah, a microscope. Yeah. On some of  ‘em. And scales, and, and, ah…there's some of ‘em, ah…have  more then I have. Now you're coming along to a period where  they're bringing in these diamonds that are not diamonds, but, um…this, ah, uh, cubic zirconia. Ah, is a new material. And the hardness is way up there, and, ah, refractive index is, was, was way up, too. and that's, ah, that's really a fooler. More, a bigger fooler than they've ever had. Wanda: Is that right? Arthur: Yeah. Bigger fooler than they've ever had. Wanda: You mean there’s been others? [unintelligible] Arthur: Oh, there's other, been other things, sure. But this thing…this thing, it’s really got 'em a little worried, I think. [chuckles]  Wanda: Do they sparkle just as good as the other ones?  Arthur: Well, ah, they can be a…it would be a job to, to separate ‘em. Wanda: Is that a fact? Arthur: Yep. I don't own one; I'm gonna buy one. I'm gonna buy one or two of ‘em. But, I haven't. Wanda: They aren't anywhere as near as, as expensive as diamonds, right? Arthur: Oh no, no, no, no. No. No. Wanda: Diamonds are still good, solid investment, aren’t they? Arthur: Ayuh. Wanda: Always probably will be. Arthur: Have been, I guess. I hope so. Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: Price goes up and up and up. Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: Yeah. So much that you can't believe it. Wanda: Well, would you advise young people these days to get into the business that you're in? Arthur: No. I wouldn't. Wanda: You wouldn't? Arthur: No. I think it's too, I think it's too difficult. Stores, you see, there’s, it's getting so there are very few stores. Wanda: Mm-hm. Arthur: Yeah, very few stores. When I started out, you could go to…well, now the fellow from Greene does pretty good, but there was a store in Oxford that, they did just, just as well. Of course, the store in Norwich, that's all right. But, then there was Sherburne, there was Earlville, and there was Hamilton. Always had jewelry stores...and they don't now. Wanda: That's true. Arthur: No. When I was a kid, you used to go to - or when  I started, I’d go to Newark Valley and stay half a day. And, ah, then I'd go to Nichols and stay half a day. And, ah, get an order. Wanda: Is that right? Arthur: But, you couldn't do that now. Wanda: Huh. Well, that's kinda sad, isn't it? Arthur: In a way, yes. Wanda: Yeah. Arthur: Those towns have...gone down markedly. Wanda: How ‘bout this…original man that you said inspired  you to become, get interested in jewelry in, in, ah, Chenango  Forks…what kind of a place did he have? A jewelry-? Arthur: Oh, a little bit of a, of a, ah…watchmaking shop. Wanda: Was it in the old hotel there or what? Arthur: No, it was the next building beyond that hotel, and it's, eh, where the post office is built out - ah, the building is, ah, the front built out on it? Wanda: Mm-hm, mm-hm. Arthur: That's where - Al Elliot, his name was. Wanda: Oh. Arthur: And, ah…ya know, he was…he was a pretty good watchmaker. He was a general mechanic. Wanda: Huh. Arthur: Ayuh, he was…he was very, ah, good  watchmaker, I think - but not a very good businessman, I don’t think. Wanda: [laughs] That’s- Arthur: Hey, he was long on guns. He could shoot…and, ah, he really could. He was a terrific marksman. Wanda: Huh. Arthur: Yeah. Wanda: So his store probably had a lot of other things besides watches in it, then. Arthur: Largely. Largely, I'd say. 'Twasn't much of a store. Wanda: [chuckles] Arthur: As you think of it now, not much of a store. But, he made a living there. Wanda: Uh-huh. Arthur: Had one of the first cars in Chenango Forks; an old, Maxwell car. Wanda: [laughs] Arthur: Ayuh. Wanda: I'd like to see that again. Arthur: You wouldn't see that, no. Wanda: Well, what, uh…anything more you wanna- Arthur: No, I don't want to- Wanda: -tell us about, to…? Arthur: I don't want to tell you any more. Wanda: I've taken up quite a bit of your time already, anyway. Arthur: No. I don't care about that. Wanda: Well, it's been very enjoyable and I want to thank you very much. Arthur: But I didn’t tell you much. Wanda: Oh, I think you did. Arthur: You do think so? Wanda: Yes.  Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Arthur G. Rider Subject The topic of the resource Rider, Arthur -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Chenango Bridge (N.Y.); Lancaster (Pa.); Jewelry; World War, 1939-1945; Diamonds; Jewelry trade; Jewelry stores; Wholesale trade Description An account of the resource Arthur Rider speaks of his childhood in Chenango Bridge and of becoming interested in watchmaking. He went to school in Lancaster, Pennsylvania for training. He became a jewelry salesman for a company in Syracuse and travelled thoughout New York State. He later opened his own wholesale jewelry store in . He discusses the impact that World War II had upon his business, as he purchased diamonds from suppliers in Europe. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 73