76 10 1775 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/ef42f023cdd24b329a6cc4fdab547294.mp3 bd3d9b8d02b37a25c41d13f788f02cb2 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Armenian Oral History Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Aynur de Rouen, Ph.D. Description An account of the resource This collection includes interviews in English with informants of all ages and a variety of backgrounds from various parts of Armenia.  The interviews provide deeper insight into the history of the Armenian culture through personal accounts, narratives, testimonies, and memories of their early lives in their adoptive country and back in Armenia.   Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright.  Relation A related resource <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/oral-histories/index.html#sustainablecommunities">Sustainable Communities Oral History Collection</a> Language A language of the resource English Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Date of Interview 6/22/2014 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Gregory Smaldone Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Jack Injajigian Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 27:28 Language English Digital Publisher Binghamton University Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as Armenian Oral History Project, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries for more information. Biographical Text <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Jack was ordained and has been a deacon for thirteen years. After college, he served on Parish Council and helped organize and work many Armenian events within the church. He is the child of Turkish parents who grew up in Greece before immigrating to the United States in the 1950's."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":15105,"3":{"1":0},"11":4,"12":0,"14":[null,2,0],"15":"Calibri","16":11}"><span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Jack was ordained and has been a deacon for thirteen years. After college, he served on Parish Council and helped organize and work many Armenian events within the church. He is the child of Turkish parents who grew up in Greece before immigrating to the United States in the 1950's."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":15105,"3":{"1":0},"11":4,"12":0,"14":[null,2,0],"15":"Calibri","16":11}">Jack Injajigian is the child of Armenian parents who grew up in Greece before immigrating to the United States in the 1950's. Injajigian <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Jack was ordained and has been a deacon for thirteen years. After college, he served on Parish Council and helped organize and work many Armenian events within the church. He is the child of Turkish parents who grew up in Greece before immigrating to the United States in the 1950's."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":15105,"3":{"1":0},"11":4,"12":0,"14":[null,2,0],"15":"Calibri","16":11}">was ordained and has been a deacon for thirteen years. After college, he served on Parish Council and helped organize and work many Armenian events within the church. Injajigian has a Bachelor's degree in Pharmacy from Albany Colloge of Pharmacy of Union University.   Keywords <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Armenia; Armenian Massacre; Turkey; Greece; Endicott Johnson; Ellis Island; Church; Sunday school"}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":15105,"3":{"1":0},"11":4,"12":0,"14":[null,2,0],"15":"Calibri","16":11}">Armenia; Armenian Massacre; Turkey; Greece; Endicott Johnson; Ellis Island; Church; Sunday school Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Armenian Oral History Project Interview with: Jack Injajigian Interviewed by: Gregory Smaldone Transcriber: Cordelia Jannetty Date of interview: 22 March 2016 Interview Setting: Binghamton, NY -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (Start of Interview) 0:01 GS: This is Gregory Smaldone with the Armenian Oral History Project at Binghamton University’s Special Collection’s Library. Can you please state your name for the record? 0:09 JI: Jack Injajigian. 0:11 GS: Injajigian and how old are you sir? 0:13 JI: I am 64. 0:15 GS: Where were you born? 0:16 JI: I was born in Binghamton, New York. 0:18 GS: Okay, how long did you spend in Binghamton? 0:22 JI: All my life. 0:23 GS: Can you tell me a little bit about your parents please? 0:26 JI: My mother was born in Izmir, Turkey, and she grew up in Greece. Her family moved there in her early age, when she was two years old and she grew up in Greece until 1951 she got married to my dad. My dad was born in Sivas, Turkey, Central Turkey, Sebastia as part of the region of Sebastia. He was born in 1909. He was involved obviously in the Armenian Massacres 1915. He endured that and he came to America in 1921 where he came to Binghamton and actually lived with his sister, his half-sister and his family in Binghamton. And then in 1950 he went to Greece. My parents married and they came to America. And I was born in 1952. 1:27 GS: Now, I am assuming both of your parents spoke Armenian? 1:30 JI: Very much so, yes. 1:32 GS: Okay, what were their professions? 1:35 JI: My mother was, actually my mother was a housewife. My father was a shoemaker. He ̶ when he came when he was of age ̶ he worked for Endicott Johnson which is a local shoe factory here that many people in Binghamton were in this tri-city area were employed in. And then he also opened up a shoemaker shop after several years on the Southside of Binghamton until he retired back in 1975 I believe. 2:14 GS: Okay, what was the highest of level of education your parents received? 2:17 JI: I am going to say my father, I have, my father ̶ I am going to say my mother grammar school, and my father I think he just started working, my father I believe went to the Jarvis Street local school for maybe a year or two that was kind of like a trade school at that time in the neighborhood but I do not believe there is any other formal of education for him. He just went to work. 2:50 GS: Did your parents ever share their story with you of what it was like going through the Armenian genocide? 2:55 JI: My father did several times. He did, I listened to it. He did it among family members and friends. He did and many times like I said and I have not, my only regret like I told you was, it was not documented, as specifically as I would like to have done it, but I knew of it. My mother actually did not come through, obviously did not endure the genocide but again, her story is also one of support of my father and for me. 3:33 GS: Can you share some of your father’s story, whatever you remember? 3:37 JI: Whatever what I remember was the fact that at an early age and at that time he was about six years old when the genocide was when the gendarmes were coming into the villages and cleaning out every one and killing every one. He and his mother fled to a safer ground and then at that time from what he said that they were split, he from the mother and she split from her mother and I guess caught up with the bunch of Kurds and they took him in and basically they took him in until ended up in an orphanage. And after he was there for three or four years until at the age of eleven, twelve years old he came to America through Ellis Island. 4:24 GS: And did he meet up with family in America? 4:26 JI: He met up with family; with his sisters, half-sister through Ellis Island they had located him and he ended up in Binghamton, New York. 4:35 GS: Do you have any siblings? 4:38 JI: No. 4:39 GS: Okay, so you are an only child. 4:40 JI: I am an only child. 4:41 GS: Did your parents teach you Armenian or speak Armenian to you when you growing up? 4:45 JI: Yes, they did, from the time I was one or two years old they talked to me in Armenian until conversation wise throughout the years and I can speak Armenian conversation wise now fluently. 5:01 GS: Did you ever receive any formal training in Armenian? 5:05 JI: When you say formal training, um, language only whatever training I had was at the time when we were growing up at our local church at St. Gregory’s Armenian Church. We had Armenian classes that lasted, again it was once a week type of a training but at that time I knew conversation with Armenian, it was just a fact of me refining the words, the Armenian words, some of the ones that I did not understand outside, above and beyond the conversation. 5:37 GS: Okay, how fluent where your parents in English? 5:40 JI: They were fluent to the point where you could understand them. My father was, they were both fluent. Okay, as far as, they are fluent and there is enough to basically understand and conduct conversations as the years went on. They have got, they were fluent. 6:03 GS: Would you say that English or Armenian was the language most spoken in your household? 6:07 JI: I am going to say that it was believe it or not it was Armenian and only English when we were among our English friends, American friends. And also I did not understand it but they also spoke Turkish too. 6:25 GS: Okay, now let us talk a little bit about your childhood; when you were growing up, would you say that you had mostly an Armenian group of friends, mostly American group of friends or some combination of both? 6:38 JI: I had mostly when you consider it as basically it has to be American obviously. I went to school, made a lot of friends, neighborhood friends. I did have my Armenian friends and that was basically the focal point like I said before was at our St. Gregory’s Armenian Church. So, at the time to say they were good friends, they became good friends because at the age of five years old my parents ̶ I have sang in the choir with all my, all the adult members of the church. So I was pretty fortunate that my parents had taken me at an early age. And that was how I got to people my age basically became good friends, Armenian friends. But for the most part, I had more American friends obviously through the daily activities that I had. 7:31 GS: Would you say that your Armenian friends and your American friends tended to exist in separate spheres? 7:37 JI: No. I think that we as Armenians since we were at that time meeting and congregating once a month at least, that was the only time we had church. You know we were integrated into American community obviously. So, it was not just a cut and dry type thing. 7:54 GS: What was the Armenian community like when you were growing up? Was it large? Was it vibrant? Where did it tend to meet? Where did it congregate? 8:01 JI: For a small community when you say vibrant for a small community we were vibrant. I could remember the gatherings, again when you have community functions once a month especially church or otherwise if there was a special event that was happening I remember maybe sixty to seventy Armenians at the time dinners and functions, the church was always full for us. And When I say for our community, fifty to sixty to seventy with all their families growing up was a vibrant community for this area. 8:40 GS: You say you had meeting once a month, was that how frequently church met? 8:44 JI: That was how frequent for the most part, that was how frequently church met. In fact it met ̶ it was so vibrant in the sense that obviously it was vibrant enough that back in let’s see fifty. Fifty years ago, I do not know I would say forty five, some forty five years ago, up to that point when I was nineteen we had applied to get a full time Parish. We had a group of Armenian people along with the priest, a committee, a search committee comes to Binghamton and to see the viability of our church having a regular Armenian pastor and that was, as a result of that meeting, we had our first, one of our early full-time pastors. 9:37 GS: Okay, what were some other ways, other than speaking Armenian that your parents tried to maintain the sense of Armenian identity for you? 9:46 JI: Many ways. My mother was a seamstress but she was a great baker and a cook of Armenian delicacies, pastries. Everything she was perfectionist at what she did at an early age she learnt from her sister-in-law and also from her mother in Greece. She was a seamstress. She ̶ everything we revolved around the church. Twenty four/seven whenever we had a church ̶ that explains the vibrancy at that time with all the people and her group of friends she joined the women’s guild. She sang in the choir. She did anything that had to be done to basically move the community forward. As a result I got caught in that and like I said before I was ̶ I started singing in the choir at five years old age and throughout the years, I did ̶ they integrated me with that. Okay, and that to me probably the best thing for me to and as resulted in what I do today. 10:55 GS: What is that what you do today? 10:57 JI: Oh, I am a deacon now. I was ordained thirteen years ago. But I also was a sub-deacon for many years. So, I graduated from that. As people as the community became smaller throughout the years as I got older, I realized there is a need and responsibility for me to continue what my forefathers did. And I have been fortunate to actually after college I was involved to the point where obviously I was on Parish Council and I served as much as I could with annual events and to organize and help organize and work at them; picnics, functions, banquets, fundraisers. I was involved in the dance, anything to basically keep the Armenian spirit alive in this community. 11:47 GS: Okay, going a little back to your childhood you said the Armenian Church only met once a month but did you have like a Sunday school or a language school on top of the service? 11:56 JI: That once a month was a Sunday school and it was done with the general discussion that we had again. We did not have a priest at that time. We had a Sunday School Superintendent. The only time that once a month was replaced was when we had especial event where we had once a month when a priest came or a visiting pastor or when the bishop came and visited our community and then that would have been the only time basically we that would have been substituted for once a month. As we always growing up through the years. 12:30 GS: You said your mother was a pretty prominent baker as you were growing up. Would you say that most households would you know try and cook traditional Armenian food? Growing up was there some sense of like sharing of material sharing of food was there like one place ̶ 12:47 JI: Yes, I believe at that time when I was growing up there was. Because there were people that were older than her and she was very close to all the women in the church. I do not believe she had any enemies. She was well-liked and she was a type of person that basically did not want any accolades for what she did and I think that was what endeared her to the Armenian community. That is one thing I remember growing up. And that was the tone she set for me in terms of when I became older, when I set the tone in terms of how to basically live my life so to speak, in terms of respecting others and again we used to have discussions of this mind you in Armenian and being the only child I think she put positive pressure on me growing up and I think it is based on the fact that she wanted me to succeed. She worked very hard. My parents lived from week to week. She was the one actually that was the driving force of us surviving financially, being that she made her own clothes, altered clothes, baked, she scrimped and that was the reason why I think she instilled that in me at the time. 14:17 GS: Now, where did you attend college? 14:20 JI: I attended locally for two years, Broome, now it is SUNY Broome, but at that time it was called at that time it was Broome Community College. And at that time my aspirations were to be a mechanical engineer ever since I was a little boy and then at time for whatever reason I think there were a lot of unemployed engineers around back in the early seventies. I changed my major to pharmacy and thanks to some of the advice, my professors had given me and I was pretty, I did well at Chemistry. So I tried it. It was a little bit unearthing for me to all the years that trying to change a major I was not sure if this was going to work but then I transferred to Albany College of Pharmacy which is part of Union University and where I finished up my three years at the college. And as I look back now I have no regrets as far as ̶ 15:17 GS: Do you have any children on your own? 15:18 JI: No. 15:19 GS: Okay, what has it ̶ Can you discuss to me how the Armenian community has changed from the time when you grew up until up to the time now? 15:30 JI: I think we were closer then. I think times have changed in the sense ̶ we were closer, friendlier I think it was a friendly; it was I am not saying friendlier but it was a closer knit community. When you have a group of people working together as the community shrunk, as people got older, I mean the skills, obviously the skills set and everything, someone had to do the work. A lot of our young members of our community, I stay happened to stay in Binghamton. Other people have left. All my friends and all the other generations left for jobs obviously. At that time Binghamton was not really the place to be and even now I am not to a point they are trying to come back with this but the job market was tight. So all my friends moved away and they got good jobs wherever they went. I think it has ̶ a lot has to do with the shrinking of the community at that time. I think the community was closer. Now I think the mindset is as I go and see this what we worked for, young families now have a tendency to be tied up more on the weekends especially when events come they seem to be that the priority of the church, in other words, basically one of the tops of the list and that is the mindset now I believe, that is how I see it. 17:01 GS: So you think that the church has decreased in importance over time? 17:06 JI: It is decreased, in terms of importance, I would say that the church is the church. Everyone wants, you know everyone is still going to church but as far as doing all the extracurricular things, times have changed. Now the husband and the wife work. At that time do not forget the husband was working and the wife was the home-maker. Very seldom you find that now. I mean times have changed throughout the years. And I guess people have shied away from that. The other thing too I do not want to get into it as the Armenian doctrine I mean I grew up Armenian and speaking Armenian and now up to this point I could read Armenian now. You know now times have changed, kids ̶ to draw kids back to the church in this case or the Armenian youth ̶ Armenian is not ̶ they are doing more in English and you see a lot of the communities now are trying to bring kids back by knowing that they could understand what was going on. And English seems to be the more ̶ what we seem to be heading towards so to speak ̶ 18:16 GS: How do you feel about that trend? 18:19 JI: At this point I, for the young kids to come I agree with. For me it is either way. I mean I personally I am proud of what I have, my Armenian heritage in terms of speaking. Unfortunately in Binghamton I very seldom have a chance to do that anymore because there are not many people around anymore that will but I still welcome a good conversation in Armenian if I get the chance in my store if I see someone and they seem to be from Armenia or from the old country I will. I will talk with them. 18:55 GS: How do you identify yourself? 18:58 JI: I identify myself as from going back to childhood I identified myself as a person who is a proud Armenian from where I came from, from where my father’s come from and I am passionate about what he endured, I identify myself as a caring person and I identify myself as someone that basically ̶ 19:35 GS: Let us put it this way, would you say you are Armenian, Armenian-American, American-Armenian, American? I give you that, you have to choose one of those… 19:40 JI: I am an American-Armenian. 19:43 GS: American-Armenian? What would you say is the most important of your Armenian identity? 19:49 JI: My most important part of my Armenian identity is basically the church, going to church. That was where we started, that was where I started my ̶ it was not only just like going to church, it was not just the religious sanctuary for us, it was a gathering point of where we did things. We had events, we learnt, we had plays, we congregated and that was basically how I got to know everyone. I have served the community in several ways and that is how I identify myself is through the church. 20:28 GS: Do you think the church is a primarily social or religious institution in this community? 20:34 JI: At this point as time has gone on I am going to say basically, I am going to basically say it is kind of split down in the middle. I do not think it is totally I mean we do as much as we can only because we do not have church on a regular basis. 20:56 GS: Tell me about your path in becoming a sub-deacon and then a deacon and why you felt a responsibility to become deacon? 21:05 JI: It is just a passion, it is something that is come from my heart. It is something when you start at five years old to sing in the choir and then you know again through a tradition of people leaving, people passing away, I think it was like a torch being passed on and I felt the need it is just something from inside that I felt in need and of course the next step was sub-deacon and thanks to our priest at the time when I was nineteen years old, got us involved, He was a full-time priest and the it was only shortly that another priest ̶ The gauntlet was laid down when we, we have had four or five priests priest right now but it was only shortly after that the I was last thirteen years or twelve years since I would been a full deacon. This is the only thing that was holding me back was basically learning how to speak Armenian and I did that. 21:58 GS: When did you become sub-deacon? At what age? 22:01 JI: I am going to say basically I was serving on the altar but officially I think I was like eighteen or nineteen years old when the bishop came. 22:10 GS: And when did you become deacon? 22:12 JI: The deacon was in 2004. So about twelve years now. 22:16 GS: Can you tell me how and why that happened? 22:19 JI: It was thanks to of a visiting priest, kind of laid the gauntlet down and said if you want help this young priest of yours, you might wanna read an Armenian become a deacon to help him out even more and so it kind of laid a challenge for me and I said to myself you know as I was doing this I felt a need. It was all part of serving the community. It opened up some doors like I served the community more than I usually did in my capacities as sub-deacon. 22:48 GS: Okay, how has your own community changed since you have become deacon? 22:55 JI: I accepted, me ̶ shortly after I was I accepted, I performed events that I usually did not do as sub-deacon. Some I have been involved more in events where I could do more, participate more that includes going and ̶ you know again with the fact there was not a priest available at the time on a regular basis I can pick up the slack and do some of the things that priest do on a limited basis. And house visitation, prayers, grave blessings on Memorial Day. I took that upon myself that was my initial intention when I was thinking of this that you know how much more I can serve the community and this was an avenue for me to do that. I have done some, unfortunately I have done some funerals one for a I have helped one when there was an absence of the priest and I have done some funerals for close friends of mine where there was not a priest available. So you know I got to be more involved in that sense. 24:05 GS: Can you tell me about the establishment of the Armenian Genocide memorial by the Washington Street Bridge? 24:13 JI: The establishment at the time initially when we were first ̶ this was maybe several years ago, like I told you before we planted a tree. That was the initial recognition of our community toward the Armenians in the Genocide ̶ 24:31 GS: Who made this decision? 24:32 JI: The committee that was responsible for this and it was not church related was the one that made the decision to have a monument there. 24:42 GS: Who established this committee? 24:44 JI: Who established the committee? The committee was established by concerned citizens that were already involved in the events that they were organizing like I mentioned to you; the Kradjian family and a few others basically. They were passionate about this. And it turned out to be something that we needed. 25:10 GS: Where do you see the Armenian Binghamton Community going in the future and what are your thoughts on the Armenian diaspora in general going forward? 25:21 JI: Well, I feel it, as far as our community goes, the next twenty years I thought of that many years, I do not think there is going to be any Armenian language in the next twenty years that is why English has become a little more of a kind of ̶ the English language seems to be the one that is going to, you know continue to bring people to Church, there will still be a church whether it is an Armenian Church, although we say Armenian, I do not feel that at this point due the small size of the Parish and the fact that we do not have a regular shepherd to tend to the flock I feel it is going more towards English, more toward non-Armenian. There will still be a church that is how I envision it. This is the plight of the small communities basically. I feel it outside near metropolitan areas that case, the bigger towns, the bigger cities ̶ our communities here really and I am being kind will go toward that type of a direction so to speak English, English speaking. 26:38 GS: So do you think, introducing English into the church is a threat to Armenian, you know Armenian Communities’ identity? Maybe threat is a strong word but you think it risks it? 26:52 JI: It risks it, I think it does and I am thinking only if this community but there are a lot of small communities like this. I am talking about Syracuse and Rochester, Upstate New York communities, Niagara Falls, I mean I have had the pleasure of serving as deacon in the Syracuse community. I see the same type of a trend. Okay, I mean people, the have about the same amount of members but there is no succession, the plan of succession has to be there. And that is what I am worried about basically. 27:55 GS: Okay, all right, well Jack thank you very much for your time we really appreciate your help. 27:29 JI: Oh, sure. (End of Recording) Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Jack Injajigian https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/cb817d78ffad1ed070a2a06df74efcbd.jpg c3b1365c25f20c00222cff01dae49b11 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/b279253da26ae698cbbb1355b798aaa5.mp3 19a26828668f1d7154aa5cb3f0aa5bc5 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Audio interviews Title A name given to the resource McKiernan Interviews Description An account of the resource Stephen McKiernan's collection of interviews includes more than two hundred interviews with prominent figures of the 1960s, which were collected between the mid-1990s to 2023 The collection provides narratives of people who were actively involved in or witnessed events in the 1960s, an era which spurred profound cultural and political transformation in the twentieth century. Interviewees include politicians, artists, scholars, musicians, authors, and veterans who delve into the decade’s most prominent issues and events, including the civil rights movement, the free speech movement, the anti-war movement, women’s rights, gay rights, segregation, the Vietnam War, Woodstock, Hippies, Yippies, and individualism. <h3>The McKiernan 22</h3> <div>Stephen McKiernan interviewed legends of the 1960s. When asked in 2021 where one should start when sifting through his vast collection, he provided the following list:</div> <ul> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/854">Julian Bond</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1866">Bobby Muller</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1175">Craig McNamara</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/910">Dr. Arthur Levine</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/837">Diane Carlson Evans</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/942">Dr. Ellen Schrecker</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/876">Dr. Lee Edwards</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/841">Peter Coyote</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1233">Dr. Roosevelt Johnson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/899">Rennie Davis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1222">Kim Phuc</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/917">George McGovern</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/833">Frank Schaeffer</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/840">Rev. Dr. Frank Forrester Church </a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1240">Dr. Marilyn Young</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/842">James Fallows</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/835">Joseph Lee Galloway</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/911">John Lewis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/839">Paul Critchlow</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/888">Steve Gunderson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1159">Charles Kaiser</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/2407">Joseph Lewis</a></li> </ul> Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Stephen McKiernan Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Language A language of the resource English Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright. Template: Simple Audio Player (Amplitude.js) This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Jack Smith, 1945-2004 Date of Interview ND Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Stephen McKiernan Language English Digital Publisher Binghamton University Libraries Digital Format audio/mp4 Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data 2 Microcassettes Material Type Sound Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 94:27 Biographical Text <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Jack Smith (1945-2004) was an Emmy Award-Winning former correspondent for ABC News. Smith is known for reporting on the Iran-Contra affair, the fall of the Berlin Wall, and technology in the Silicon Valley. He received Bachelor's degrees from Carnegie Mellon University in 1971 and from Oxford University in 1974."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":13059,"3":{"1":0},"4":[null,2,16777215],"11":4,"12":0,"15":"Arial","16":10}">Jack Smith (1945-2004) was an Emmy Award-Winning former correspondent for ABC News. Smith is known for reporting on the Iran-Contra affair, the fall of the Berlin Wall, and technology in the Silicon Valley. He received Bachelor's degrees from Carnegie Mellon University in 1971 and from Oxford University in 1974. Keywords <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Baby boom generation; Sexual revolution; College; Counterculture; Labor union; Flat wages; VISTA; End of Vietnam War; Self-indulgence; Consumer Movement; Jane Fonda; Vietnam Memorial."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":513,"3":{"1":0},"12":0}">Baby boom generation; Sexual revolution; College; Counterculture; Labor union; Flat wages; VISTA; End of Vietnam War; Self-indulgence; Consumer Movement; Jane Fonda; Vietnam Memorial. Subject LCSH Reporters and reporting; ABC News; Smith, Jack, 1945-2004--Interviews Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Rights Statement Many items in our digital collections are copyrighted. If you want to reuse any material in our collection you must seek permission, or decide if your purpose can qualify as fair use under the U.S. Copyright Law Section 107. If you think copyright or privacy has been violated, the University Libraries will investigate the issue. Please see our take down policy. If using any materials in this online digital collection for educational or research purposes, please cite accordingly. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Jack Smith Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Smith, Jack, 1945-2004 ; McKiernan, Stephen Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/wav Subject The topic of the resource Reporters and reporting; ABC News; Smith, Jack, 1945-2004--Interviews Description An account of the resource Jack Smith (1945-2004) was an Emmy Award-Winning former correspondent for ABC News. Smith is known for reporting on the Iran-Contra affair, the fall of the Berlin Wall, and technology in the Silicon Valley. He received Bachelor's degrees from Carnegie Mellon University in 1971 and from Oxford University in 1974. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource ND Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context McKiernan.Oral.10.2016.151a ; McKiernan.Oral.10.2016.151a Date Modified Date on which the resource was changed. 2018-03-29 Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. McKiernan Interviews Extent The size or duration of the resource. 94:27 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/f3c98b757796ce138c8b5a38e4e4e6bf.mp3 093a99df6ee3bfd947acb3ae9fcccf45 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Oral Histories Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories from 1960s Binghamton Alumni Description An account of the resource In 2019, Binghamton University Libraries completed a mission to collect oral interviews from 1960s alumni as a means to preserve memories of campus life. The resulting 47 tales are a retrospective of social, professional and personal experiences with the commonality of Harpur College. Some stories tell of humble beginnings, others discuss the formation of friendships; each provides insight into a moment in our community's rich history. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Irene Gashurov Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-2018 Relation A related resource <a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/browse?collection=18">McKiernan Interviews : 60's collection of Oral Histories</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright. Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Date of Interview 2018-11-09 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Irene Gashurov Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Jackie and John Visser Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Year of Graduation Jackie 1969 John 1973 Biographical Text Jackie is a lecturer in Education at Binghamton University; John was more of a stay-at-home father. Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Rights Statement Many items in our digital collections are copyrighted. If you want to reuse any material in our collection you must seek permission, or decide if your purpose can qualify as fair use under the U.S. Copyright Law Section 107. If you think copyright or privacy has been violated, the University Libraries will investigate the issue. Please see our take down policy. If using any materials in this online digital collection for educational or research purposes, please cite accordingly. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Alumni Interviews Interview with: Jackie and John Visser Interviewed by: Irene Gashurov Transcriber: Oral History Lab Date of interview: 8 November 2018 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (Start of Interview) IG: 00:01 Okay, we are on now. JV: 00:02 Okay. My name is Jackie Visser. IG: 00:05 Yes. JV: 00:05 I am I am working here at the Department of Teaching, Learning and Educational Leadership as a lecturer, and we are sitting in my office on November 8, 2018. JoV: 00:15 I am John Visser, retired, in the same office. [crosstalk] [laughter] IG: 00:25 Okay. So, you know, maybe we can answer certain questions sort of in tandem, you know, if anybody wants to JV: 00:33 Jump in. IG: 00:34 Jump in or digress, you know, it is up to you. It is a conversation that we are having with the two of you. So where did you grow up, Jackie? JV: 00:45 I grew up on Long Island. I was West Islip. Is the name of the town. Lived there, went to school there. All my kindergarten through 12th grade classes were there, and then I came to Harpur College. JoV: 01:02 I went to Goshen, New York High School, lived there for a long time, and came to Binghamton in it was July, the summer session of July, 1965 there were about four or 500 students, and that is when Harpur had the trimester situation. And each-each semester lasted for four months. And the summer session went July, August, September and October. JV: 01:34 Parts of October. IG: 01:36 So, Jackie, tell me a little bit about your upbringing. Did your parents go to college? What were their expectations for you? Was education valued in your family? JV: 01:50 Education was certainly valued, but neither of my parents went to college. I mean, I was, we were part of that baby boom generation moved out to a development on Long Island. My father had been in the army. He was a factory worker. My mom ended up driving a school bus. But there was absolutely no doubt in anybody's mind that I was supposed to go to college. And that was just part of what my family was like, it was a, you know, I had two brothers who neither, one of whom went to college. But for some reason I am the one. I was the oldest and, and I know my-my father was one who just insisted that, you know, you get as much schooling as you possibly can so. IG: 02:36 And why do you think that that was? Why do you think that you were, you know, selected in your family to go on to higher education? Your brothers were not well. JV: 02:50 I think it might have been. I was the oldest, and I was and I was doing really well in school. So, I think they saw that possibility, whereas my next youngest brother was not getting all the A's, and he, you know, I think they were probably more opportunities for boys who did not have a college education at the time, as opposed to opportunities for women who did not have a college, college education. So, I do not know. I never really discussed it with them, why they, why they wanted that for me, but that that, maybe that was it. IG: 03:31 Why did you decide to go to Harpur and not another school? JV: 03:37 Well, cost was obviously a factor. Back in the (19)60s, there was this opportunity called the Regent Scholarship, which was paid for your entire tuition. And so state schools was obviously the goal, you know, was where I was going to go. Stony Brook was fairly close, but that would have meant, and I felt like I wanted to get away from from-from home, right? And guidance counselors really pushed me here. There was, there were three or four of us from my high school who ended up coming here. IG: 04:15 What did, what was the reputation of Harpur College back then? JV: 04:20 It was, it was, it was- IG: 04:21 What did they say about it? Your guidance counselors? JV: 04:24 -highly selective, hard to get into. They encouraged me to apply for the summer semester, the summer trimester. IG: 04:33 I see. JV: 04:34 Because supposedly the trimester, the summer session was-was easier to get into than the than the fall semester trimester. So, I do not know. I do not know if I would have gotten into the fall semester or not. You know, I was a good student. I had pretty good SATs, I guess, but I do not know. I was too naive to understand all that at the time. IG: 04:55 Did you have an idea of what you wanted to what studies you wanted to pursue? JV: 04:59 Absolutely not never. [laughs] Oh, did not I? We had the luxury those days of being in a liberal arts college. IG: 05:12 I remember. JV: 05:14 Started out as a math major, that list about two semesters, tried economics for a while. That did not last too long. Ended up graduating as a sociology major. Ended up getting enough Bs in those courses to graduate. IG: 05:34 So, we will return to that. We will return to your academics and other things. How about you, John? JoV: 05:43 My family, I was the first in my family to go to college. My parents, my dad was born in the Netherlands, my mother was born in Poland, and they were absolutely adamant that I needed to go to school and to college and to get ahead. And I mean, they were very insisted, both my brother and I went to school. And it was there was no question my neither my dad, went through like eighth grade. My mother completed like through the third or fourth grade, and she had lived in Poland and in war she was she had been relocated to Germany as a forced laborer. And my dad had been relocated to Germany as a forced laborer from the Netherlands, and that was where they meant. So, it was very insistent that we go to school. And again, like Jackie said about the reason I went to Harpur, means it was all the guidance counselors touted it as a very selective place. Liberal Arts, the most difficult one of the universities in the state of New York, the public ones to get into. And I like Jackie, I wanted to get away from home, and this sounded like the place to be. And one, one of my reasons for coming during the summer trimester was to play soccer. I was a soccer player, and you-you could all by the time the fall semester trimester started, it would be the season be over. So, if you want to play soccer, you had to come during the middle of the summer. But there being so few students. We were very-very slim pickings. You know, people who had any experience at all mean 400 total students. That means 200 male students. How many soccer players are there? Not a whole lot. IG: 07:31 Not a whole lot. JV: 07:32 Camps- Camp Harpur is what we called it. You know, it was- IG: 07:35 In the summertime? JV: 07:36 Oh, yeah, it was very it was as empty a campus as it is now. Well, remember, it was a much smaller campus, you know. JoV: 07:43 But there was a lot of construction going on. IG: 07:45 It was here. It was here. JV: 07:47 Yeah, already. JoV: 07:48 It was already here. But and it was the beginning of a big boom. I mean, there was construction everywhere. And I think for the next 10 years we had perpetual construction going on-on all the sites. IG: 08:01 Could I ask, just out of my own curiosity, why did your immigrant parents come to Goshen rather than New York City or some other, you know, immigrant magnet? JoV: 08:15 Well, I mean, it turns out my dad had relatives [crosstalk] pre immigrated. They had already here. So, I see, you know, he needed a place where, you know, he could have some touch with, you know, somebody, and I think, couple of his brothers and one of his sisters already here. But one of his one of his sisters immigrated to Australia, and out of a family of seven, there was only one that remained in the Netherlands after everybody wanted, you know, did all the relocating. IG: 08:47 Very interesting. JV: 08:50 If you want to do research [crosstalk] IG: 08:52 Yeah. Extremely interesting. That is extremely interesting. So, you know, so, what are some of the early impressions of the college? when you first arrived, you said that it was undergoing, you know, construction, virtual, you know, perpetual construction. There were very few students. What were, who were the students in your classes? You know, how were they all from New York City, some from upstate, you know, describe what the milieu was like. JoV: 09:27 Well, preponderance of people were from New York City, but there were definitely people from the Buffalo area, the Syracuse area, a few local people, not, not a whole lot. But, you know, I think the admissions people at the university at Harpur College made it a point to bring in people from all over the state. I do not think we had very many people from out of state, but a few foreign students. IG: 09:53 From where? JoV: 09:55 One of the people I knew came from Iran, another one from Africa somewhere. And they were on, I do not know how they had gotten in, but, you know, we-we had made friends with them, and because I knew they want a soccer team, because they were the best, most experienced soccer players. But I mean, I think you are right. I mean, half the people would you say, dear come from- ame from New York City, Long Island area, at least. JV: 10:22 That was, that was I lived on in the dormitory, and that is where, I mean, that is how I got basically introduced to New York, you know, visiting them on breaks and spending time with them, because I met them, you know, I was farther out on Long Island. We did not go into the city a lot, so, but most of our friends were, were definitely Queens and Manhattan in the Bronx and folks. And then there were some people from Long Island. As I said, there at least two-two came with me. Two classmates of mine from my high school came here. But we did know a lot of folks from-from the Buffalo area and upstate New York. IG: 11:03 Were there any, you know, I imagine that the differences were slight, the cultural differences between upstate students and New York City students. Did you notice any of these? But you were, you came from such a multi-multi home. So, you must have felt very different. JoV: 11:23 The student body was mostly middle class. Most of the students that I met were, if not first time, you know, generation college students, then you know, maybe it had brothers or sisters, but they were very much middle class. And, you know, we got along in that because we were- all had the same experiences. I did not find anybody who you know. My father was a doctor. My father has been- my father was a lawyer. My grandfather has been a lawyer. I did not experience that at all. This is all. We were all here together for first time. See what it was like. JV: 11:55 Yeah, that is pretty much. I cultural differences, not really. IG: 12:00 Not really. JV: 12:00 I mean, I think we the biggest cultural learning that took place for me was learning about more Jewish traditions and cultures. I mean, I remember making matzah brei in the dorm and, you know, just understanding Jewish traditions and cultures and foods and things like that. But other than that, I do not remember. JoV: 12:25 The other thing was the different dialects of New York. Yeah, people from Buffalo speak differently than people from Long Island, than the people from Brooklyn, than the people from Albany, New York, and the people who were, you know, in the Binghamton area. And that was my always sensitivity to, "Wow, I know where you are from. You are from Rochester, perhaps closer to Buffalo, but definitely in that neck of the woods." And- IG: 12:48 So, you have, you have a very good ear. JoV: 12:51 I tend to listen very carefully, and, you know, try to pinpoint where people's accents come from. JV: 12:59 And he tried to beat the Long Island accent out of me. [laughter] JoV: 13:07 30, 40 years. But Jackie's Long Island accent has now disappeared and is now she is a local. IG: 13:15 So, what are some ticks of Binghamton locals’ speech ticks? JV: 13:23 I know that you ask, it is kind of hard to think there is [crosstalk] IG: 13:31 I mean, it is not, it is not necessary for the interview, but if you can think of it, I am just taking this because I do not have it watch. So JV: 13:40 I cannot think of anything. IG: 13:42 You cannot think of anything. I think that there is sort of, you know, a little to a voice, but I cannot, you know, I will identify it when I hear it, but I am [crosstalk] JoV: 13:52 More nasally twang. There is a there are some colloquialisms that are definitely Binghamtonian and but, you know the one- JV: 14:03 It is a double negative that use. JoV: 14:05 So do not I. JV: 14:06 Yeah, so do not I, you know, you know, "I really like brownies." "Well, so do not I, "you know, JV: 14:13 Oh-oh, that is very interesting. JoV: 14:15 It just struck us as, you know [crosstalk] IG: 14:19 That is so interesting. JV: 14:21 The bars would serve tomato pie, Hot Pie. You know, they would advertise instead of pizza, it was called Hot Pie. Let us go to Mike's and get a hot pie. JoV: 14:30 Culinary city chicken, which is, I do not think it is, I do not know why it is called city, and I do not think it is chicken. JV: 14:37 Pork in it, I think. [crosstalk] like meat on a stick. [laughs] I do not know how else to describe it, but just, but how much, how much of some of those things were just regional, and how much was growing up? Because you got to remember, you know, when you are we are finally 18, and now you are on your own, and you are navigating things on your own. So, is it really? Is it really that much different from where I grew up, or is it just the stage of life now, where I am learning about the world? So, I always, you know- JV: 15:00 Yeah, it is what you- JV: 15:07 Yeah. IG: 15:08 You know what you are paying attention to. JV: 15:11 Exactly. IG: 15:12 So, what was, what were the academics like? Were you- are there any professors that stand out, any courses that stand out in your mind that kind of determined you to take a certain route in your career? JoV: 15:32 I would like to answer that. IG: 15:34 Yes. JoV: 15:34 Is- the fact that we are in a liberal art we I took an art course from a professor Wilson who designed JFK memorial in Downtown Binghamton, and the fact that he was instructing freshmen was always amazing to me. Here is an established artist and taking liberal arts courses from various people and who had real academic standing. And I did not, you know it was the anthropology courses, the-the economic courses, but it just the, just the broadness. I mean, I guess you know, being-being, having become, becoming well rounded in various fields, that was the most interesting thing to me. Sometimes I had to redirect myself. "Oh, you got to take these courses." And it was just I was never that interested in, you know, I was always more interested in finding more courses, different courses to take. And that was really quite intriguing. JV: 16:30 I have to admit, I was not a student. That was not JoV: 16:32 You were a student. JV: 16:34 I was. I managed to get through. I did get a degree, but classes and courses, that was not what interested me on campus. I would that was not who I was. [laughs] so- IG: 16:46 Who were you on campus? JV: 16:48 I was a member of lots of campus activities, you know, I- there was a poster, the-the-the I was a member of the student council board, the student center board. It says, presented by the student center board, yeah, and so we, they would bring, and I was on, it was on dorm governance, and just various organizations on campus that that was something that really- IG: 17:17 So, what were so, what-what did these organizations, what did the Mitchell trio? JV: 17:24 It was the folk trio--there was a concert, yeah. So, they had the- IG: 17:27 John Denver, the John Denver. JV: 17:29 Yes. IG: 17:29 Oh, wow. JoV: 17:30 Yeah. JoV: 17:30 Oh, you Chad Mitchell trio. Before-before became John Denver, he was part of a trio. IG: 17:35 Oh, I have no I had no idea. JV: 17:39 And after the concert, you know, he and his guitar went over to somebody's house in Johnson City, and he serenaded us all again, you know, IG: 17:46 How wonderful. JV: 17:48 We talked about. We brought Simon and Garfunkel to campus and paid them, like, less than $2,000 for the concert down in the gym, the first gym. JoV: 18:00 Obviously, before they got really really-really expensive. JV: 18:03 That is, that is wonderful. So-so that was your activity. It was finding those groups- JV: 18:09 Finding those groups and being involved with the people, you know, the other students who were part of that, you know, that was what really interested me, as opposed to, I got through my classes. But I that was where- IG: 18:22 So, what-what, you know, were students talking about? What did they care about during this time? JoV: 18:29 Let me, let me answer [crosstalk] a little bit. This was in the days 1965 all young men who were not in college were going to be drafted. And I can tell you, I mean, that was the number one topic, the war in Vietnam was going full tilt, and if you got kicked out of school, did not come to school, you were going to get drafted and you were going to go to Vietnam. And I can tell you that all the male students, that was their overriding concern. They may have had. They might have had career goals. They might have been pursuing a degree in something they really want. But this stood above all. I mean, this was always on your mind. So- IG: 19:07 Do you feel that it was a, an anxiety that everyone shared, all men shared? JV: 19:13 Gap year. JoV: 19:13 Gap year out of it. I mean, that was out of the question. You know, you want a gap year, you got to be drafted. So, it was definitely on everyone's mind, overriding every single day. You know, we get through and-and the war news. I mean, it just got worsened from 1965 to (19)66 to (19)67 to (19)68 I mean, the war just grew more and more intense. And, you know, the body count was really quite horrific. I graduated from Goshen High with there were 125 students. And there were, there were two people, I know who died. One of them lived on my street. And these were guys, young men, who did not go to college. They, you know, graduate high school, and within six months, they were in Vietnam, and within a year, they were dead. So, I, I felt that it was really, really tough going. JoV: 19:13 Oh, definitely. I mean, a lot of students, I among them, what do they call that? When you, when you, when you when you graduate from high school and you have a you take a year off, IG: 20:19 So, it, you know, it colored the mood. It colored the sort of the like the- JV: 20:23 Well, and then, and then, you know, we were, I am thinking the world. We were not as actively involved in protests, but that is what was starting to happen on campus. You know, that, that you were, you became very much aware of that there were, there were people around the country who were actively against the war, that were actively protesting against the war. I remember we- I think we finally did march from the campus to downtown- JoV: 20:47 1968. JV: 20:47 -1968 involved in a protest. But we were not, we did not occupy the administration building, because that is in my mind, that is not who I was protesting against. But I It was not. It was in 1970 was Kent State, was not it? So it was, we were still in the area, and you know that they, they closed the camp- they just sent in May of or rather, it was in April. So, there was still several more weeks now. Think about all that happens on a campus in April and May. In April, every single, just about every single university in this country since, said, "Go home. Just go home now." JoV: 21:33 And I remember- JV: 21:34 Go home. JoV: 21:35 And students met with the profs, and the prof said, “What kind of grade you want? Because, you know, we are shutting down. We are not doing any more final exams. We are not having any more classes. We are concluding this semester after Kent State, because we do not want the whole thing to blow up.” I mean, I mean, that was the kind of tension that Amnesty- 1965 the war was in a very low-level state. But it just grew and grew and grew and, you know, I- it was just an incredible build up and-and we knew some people who, I knew some people who either had had left school or flunked out, and then, you know, we had heard, oh, they were, you know, they were in the army, or a few of them went to Canada, you know there, and I have never seen some of those people again. IG: 22:26 So, but the campus did have some protests? JoV: 22:31 Oh yeah. IG: 22:32 But-but did you go on marches on Washington, or? JV: 22:39 No, it was just here. Yeah-yeah. I am sure there were students who there were busses and things to Washington. We just did not do that. JoV: 22:46 I mean, I would not call Bingham- Harpur College an activist. JV: 22:49 Yeah, we were not Columbia. JoV: 22:51 I mean, there were, there were people who were active, but not, not like Berkeley or Columbia. IG: 22:57 Yeah, um, so, you know, so when did you meet? When did you when did you meet? When were you together? JV: 23:13 John's roommate, he lived off campus, and my roommate were dating, and several of us would John-John had a car that was, and we would go out. And remember, the drinking age was 18 at the time, and so we would go out and have beers and hot pies and speedies and whatever. IG: 23:32 And this is when, what- JV: 23:33 -in the neighborhood bars, 19- JoV: 23:34 1967, 1968. JV: 23:35 (19)68 so we were just part of a group of people who palled around and then eventually started dating. IG: 23:44 Right. So, you knew each other since then? JV: 23:48 Yeah, but mainly his-his roommate and my roommate were dating, and so I got to know him that way. IG: 23:56 So, you know, I am thinking about the war, and you said that Harpur was not an activist school, per se, and yet, there was a lot of activity on campus that was sort of, you know, politicized. People were politicized here. So, were you part of any kind of, I do not know, paper or radio? JV: 24:19 No, I just was not, I was not that. I was more. I mean, even now, you know, we are good citizens and vote and stuff, but I have not been too much on Washington with my pink hat or anything, you know. I mean, I am support liberal ideas and contribute money and things like that, but not I am just done an activist kind of person. IG: 24:42 What were, what was the significance of, you know, the folk musicians, like the Mitchell Trio? JV: 24:49 They were fun. I mean, I remember what- who was that it became the kosher kitchen. But remember, there was a little coffee house, one of that little way the Fleishman Center is now, and the student, you. Union. And, you know, there people would bring guitars and play folk music, and then the Bill Barker or Bob Barker, what is his name? IG: 25:08 You know, was not it a change in sort of, you know, youth culture, because from-from all of the you know, folk musicians, they were, you know, Peter, Paul and Mary, for example, yeah, when I know Dylan, they all had, you know, a message of social change- JV: 25:25 Right. IG: 25:25 -political change- JV: 25:26 Right-right, yeah, definitely. IG: 25:27 Were you kind of alive to that, to that aspect of them? JV: 25:32 Yeah. JoV: 25:34 I mean, Bob Dylan, you know, was played in dorms from 1965 I mean, just repeatedly, everyone, almost everyone, was involved with Dylan. I mean, it was really the first off campus event I went to in New York, was to see a Dylan concert. I mean, I had seen a bunch on, you know, other concerts on campus, but where I really went out of my way to see Bob Dylan. And- IG: 26:01 Where did you see him? Do you remember? JoV: 26:05 I saw him--I think it was Carnegie Hall. IG: 26:07 Oh. JoV: 26:07 And it was one of his first electric concerts, and he sort of, he did some acoustic guitar the first half, and then he brought on his electric organ and-and he got booed [crosstalk] yes. And, you know, because they were, there were some purists in the audience. And then, you know, I think he eventually won them over, or at least the majority of the audience was won over. But Dylan, to me, is, I mean, I have, you know, as a friend of mine says, "John, have you, you know, bought all his vinyls?" I said, "I try," so very, you know, I think that whole theme of anti-war from him. I mean, I know there were others, other musicians, but I not, not, not as much as him. JV: 26:36 Yeah, no. And I mean, the whole counterculture kind of attitude, you know, do not trust anyone under over 30. And you know, knowing that, that you have some, you ae going to have some responsibility for moving you know that, that I definitely felt that I was, was part of me, but-but I just was not, you know, I was not a, an activist kind of person. [crosstalk] IG: 27:26 Your-your future life to be sort of along the same path as your family, as your mother and father. Did you think that you would get married and then, you know, have children and retire, or did you, did you envision a different future for yourself? JoV: 27:49 I could just speak for myself that I did not my-my concern was- what was going to happen after the four years when my deferment is up. I really was incapable of thinking much beyond that. Is there life after, after schools? Do not know. You know, am I going to live in the United States or not? Do not know. Am I going to be alive? I do not know it was, it was that overwhelming. I, if I may, I will tell you one story, when, when did the draft started to not to end, but they had a lottery. I do not know if you remember that. And every, every young man in the country was now, because there was so such a differential in various areas. I mean, some people were drafted, some people were not. So, they have a lottery, so everybody was going to get a number. And then every so we were listening to the Harpur radio station. Jackie and I were driving in the car, and they were reading the numbers JV: 28:43 Based on your birthday. JoV: 28:44 So, if they read this is number one, April 27 that means that you were going to be the first one called. And if you get a high number, you were probably not going to be called. So, we were trying to listen for my birthday. It was 365,366 you know; dates they have to go through. So, we finally get the campus and we, you know, what number did you get? What I mean, that was the, you know, that was it. And after that, I mean, I got a relatively high number, and I that was the first time. I do not know when that happened. It was early 1970 late 1969 I finally could think of, oh, yeah, now, you know- JV: 29:15 But you had already got, you had gone for a physical just before that. JoV: 29:18 Oh yeah. I mean, I mean- JV: 29:18 John, John extended, you know I mean the draft, a full-time student was four classes. But what I mean, most students were taking 16 credits, four classes, but you could still be considered full time if you were taking three for the and if you were full time, you were going to get this exemption. So, John, sort of like, spread things out. You took a long time. I graduated in December of (19)69 but you did not graduate. Well, you that Kent State erupted, you know., JoV: 29:51 But three courses, I mean, was no reason for me to take four courses. We might. Am I going to finish earlier? And so finally, you know, I had, I. And run out the string. And then the Selective Service in Goshen and said, you know, your time is up. You have used your four years since you matriculated at Harpur. And so, they sent me for a physical in Syracuse. And then this lottery, I said, “But the lottery, you are still going for a physical, okay?” JV: 30:18 But it was like, within days the lottery came about, and he did never get drafted. IG: 30:23 People do not appreciate what a sense of tension, of anxiety- JV: 30:30 Control. It was a controlled {crosstalk] IG: 30:32 Control over a huge, you know, swath of young people, psychologically. What that meant for them later on, you know, or during that time. JoV: 30:45 I took a bus from the Binghamton Federal Building to Syracuse and had a physical, and then got into some disagreement with some of the military people, not just, you know, and they wanted me to stay overnight, to do something else. And I said "No," and they said, "You are not getting back on the bus." I said, "That is all right." So, I called Jackie, and she had to drive up to Syracuse and pick me up. And I was, I was outraged. I mean, I was, I was fuming. I was just- JV: 31:13 I am afraid now that the police are going to come and guard him away because arrest him. Are we going to Canada now? JoV: 31:21 That was the, you know, I do, but luckily, you know, the everything was held in abeyance until this lottery. And then, I mean, that was the beginning of a new, new page. Okay, now, what am I going to do? IG: 31:35 So, what did you do? JoV: 31:35 Well, Jackie had started teaching in in Johnson City. So, I said, "Well, I might as well try that too." And, you know, I really had no plans. I had no idea, you know, we live here and, well, at least for the time being. You know, this is easy. I cannot I cannot fathom moving and starting, oh, you know, just, let us settle down and for at least a couple of years. And a couple of years turned into next 40 years. JV: 32:01 Your career. Yeah, yeah. I had sworn all along I was never going to teach, but I went to the New York State Employment Agency looking for a job after I graduated, and they sent me to a Catholic school who needed a fourth-grade teacher, and they hired me. And that is, you know, I am now teaching in the department of teaching, learning, educational leadership. So, you know, who knew I-I had no idea. IG: 32:27 Fell into that career both you. JV: 32:29 never in the, you know, in 1965 Did I imagine I myself being a teacher. IG: 32:35 So, so tell me a little bit about your career trajectories, you know. So, you-you kind of fell into the teaching profession, and what happened, you know? Give us an overview. JV: 32:48 I taught in the Catholic schools. I just thought I figured out I like teaching and I wanted to continue. So, I worked to get my teaching credentials from New York State and found a job. I was hired by the Union Endicott school district as a reading teacher because I had taken a number of reading courses as I was working toward my credential, and taught reading there for 12 years. And then I became I-I had, in New York State, you need a master's degree. So, I had managed to get a master's degree in reading at the University of Scranton, and talked to my principal at the time, and I said, "Okay, so now what?" And he said, he says "We should think about administration." So, I continued taking courses, became the principal of the of an elementary school, and then director of elementary education and then Assistant Superintendent when I retired, and I am a lecturer here. I am not on a tenure track that I was an adjunct and of the five faculty members one year, two of them left to take other positions, and they really were kind of desperate. They said, well, here, you know, become a full-time person, and that was 13 years ago. So, I have been doing that. I have been here ever since. So, what do you do here? I teach courses in the literacy program. We prepare young men and women to be teachers, to get their credential, and then when another faculty member left who was in charge of the Educational Administration program. They asked me to be that program coordinator. So now I am working in the program. I am coordinating the program that prepares men and women to be principals and supervisors and that sort of thing in schools. They picked me because I-I had one of those jobs, so they figured, I must know what I am doing. IG: 34:43 That is very interesting. Do you, do you have, do you offer a doctoral program in the Education Department? JV: 34:49 Yeah, we do, but in curriculum and instruction, it was not a leadership program, but it was just, it was, it was a, it was an EDD. IG: 34:58 So, you do not offer an EDD? In leadership? No, we do not know. JV: 35:02 Although our- the courses that we offer are 600 are 600 level courses in can be the ED leadership courses can be used as electives and the doctor courses, but it is not any, any DD in leadership. IG: 35:18 I see, I see. I am just curious. JV: 35:21 Okay. IG: 35:24 So, you know this is, what about your family life? Did you have- JV: 35:32 One son. IG: 35:32 Yeah, you have one son. JV: 35:34 Yep, Andy, yep. He is 38 now. [laughs] IG: 35:42 And is he- is he in the vicinity? JV: 35:45 He is, he is living in Athens Georgia currently, because he is married to a woman who is in a doctoral program there. So, she has, she will be, they will be leaving in May for her internship, and we do not know where they are going to be. JV: 36:04 [laughs] I am not even sure he is coming home for Thanksgiving. IG: 36:04 That is, that is the way of grown children, and you do not know where they are going inaudible] IG: 36:04 You might have to go there. JV: 36:10 No, we were not going there, but he might. He said, "Yeah-yeah, we are coming, but we have-" IG: 36:20 So, I am curious also, what you know the women's movement happened in the early (19)70s. It was you were off campus by then. But did you feel signs that you know, attitudes toward women and expectations of women were shifting or not? JV: 36:51 Of course, they were, yeah. They were definitely shifting. I mean, even my sights were, you know, were higher, you know, that, that I could do it, but, but were there still obstacles, you know? Yeah, not everything was apparent that we could do. I still remember one of the administrators in the school district calling us all girls, you know. And I finally had enough courage to request politely that please stop calling us girls. “You know, we are not girls.” He meant it; you know. I mean, he was very polite, caring man. He just needed to be informed that we were not finding it grating, right to be to refer to as girls. But, yeah, I mean, I we women- we very concerned about women getting to becoming, getting into elected office and supporting women who were in elected office. Look, looking up to those people. I mean, I still remember Geraldine Ferraro being nominated as about for a vice president, you know, all those things were eye opening and but yet, IG: 38:08 Did you, did you have a supportive husband? JV: 38:12 Absolutely. IG: 38:12 Yes, supportive of your wife's career. JoV: 38:16 I when Jackie got her master's in Scranton. Scranton is an hour's drive, I mean, and going through the winter, it was, it was difficult. And I, you know, she went with somebody. And finally, she says, “You know, there is got to be better way, quicker way” and she says, “You know, Scranton is a Catholic University. If I go there in the summer, I can live with the nuns and spend four days a week there. Get all my work done. Come on weekend.” I said, “God bless you. Go.” And it turned out to be a real boon for both of us. I mean, it saved her a lot of driving time, and she had very little work, because she says nuns are not that [crosstalk] JV: 38:53 There was nothing else to do. [crosstalk] late, later, late evening, because people were teaching, or working or something. So, I would have, like all day to do my coursework, and then I would come home after my last class on Thursday and not have to be back until my class on Monday. And I did not, except for the toward the end, when the papers were due, when you had to type them on your old electric type writer, remember. IG: 39:19 Yes. JoV: 39:20 You had an electric one? IG: 39:22 Yeah, I remember [crosstalk] JV: 39:24 With carbon paper and erasable paper. Remember when they finally invented erasable paper. I do not know if you remember that. IG: 39:32 I do not remember the erasable- JV: 39:34 White out. IG: 39:35 White out. Certainly, white out. erasable paper? JV: 39:38 They had it. They had a when they when they invented erasable bond, you know, then you could actually get rid of the type without making crosstalk] IG: 39:47 That is right. Now, I do remember I see it. It was, it was a very long time ago. JV: 39:51 Yeah, if you had an expensive IBM, then it had that white out, or actually- IG: 39:55 Right-right-right. So-so you were a supportive husband. Jackie was telling me a little bit about giving her giving me an outline of her career trajectory. Could you tell us what your career was like? JV: 40:17 John was a very supportive husband. He basically raised our son. He was, yeah, he was the- he was done lots and lots of different kinds of things, but I was the career person. I was the one who did that. And he was, he was the, he was the one I we have a colleague who was lamenting the fact that she had a class and could not go to her son's open house. And I said I never saw my son off to school on the first day, you know, that big event where you take pictures and stuff never happened. Because I was always meeting 400 other kids somewhere. Yeah. So, when you talk about changing roles of women, and we were, we were, we were one of the first families where, you know, I was the main career person, and John was the person who was raising, put, keeping the family together and raising the family, you know, taking all care of all the right stuff that needed to be care of. IG: 41:16 So, you know, now it is nor normative. JV: 41:19 Yeah. IG: 41:19 But then, did you experience any criticism? Or, you know, nothing from- JV: 41:26 Not really. IG: 41:27 No nothing. Did you what did you feel, John? JoV: 41:30 I mean, I would meet when-when my son was smaller, I, you know, would take him grocery shopping. And I would always meet other little children who were there with their mothers, and lot of them were teachers whom I knew, and they kind of look at my son was like, well, you know, Dad, it is okay, yeah. So it was, it was different. I mean, not like, you know, today, obviously, but there was some pressure. But as I said, I always worried about more about my son than about myself and he, you know, kids just seem to, you know, no problem. So. IG: 42:07 So how did you keep yourself, you know, you took care of your family, of your son, your wife, you know what-how did you did you pursue your intellectual interests that you developed in college. How did you do that? JV: 42:27 John is the most voracious reader you have ever met in your whole entire life. We subscribe to at least three newspapers. JoV: 42:36 That would be real, physical newspapers, the kind you throw into the fireplace and they-they ignite. JV: 42:39 Put in the bottom of the bird case. IG: 42:42 So, what do you read? What-what papers do you read? JoV: 42:46 We said, The Wall Street Journal comes every day, the times comes on Sunday, and the local paper comes on Sunday. So, you know, our newspaper carrier has she-she deserves a lot of rewards, because on Sundays, you know, the local paper, at the times, there is a, you know, sometimes the five or six pounds with papers come, so. IG: 43:07 It is nice. It is nice to read the-the physical paper. I mean, I read everything online these days. JoV: 43:15 I you know, I mean, I know Jackie reads a lot of it online. I still have some difficulty. I mean, I when you get a paper subscription, you can read it online. And a lot of times I will start, I just cannot. IG: 43:26 Yeah, it is more pleasurable. JoV: 43:28 Yeah. And so, I mean, the New York Times is a habit from college doing crossword together. And, I mean, it is 40 years of, you know, got to have that- JV: 43:42 50,50. JoV: 43:42 I am sorry, 50 years. Got to have that New York Times fix. IG: 43:45 Yeah. Do you feel that you know the-the answer is obvious to me, but do you feel that you know Harpur College played a key role in kind of opening you up intellectually- JoV: 44:01 For me yes, definitely. I mean, I, you know, you take the high school courses. You do well, but it is like the broadening, the things that you find out and, you know, there is another whole world out there. I remember Jackie and I took a theater course, which was really, you know, incredible, you know, it is like, wow, this is what it is all about. I took astronomy and geology. I mean, a lot of the Harpur students were biology students and chemistry students. And I said, “Well, I really want to take these other ones” and just, you know, it is like, wow, there is, there are a lot of different things. So today I hear my son, who went to RPI, I mean, almost all his courses were in computer science. And I am thinking a lot of people are linear. You know, be a liberal arts student. There is, there is really nothing wrong with it that makes a human being. IG: 44:52 I think I-I agree. I agree. And I also think that the theater department here is really top Notch. Did you stay in touch with the campus? Did you continue going, you know, did you go to concerts, to theater productions here together? JV: 45:11 We kick ourselves that we do not go to more, yeah, but we definitely stay, you know, involved. We have never left. It has, it has been part of our lives. We live, you know, five miles and way in Endicott, and it has just always been, you know, we have been here forever. JoV: 45:28 We have been part of the Alumni Association since we graduated down now, if Jackie spoke, she was, she spent maybe a year and a half as the director of- JV: 45:36 Yeah, actually worked. I was, I was president of the Alumni Association. IG: 45:40 Oh, wow. JV: 45:41 And then while I was president, the gentleman who was employed by us as the director, got into some kind of-he left. And so, I took over. I took a leave of absence from my teaching and took over as the-the interim director, while they were doing a search. IG: 46:05 When was that? JV: 46:06 Andy was just born, so it was (19)80- JoV: 46:09 (19)82 or (19)83. JV: 46:10 No, was not he still nursing, I think? Yep, 80- was it (19)81, (19)82? IG: 46:15 Yeah, but interesting. JoV: 46:17 For a year? JV: 46:19 Nine months. It was from January to September. I went back to teaching in September. So, um. JoV: 46:26 So, our connection to the university has been- IG: 46:29 It is very deep. Did you- do you think that your-your grounding in liberal arts informed sort of you know your son's well, your son chose computer science. I do not know what he does, but-but do you think that that it was part of his upbringing that you encouraged him to read- JV: 46:51 He had a dual degree in in social sciences, you know, he- JoV: 46:55 Psychology. JV: 46:56 -psychology, he, you know he. I think he likes to think of himself as a renaissance man. Yeah, you know he- JoV: 47:02 But unfortunately, he has never had a job outside [crosstalk] JV: 47:06 Yeah, he earns his money one way. But yeah, he is an avid reader. He, which pleases me no end as a reading teacher. I remember. I mean, one of the things that just, I just loved, was he has a very-very close friend. And even in as they left high school and during college, his they would give birthday gifts or Christmas gifts to one another. And they were books, you know, they were not CDs and games. They were books. They would share books. And I am thinking, oh my, we did something, right? You know, like- JoV: 47:40 The connection to Harpur. I just should add my son's middle name is Harpur. IG: 47:45 Oh, my goodness. JoV: 47:46 So, we-we had a tough time agreeing on a first name, and finally we decided, both of us, and it was no objection at all. You know, Andrew Harpur Visser. IG: 47:46 Oh, wow. IG: 47:53 That is, that is, that is a huge endorsement of your experience. You know, I do not know there is a better word for it. You know, your love- JoV: 47:53 So. JoV: 48:11 Exactly. IG: 48:13 -for this, for this experience. I am just wondering. You know, this is kind of off of tangent a little bit. But what is illiteracy- you know, what is the illiteracy rate here in Broome County? And do you teach children, young people or adults or everyone? JV: 48:38 I do not teach the children. I teach the teachers. IG: 48:41 You teach the teachers, right. JV: 48:43 What is the illiteracy rate? It is, it is, well, if you think, if you think about the big test that has to be taken in New York State, and you have to pass it, probably, probably about 30 percent of the students are not passing the test. IG: 48:59 Wow. JV: 49:00 Yeah, depending on which grade level or, you know, which test you are in, what you are looking for, but that is the test, you know, there is you could not do well on a test, but still, but still be able to function real well. So right now, what is your definition of illiteracy? You know, it is, it is kind of hard to tell I wish one of the things that we all worry about as teachers is not necessarily students’ inability to read. It is students’ reluctance to read. You know, the motivation social being on social media all the time and not finding joy and rewards of books. You know, as a librarian, you probably worry about as well. IG: 49:46 Yeah, and we have programs, we have literacy both for, I think it is, it is, it is not literacy for reading, but it is literacy in research. In understanding sources in, you know, separating fake news from real news. In technology literacy, so different kinds of literacy that librarians increasingly teach, you know, and that we have, but I will tell you about those programs later. So, you know, I am thinking, you know, we are kind of wrapping up, and I would like to ask you, what are some of the important lessons that you learned from this time in your life at Harpur College? JoV: 50:40 Really, very difficult to- JV: 50:44 We grew up. I do not know if it is a lesson, but we just, you know, I remember my 20th birthday thinking, “Oh, my God, I am an adult now. I am 20. It is, it is different. You know, what am I going to do? Where am I going? What is going on with my life?” But by the time we muddled through, you know, graduation and those first years, okay, I can do this. I can, I can. I am capable. I can. I think, I think one of the things I told you I was not a great student, but I was involved in lots of organizations that taught me an awful lot, you know, that- IG: 51:26 Gave you confidence. IG: 51:27 It is a special ability, getting people to do what needs to be done, and having them enjoy what they are doing. JV: 51:27 Right. JV: 51:27 Gave me confidence, you know, some leadership ability, organizational things, the things you know, my maybe, maybe not my teaching career, but my administrative career. And I was a school administrator for more years than I was a teacher actually. I traced back to-to being on the student center board and figuring out that, you know, we need a contract for the, you know, for the Mitchell Trio guys. And not only do you just sign the contract, but then somebody has to pick them up at the airport, and what are you going to do, you know, all that kind of marshaling people. I was not the leader of it, but understanding, getting to see people do those things, you know, then I could become president of the Alumni Association. JoV: 51:50 I mean, for me, I think it was in a chaotic time that the university held was stability. It kept things. Was something for me to lean on whenever things got really out of kilter, and this was, this is where I knew I could go back to and-and, you know, retain some sanity or in a crazy world. And, you know, it was, it was not necessarily teaching me something. I mean, we have talked about this previously, but, you know, the moment that, like, we could not think beyond I could not think beyond it. And so, you know, that forced me to concentrate on the university as a place where, you know, it was stable. It was a place where I could always rely on and, you know, whatever, whatever came, whatever was to happen in the future. IG: 53:12 It was, it was your escape. It was your sort of, you know, zone. No? JoV: 53:20 It was away from the world [crosstalk] IG: 53:25 The pressures of the David. JoV: 53:29 I mean, we were, when we were here, we were fully involved from dawn till dusk. We were there was classes, athletics, playing cards, meeting with friends. I mean, this university was our life really was and, and I remember the first after the first summer I when I decided to work in the Binghamton area during a break, my parents said, "Well, you are sure you are going to be able to handle it up there, you know, because you, you know you are not going to be home,” Yeah. This is, this is, you know, I felt feel bad. IG: 54:05 It became home. JoV: 54:06 Yeah, exactly. JV: 54:07 It became home for both of us, yeah, where we where I grew up, you know, is, you know, it-it was not home very, very quickly. You know, I did not want to go back to Long Island, you know, not that, not that anything bad happened there, but this was where, this is, this was where I grew up. Yeah, I know I became independent and-and we ended up staying in this area. You know, more from inertia than you know certain circumstance than any you know your major decision that said, “You know, we are going to live in in the Binghamton area.” IG: 54:47 You are drawn to it. JV: 54:49 Yeah. And now, I mean, we, I could not think of any place else I would want to leave. We, as we get older, and our son is moving someplace away, you know, we are always thinking, oh, well, you know, might we really relocate. But nothing is calling us nobody is- we are not sitting here saying, oh, gee, you know we need to go to North Carolina, or we need to go to Florida, or we need to move to Arizona or something like that. We just do not think that. And so, the university is just part of that circle. It is a big, important part of the circle in which we live. IG: 55:18 That is very nice. And, you know, one last question I like to ask. What you know, what advice do you have for a student listening to this interview about, you know, planning their lives and-and about the college experience, and sort of, you know, looking to the future and what, what kind of, you know, what are some important qualities for them to own or develop in their future lives, or answer it any way that you like, that you feel, that you have found. JV: 56:13 I do not know if I this Well, I am now in a position where I am working with students who want to become teachers and administer and school administrators, and it has a real career path to for them, I really feel bad for them that they do not have the opportunity to have the same kind of liberal arts opportunities that we had, but I worry about the issue of student debt. You know, I really, really am concerned. I mean, when people I we had this tiny little they have to take multiple tests and become teachers certified as teacher, and we had these vouchers so that they would not have to pay for these for these tests. And so, we asked students to say, “Why do you deserve this test?” And I just remember one young woman talked about her, you know, $50,000 worth of student debt, and when she when she graduates, she is going to get a job as a teacher, earning $40,000 and, you know, like, what does that mean? We had the luxury. I had a little bit of student debt when I when I graduated, but, but we had the luxury of having our, you know, free tuition, and all you had to do is pay for room and board. And we found an old bill one day, and it was like $400 you know, a semester like- so-so while I want them all to be able to have that, I do not know what I want to be. I am just going to take all the courses I possibly can and learn about the world and life and whatever can you really do you really want to take on all that debt as an art history major and start working in Applebee's, you know, like that is what I worry about right now. So, do I have advice? I do not know what I do. JoV: 58:10 But then, you know, people go on the other track, and they say they are so directed, they are so mercenary. I am going to take these courses. It is going to become this pays the most, and this will pay for my entire education. And I sometimes feel they have lost the thrust of why they come here in the first place, if your if your curriculum only includes, you know, those three or four categories that you need, or you think you need for your job, because it is going to look great. Well, that is wonderful for your job, but you know, as a human being, you may fall short, but you know, if you want that human experience education, that is a big bill to pay, and obviously you have to balance the two, and I would not want to be in a position to make those decisions. It is just too catastrophic, like Jackie said, you come out of here with, you know, way too much debt that will burn you and taint your whole life thereafter. So, I am not sure what I would advise I would give them, but to think, you know deep and long about where do you want to go, and it is a hard decision to make, but people today have the luxury of time. They do not. They have a gap year. They have two gap years, you know, start at the local community college. The transfer in is, you know, be a little more mature. I mean, we, we did not have that opportunity. I did not have that opportunity, you know, I was 18. You are going to college, end of story, you know. Well, maybe I was not quite ready, I think, well, maybe I was not and I should have taken some time. JV: 59:47 Yeah, fine, I guess and part of my profession says that we are all lifelong learners, so just realize that college is not the end that you should be. You know, you should continue to whatever your career choice is, understand that you are not done. IG: 1:00:06 That is that is very good advice. I agree wholeheartedly. Any concluding remarks, JV: 1:00:13 No, I would be interesting to read some of the other comments. JoV: 1:00:16 I think you have gotten all you can out of these two old bodies. [laughter] IG: 1:00:21 Thank you. It is very interesting and very enjoyable. Thank you. JV: 1:00:26 You are welcome. (End of Interview) Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Jackie and John Visser Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Visser, Jackie ; Visser, John ; Gashurov, Irene Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Description An account of the resource Jackie is a lecturer in Education at Binghamton University; John was more of a stay-at-home father. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2018-11-09 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Jackie and John Visser.mp3 Date Modified Date on which the resource was changed. 2018-11-28 Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. Oral Histories from 60's Binghamton Alumni Extent The size or duration of the resource. 60:28 minutes https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/bcde815821c1a12b591b3bd9271812ca.jpg 1226b261b19d5230bdd0a032b5051c3e https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/0fcc27afb48ff690ed7e06cfe9d6e09e.mp3 a19ffbe202c71cb08412328ade9f982f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Audio interviews Title A name given to the resource McKiernan Interviews Description An account of the resource Stephen McKiernan's collection of interviews includes more than two hundred interviews with prominent figures of the 1960s, which were collected between the mid-1990s to 2023 The collection provides narratives of people who were actively involved in or witnessed events in the 1960s, an era which spurred profound cultural and political transformation in the twentieth century. Interviewees include politicians, artists, scholars, musicians, authors, and veterans who delve into the decade’s most prominent issues and events, including the civil rights movement, the free speech movement, the anti-war movement, women’s rights, gay rights, segregation, the Vietnam War, Woodstock, Hippies, Yippies, and individualism. <h3>The McKiernan 22</h3> <div>Stephen McKiernan interviewed legends of the 1960s. When asked in 2021 where one should start when sifting through his vast collection, he provided the following list:</div> <ul> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/854">Julian Bond</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1866">Bobby Muller</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1175">Craig McNamara</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/910">Dr. Arthur Levine</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/837">Diane Carlson Evans</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/942">Dr. Ellen Schrecker</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/876">Dr. Lee Edwards</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/841">Peter Coyote</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1233">Dr. Roosevelt Johnson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/899">Rennie Davis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1222">Kim Phuc</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/917">George McGovern</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/833">Frank Schaeffer</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/840">Rev. Dr. Frank Forrester Church </a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1240">Dr. Marilyn Young</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/842">James Fallows</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/835">Joseph Lee Galloway</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/911">John Lewis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/839">Paul Critchlow</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/888">Steve Gunderson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1159">Charles Kaiser</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/2407">Joseph Lewis</a></li> </ul> Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Stephen McKiernan Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Language A language of the resource English Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright. Template: Simple Audio Player (Amplitude.js) This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Date of Interview 2011-04 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Stephen McKiernan Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Jackie Goldberg Language English Digital Publisher Binghamton University Libraries Digital Format audio/mp4 Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data 3 microcassettes Material Type Sound Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Biographical Text <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Jackie Goldberg is a politician, teacher, member of the Democratic Party, a former member of the California State Assembly, and was president of the Los Angeles School Board. Goldberg was a founder member of the California Legislative LGBT Caucus and of the Progressive Caucus in Sacramento. She has a Bachelor's degree from University of California, Berkeley and a Master's degree in education from the University of Chicago."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":13311,"3":{"1":1},"4":[null,2,4884200],"5":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"6":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"7":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"8":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"9":0,"10":2,"11":4,"12":0,"15":"Arial","16":10}">Jackie Goldberg is a politician, teacher, member of the Democratic Party, a former member of the California State Assembly, and was president of the Los Angeles School Board. Goldberg was a founder member of the California Legislative LGBT Caucus and of the Progressive Caucus in Sacramento. She has a Bachelor's degree from the University of California, Berkeley and a Master's degree in education from the University of Chicago. Keywords <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Tea Party Movement; Baby boom generation; Free Speech Movement; Nineteen sixties; Ronald Reagan; Religion; Black Panthers; Vietnam War."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":513,"3":{"1":0},"12":0}">Tea Party Movement; Baby boom generation; Free Speech Movement; Nineteen sixties; Ronald Reagan; Religion; Black Panthers; Vietnam War. Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 213:16 Subject LCSH Politicians--United States; Teachers—California; Progressivism (United States politics); Goldberg, Jackie--Interviews Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Rights Statement Many items in our digital collections are copyrighted. If you want to reuse any material in our collection you must seek permission, or decide if your purpose can qualify as fair use under the U.S. Copyright Law Section 107. If you think copyright or privacy has been violated, the University Libraries will investigate the issue. Please see our take down policy. If using any materials in this online digital collection for educational or research purposes, please cite accordingly. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Jackie Goldberg Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Goldberg, Jackie ; McKiernan, Stephen Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/wav Subject The topic of the resource Politicians--United States; Teachers—California; Progressivism (United States politics); Goldberg, Jackie--Interviews Description An account of the resource Jackie Goldberg is a politician, teacher, member of the Democratic Party, a former member of the California State Assembly, and was president of the Los Angeles School Board. Goldberg was a founder member of the California Legislative LGBT Caucus and of the Progressive Caucus in Sacramento. She has a Bachelor's degree from the University of California, Berkeley and a Master's degree in education from the University of Chicago. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2011-04 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context McKiernan.Oral.10.2016.193a ; McKiernan.Oral.10.2016.193b; McKiernan.Oral.10.2016.193c Date Modified Date on which the resource was changed. 2018-03-29 Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. McKiernan Interviews Extent The size or duration of the resource. 213:16 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/f673c7186c06611eefefd28b1dc948d8.jpeg bd4f4e8885423ef7694fac642b1e1cc0 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/59a4ef72403e6e9ed90e521a76aa4e24.mp3 5972b5ce8bc779c1c4e33a48e4c0d61b Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Armenian Oral History Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Aynur de Rouen, Ph.D. Description An account of the resource This collection includes interviews in English with informants of all ages and a variety of backgrounds from various parts of Armenia.  The interviews provide deeper insight into the history of the Armenian culture through personal accounts, narratives, testimonies, and memories of their early lives in their adoptive country and back in Armenia.   Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright.  Relation A related resource <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/oral-histories/index.html#sustainablecommunities">Sustainable Communities Oral History Collection</a> Language A language of the resource English Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as Armenian Oral History Project, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries for more information. Date of Interview 11/4/2016 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Aynur de Rouen Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Jacqueline Kachadourian Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 59:11 Language English Digital Publisher Binghamton University Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Biographical Text <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Jackie is a student at Binghamton University, double majoring in studio art and theatre with concentrations in painting and costume design. She is active in her local community and is very passionate about her family's history with Armenia. "}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":15105,"3":{"1":0},"11":4,"12":0,"14":[null,2,0],"15":"Calibri","16":11}">Jackie is a student at Binghamton University, double majoring in Studio Art and Theatre with concentrations in Painting and Costume Design. She is active in her local community and is very passionate about her family's history with Armenia. Keywords <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Armenia; Lebanon; Montreal; church; genocide; identity; traditions; Sunday school; death march; Armenian dance; Christmas; religion; food; Mount Ararat; literature; politics; diaspora"}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":15105,"3":{"1":0},"11":4,"12":0,"14":[null,2,0],"15":"Calibri","16":11}">Armenia; Lebanon; Montreal; Church; Genocide; Identity; Traditions; Sunday school; Armenian dance; Christmas; Religion; Food; Mount Ararat; Literature; Politics; Diaspora. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Armenian Oral History Project Interview with: Jackie Kachadourian Interviewed by: Aynur de Rouen; Marwan Tawfiq Transcriber: Marwan Tawfiq Date of interview: 4 November 2016 Interview Setting: Binghamton University -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (Start of Interview) 0:01 AD: Okay, so today is November 4, 2016, and I am here with Marwan Tawfiq, and we are interviewing with Jackie Kachadourian. Okay, so Jackie could you please give us your full name? 0:24 JK: My full name is Jacqueline Nora Kachadourian. 0:27 AD: Okay, and can you tell us when and where you were born? 0:33 JK: I was born on July 16, 1997. I am from¬¬– I was born in Johnson City, New York. 0:42 AD: At Wilson Hospital? 0:43 JK: Yes. 0:44 AD: Okay, so why do not you give us some information about your family? 0:53 JK: Okay, so on my mom’s side– both my parents are 100 percent Armenian which makes me 100 percent Armenian. On my mom’s side, she was born in Lebanon and her father was born in Antep, Turkey. And her mother was born in Lebanon to my grandfather and my grandmother. And on my dad’s side they were all from Armenia, they had to leave during the genocide and they had to go through Cuba, I believe, to come to the US. But I am more familiar with my mother’s side of the family rather than my dad’s side. And my mom ended up in Lebanon and then she moved to Montreal during the civil war because it was too much. And my dad has always lived in Binghamton, New York. So– 1:47 AD: So your dad was born and raised in Binghamton? 1:51 JK: Yes. 1:52 AD: Okay, so your mom was born in, what ̶ Beirut? 1:55 JK: Yes, Beirut. 1:56 AD: Beirut. So, when did she move to Montreal? 2:00 JK: She moved when she was a teenager around like twelve or thirteen I believe. Her and mother and her father, so my grandmother and grandfather, they all lived in Beirut, my grandfather had a textile factory. So they all stayed there. And on my mom’s side– she has four other siblings. So, all they left first and they got sponsored by one of our family members to go to Montreal and so they went first and then they left my mom and my grandmother and my grandfather and they came afterwards. So– 2:45 AD: I see. So, you still have family living in Lebanon? 2:49 JK: Yes, actually my– one of my mom’s aunts she just left to go back to Lebanon. So now I have two great aunts still in Lebanon. 3:00 AD: They live in Beirut still? 3:02 JK: I believe so. I have to check. 3:04 AD: They are in Lebanon and you are not sure if it is Beirut or not. So, what is the language, I know you will interview with your mother, you can ask her that, but what is the languages in your household–which language do you guys speak? 3:21 JK: We speak English but when my mom is talking on the phone with her family she speaks Armenian so I pick up a few words here and there and then when my grandmother was still alive she, when we were little, she spoke Armenian to us, she only spoke Armenian to us, and we were out and about like in a store or something if my mom wants to say something she would say it in Armenian so other people do not understand which is funny. So I still understand it I just have a harder time speaking it rather than hearing it. 4:00 AD: Okay, so how about your dad? 4:02 JK: He speaks Armenian but he does not write it, but my mom can write it. 4:05 AD: Okay, so did your mom go to Armenian school in Beirut? 4:10 JK: I do not think she went to Armenian school, I do not know but she learned Armenian first and then in school she learnt– She learnt Turkish through her family at home because if they did not want to say something– the parents– they spoke in Turkish so they do not understand but they ended up learning it. And then in school she learnt French, English and Arabic because it was Arabic was, in Lebanon you have to learn Arabic– 4:43 AD: And French also a mandatory language especially for certain class of people at that time. So, but you speak English at home? 4:55 JK: Yeah. 4:56 AD: How about your parents? How do they communicate? 5:00 JK: I would say seventy percent English, thirty percent Armenian, so like, if my parents want to say something in Armenian then they do not want us to understand, they say it in Armenian but like I can pick up few words, and it might not be the direct translation but I like can kinda get a just of it but my younger brother he does not understand any of it, he understand like one or two words maybe, and my sister, she understands more of it. 5:30 AD: So, how many siblings your mother has? 5:33 JK: She has four other siblings. So she has an older sister an older– three older brothers and she is the last one. 5:43 AD: Okay. And they all live in Montreal? 5:47 JK: No, one lives in France and he is like, he helps with the University of– like looking at different energy resources. He used to own a vineyard and now he does research. Yeah. 6:01 AD: Oh, where does he live in France? 6:04 JK: He lives in the South part of France; I do not know the exact city. But he– when he was in Lebanon he got a scholarship to go to study in France at a University and he did that and then he stayed there. 6:18 AD: You never visited him in France? 6:19 JK: No, my sister did, I was not born yet and I never had a chance. 6:23 AD: So, he does not come here? 6:25 JK: He goes to Montreal. I think he has only been to the United States like our area few times. 6:30 AD: So, you are not very close to him? 6:34 JK: Not as close as my other aunts and uncles. 6:37 AD: So, where are the other aunts and uncles? 6:41 JK: Well, my aunt lives in Montreal, so does my uncle and one uncle actually passed away a few years ago. He lived in Montreal as well. So they all lived like around fifteen minutes away from each other. 6:54 AD: So how did your mother make it to Binghamton, then? 6:57 JK: Well, my grandfather on my mom’s side, his sister came to North New Jersey, instead of going to Montreal and so she visited some of her cousins and stuff and they were both, my dad was in north Jersey too at an Armenian Church and it was like after the Church they have like dinner service and so both of them were there and they actually sat at the same table and they met, and– 7:28 AD: And they fell in love– 7:30 JK: Yeah, I guess so. [laughs] 7:34 AD: So, does your mom work? 7:38 JK: She used to work with my dad– help out with– because he used to have a law firm and now he works with the Broome County like law department, I do not know with family court. So now he does not have his own law office anymore but she used to work with that and they also, they had like stocks and stuff, so but now she just not really– 8:02 AD: She is not working. How old is she? 8:04 JK: She is fifty-three. She was born in 1964. 8:13 AD: My age, she is one year younger than me. 8:15 JK: Okay. 8:15 AD: Okay. All right. What is her education? What did she study? 8:21 JK: She studied Economics or Accounting in the University of Montreal, I believe, and she like worked at car dealerships and did the accounting for that like paperwork and finance and then when she came here it was different for her so, it is hard– 8:39 AD: Oh, isn’t that different for all of us. So, and your father went to school? 8:46 JK: Yeah, he went to Binghamton University and then for his law degree he went to Syracuse. 8:52 AD: Okay, so he is a lawyer? 8:55 JK: Yes. 8:56 AD: And, now tell me about your siblings. 9:00 JK: I have an older sister, she goes to Binghamton University as well, and she is a Psychology major with a Chemistry minor and she is a senior, she is like– she is twenty-two years old and my other younger brother, and he is at Vestal Middle School, and I believe he is in eighth grade, so. 9:24 AD: You believe. 9:27 JK: I believe so [laughs], he is twelve years old, or no he is thirteen. 9:34 AD: [laughs] Okay, so and you go to Binghamton University as well? 9:39 JK: Yes. 9:39 AD: And studying? 9:40 JK: I am double major studying in Studio Art, the concentration and Painting and the Theatre with the concentration and Costume Design. 9:48 AD: But you also mentioned something about Physics? 9:50 JK: Yes, I am very interested in minoring in Physics. I want to take a lot of classes but hopefully it will add up to a minor but I am not sure with all the other classes I have but hopefully it works out. 10:04 AD: Okay, so, now tell me about growing up, like when your great aunt especially when you see them or your family, do you hear stories about the past? 10:23 JK: Yes, of course, especially when I was little they used to tell stories and even now like as you are getting more– understanding more idea of what was going on but like in Montreal whenever we go and visit them, they usually try to inform us of what happened and like what the family went through. For example on my dad’s side one of my aunts she was telling me that like this is one of my great aunts, she was telling me how she had to leave everything of her; birth certificate and everything like no clothes no nothing and she could not– she does not– she did not remember how old she was because they do not have a birth certificate, so it is really interesting. 11:12 AD: I see. So do you remember any stories? 11:16 JK: Yeah, actually on my mom’s side, my grandfather he was born I believe in 1909 or sometime before the genocide occurred and he remembered walking, he had to do the march– walk and he was in Turkey which was like near Armenia so they had to leave and they walked and she remembered– he remembered that her mother died–his mother died during the walk and it was just him and his father, but– and his other siblings. Also there was a lot of Turkish people obviously, some, like, our neighbors, their neighbors were Turkish, some would helped them which was really interesting some would not help which is obvious, for obvious reasons but it is nice to see that some obviously did help them try and escape and things like that, then on my mom’s side, her– I believe– yeah her father or someone worked for the Army so they got to deceive them so they did not– they were not killed because they were Armenians, so they worked for them to– so would not die. 12:43 AD: I see. I see. So, when did you– so you were always aware of being Armenian growing up and what did it represent to you? 12:59 JK: It represented strong identity. I always thought– from a young age my mom informed me about being Armenian and things like that so when I was like in elementary school remember doing projects like about our heritage. People would be like what is Armenian. They really did not know what it was except for like European countries and things like that. That was all they really came in contact with but like I did projects like Armenian Genocide and so from a young age I was very informed about who I was and what, where I came from. 13:35 AD: Okay. So, what are the things like your mom did in your house that represents Armenian heritage? 13:48 JK: She would show me books and stuff like that obviously not war books but we used to go to church, Sunday school when we were little. My grandmother she was a big influence too, told us about like stories of Armenian and like reading the bible in Armenian– there is Armenian bible– ood is a big part of it, we would help her make food and stuff so, over all– 14:23 AD: Like any, like– what is it– crafts or I do not know decorations pieces or anything? 14:33 JK: Well my grandmother she knew how to sew, so she would show us how to knit and sew, and she would knit us things, and I learned how to knit and sew from her like various not in great detail but I learnt some techniques and then I remember during Sunday school I would do like drawings of Armenia like Armenian flags. And also like American flags too, some American as well. But I– when I was little I always knew I was Armenian and I always a hundred percent Armenian, I do not know from a very young age. 15:10 AD: Okay, so is there an Armenian community that your family are part of it here? 15:13 JK: There is but is very, the community here is very old, it is getting older and there is not as much people my age, but I feel like now there is going to be a younger generation like so my brother– younger brother’s age like around there. But we used to all go to Armenian Church and everything, Sunday school but I feel like as time went on, people started to leave and like move away to other places because there is not much of an Armenian culture here in Binghamton. So it is very hard to find but in Montreal there is so much more vibrancy of Armenian culture which is really interesting, so. 16:08 AD: Yeah, so the people who live here are mostly older people. 16:12 JK: Yeah, like my family they are very old and they are a older generation so, I think that it had influence on me though because they are very strict and very strong about their Armenian heritage, so kind of flowed on me but there was a few kids here and there but not too many. 16:38 AD: Not too many. So, your dad and your mother met at the church and they married, so do your parents tell you that they would like to see you marrying an Armenian boy or stuff like that? 16:57 JK: Yeah, recently my dad, because my sister she is like I am not going find any Armenian boys here [laughs] my age and he said– she asked him do I have to marry an Armenian, she was like joking around–he was like well I married an Armenian because my family died for– the Armenians died to survive their culture and their heritage so it is the right thing to do because of his– the relatives– and they want me to marry an Armenian, I want to marry an Armenian, I think that would be interesting but like I am not going to force myself to marry an Armenian if I do not like them. I do not know– It is a factor but it is not a factor so. I would like to marry an Armenian. 17:44 AD: You would like to marry an Armenian in order to continue? 17:53 JK: Yeah. 17:53 AD: Okay. What else? Do you have anything? 17:58 MT: So, do you particularly remember anything or did they tell you anything about the genocide like your grandparents? 18:08 JK: My grandfather he died before I was born and then my grandmother on my mom’s side she died in two thousand four so I was quite young but I remember just they would tell me like stories that were really, I do not know very– like the death march they used to talk about that and how they would not get– I remember one of my great aunts they would tell me how they would throw bread at us or at them, their family and they would not–they would have been starving themselves, they did not have anything, they had to leave all their stuff and, yeah I have to–I do not really talk about it with my– on my dad’s side, I have to ask more about it and I believe they came through Cuba and then came up here but– 19:04 MT: So has your family visited Armenia? 19:07 JK: No. Most of my family on my mom’s side has been to Armenia and then on my dad’s side too, as well they went to Armenia few years ago I believe, like with the church. We never went, I do not think my– I think my dad was too nervous because of the times and like what was going on– it is the Middle East. They do not want to go, but I really want to go. I want to go and help out and do what I can and learn about the culture, I want to go a lot of times hopefully. 19:39 AD: Yes, but did anyone, anybody go back to Antep? 19:44 JK: Antep, no. 19:46 AD: Because that is the home town, right? 19:48 JK: Yeah. I do not think they would, because now it is part of Turkey. 19:51 AD: It is. 19:52 JK: So, I believe before that was maybe part of Armenia, I am not sure. 19:57 AD: No, it was Ottoman Empire. 19:58 JK: Oh, yeah. 20:00 AD: There was no Turkish Republic. 20:02 JK: Yeah. 20:02 AD: So, the massacre happened actually during Ottoman Empire, so that was like toward the end, and it was part of the Ottoman Empire, all these areas, that massacre took place. So, nobody went back to Antep? 20:28 JK: No, I do not think so. I would have to ask, but I do not believe so. 20:33 AD: So, and then like the family does not know if anybody left behind? 20:40 JK: I am not sure, I would have to ask. I know just my grandfather’s mother she died during the walk and the march. 20:52 AD: I mean alive, not dead. 20:55 JK: Okay. I have no idea I would have to ask but not sure, maybe like from the orphanages or something. 21:00 AD: Yeah. Or maybe they were able to hide or runaway and you know left the East, maybe went to the Western part of the country. I do not know, I mean so many things I am sure happened, different survival tactics. 21:24 JK: Yeah, survival instinct, you have to kick in. 21:28 AD: Yeah, yeah absolutely. So, were you like told like tales or stories, like little kids, like little Armenian, you know, fairy tale-type of thing or heroic stories and stuff like that, or like maybe little games? 21:32 JK: Yeah, I was taught some games in Armenian but– 21:34 AD: Like your grandmother, I mean did she–like for example my mother teaches things to my daughter and it is like, you know her generation and or like little songs like do you know any little kids’ song? 22:19 JK: I do not know it by heart, but I remember there is a song about like a bird flying– 22:26 AD: Can you sing it? [laughter] 23:31 MT: How often does the Armenian community meet and get together? 22:40 JK: In Binghamton? 22:41 MT: Yeah, because I know in the past there were regular meetings in church or for holidays– is that still happening? 22:48 JK: Well right now, there is not full-time priest, so I believe they do services every few weeks or so–something because the priest we had a few years ago, he went to North of Jersey and now he works–does it there. But a few– this is like maybe five or ten years ago, not that long, probably five years ago–every year we used to have an Armenian dance in like November, now they stopped doing that but that was really fun to get the community all together we served Armenian food, Armenian dances– 23:24 AD: Oh, I wish that was still continuing. 23:27 JK: One thing I learned is the Armenian dancing. I learnt a few steps– because there is different songs that go with different dances and that was really fun to learn and we do it now during weddings and things like that which is really nice, which is, but my cousin she actually takes classes in Armenian dancing in Montreal. 23:47 AD: Oh, in Montreal– here I am like– Go ahead. 23:55 JK: But in the past when I was younger we used to go to our Armenian church every Sunday and like, there was Sunday School, I am not sure if they still have Sunday School. I remember learning some of Armenian Alphabet through that but like I do not remember it anymore, but I learnt a lot of words– like we spoke like tried to learn the language as young kids and there would always be someone teaching it. I believe my dad’s aunt would help teach it and then another lady, as well, too, she would help. 24:33 MT: So why did not your mother or father try to teach you Armenian? 24:42 JK: After I was older there was not much of a Sunday School because people left and there was not as many kids probably like less than ten of us or something maybe five or something, but I am not sure why. I think because my dad did not write Armenian, he did not– it was kind of hard and once my grandmother she died it was hard for my mom because my grandmother really helped me and my sister– that is why my sister knows the most because she was with my grandmother the most and she would learn from her, and that is how we would learn but after that we kind of stopped but I am trying to– I really want to get back in to it. I really want to learn Armenian. And I think that would really be helpful, like learn it–like how to write and stuff like that. 25:48 AD: What are the days the Armenian community here observes like, you mentioned the dance that triggered my mind. So, what else? 25:50 JK: Actually we have our own Armenian Christmas. I believe it is January 4th or January 6th, one of those days. And we like to celebrate and go to the Church and have service and then we are very big on Easter. We have different Armenian dishes, yeah. 26:10 AD: I know from Turkey, yeah? 26:13 JK: Yeah. So we have– like we paint eggs, we play the game, I do not know if you know, we crack the eggs– 26:16 MT: Do you paint like red or different colors? 26:18 JK: Different colors, I know there is a thing where you paint red but we do not– I do not remember doing that as a kid. 26:24 MT: So, you do the American way? 26:26 JK: Yeah, I guess so. 26:28 AD: Yeah, in Turkey all of– I mean that to me, red eggs, symbolizes Easter to me. 26:35 JK: Yeah. 26:36 AD: I saw the different colors when I came here because I thought Easter eggs should be red that is the image in my head. So, Easter and is there any other? 26:50 JK: I do not think so. We have a– it is not really a holiday but we have a picnic in September for the Binghamton Community, that they have like at the end of the summer I guess. And there is food, Armenian food, and everything that served. So, that is– we used to go that when we were little as well, which was fun. 27:16 AD: You do not go anymore? 27:18 JK: No, like now I am working after work during the Sunday, so it is hard to go to it, especially as you get older. I wish I could. I want to go. So, I know there is another Armenian holiday during the first half the year. My cousin, she goes to Armenian school and she tells me about it how she gets off on those days, but I have to ask her. Oh, and then obviously the Armenian Genocide, April 24th, that is of course we remember that. 27:55 AD: Is there anything going on during that day here? Do they commemorate? 28:02 JK: Yeah, we actually have a statue, it is a little kind of like a– looks like a tomb stone, but it is a square and it says we remember the Armenian Genocide. It is right as you cross the Binghamton Bridge like near the Arena in Binghamton, and I remember for the hundredth anniversary, they do this every year, but for the hundredth one like the Mayor came and they just– we have a speaker and they pray and then they talk about what happened. I remember going to it a lot when I was younger but there is usually chairs or tents, usually somebody speaks, I remember always rains during that day, like every year I remember it always rains, I do not know. 28:50 AD: Yeah, to me when I hear is like religion is a big factor in identity of Armenian community, am I right. Am I reading this correctly? 28:58 JK: Yes, and my parents are very like strict on the– especially my mom, she prays and things like that. She loves going to church when she can. So it is a huge factor in the culture and I believe it is. 29:20 AD: Yeah, so the– we can say religion, the food, and maybe dance these are like the main ingredients for the existing Armenian identity? 29:35 JK: Also, I would say there is a lot of craftsmanship like carpets in my house there is all like Armenian carpets everywhere, crosses obviously, we have our own Armenian cross, it is not the same as like Catholics or Protestant. 29:55 AD: Yeah, Gregorian. So like when your friends came to your house, well obviously since there are not so many Armenians, I assume you did not have many Armenian friends that you hang out with, right? 29:58 JK: Yeah of course. 29:59 AD: So when they came to your house, did they say oh, this is different or I mean did you hear any comments? 30:21 JK: Not, really because being– ike from my dad’s from Binghamton is very Americanized where my mom is very Armenian so it is kind of a good mixture. So, I would say the one differences the food is really interesting. Now, my friends in college they love coming over to my house and eating like the humus, tabbouleh, cheese börek, just a lot of Armenian food they love it. As a younger– as– like I remember having birthday parties when I was young. There would always– it would always like be Americanized, not too much Armenian stuff going on, but I would always tell my friends that I was 100 percent Armenian, they would be like; you have to be a different kind, like you cannot be 100 percent of one kind, so like they really do not understand it, and it was hard for me to explain too, being so young like in elementary school or something like that, so 31:22 AD: Yeah. 31:23 JK: There is always like, what is that, they do not really know too much about it. 31:30 AD: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. 31:33 JK: But nowadays I think it is easier for people to understand and like especially being older people know what Armenia is, or at least what Turkey is least and I just say it is next to Armenia, so it gives them a good idea, the culture like what is going on, which is nice. 31:54 AD: Of course. 31:55 JK: Yeah. 31:59 AD: Go ahead. 32:00 MT: What does Mount Ararat represent to you? 32:02 JK: It represents– it is our Armenian unity I think, it is our culture, it represents our strength I believe, so like that is what I think. 32:19 MT: Did you hear about the mount from you parents? 32:24 JK: Yeah, I heard it from my mom especially there is a lot of– 32:31 MT: Paintings. 32:31 JK: Yeah, paintings, I was just saying paintings and we get like Armenian magazine like, calendars that have like pictures of Mount Ararat and like churches and you can see the church in relation to the mountains. So, it is very interesting and you can read like what it represents and it is kinda nice to know, so and the story is it used to be, this is what I– this is from like from stories it used to be on the Armenian side and when the Turks came they came and took that land, so now it is on the Turkish side, so like region-wise, so it is interesting. 33:17 AD: Kurds also– 33:18 MT: I always thought that it is in Kurdistan, because it is Eastern Turkey. 33:28 AD: Now, we are– look, Turk, Armenian and Kurds we are going to cut it in pieces and claim it. 33:34 MT: The reason because we have so many things like named after Mount Ararat, like one of the strongest sport clubs, so but lately, no, I thought it is not. 33:48 JK: No, it is interesting. 33:50 AD: Well it is still land– 33:51 MT: Because there are like Kurds in Armenian, there are a lot of Kurds, so, and the first magazines in Kurdish I think issued in Yerevan long ago like in the eighteenth century so– 34:08 AD: Well different ethnic groups lived in that region. So when one group came they did not just say, ‘oh you know what I am here, get out of here’ it was not like that so what people did, they just mingled and continued to live. So that was what happened but then, you know, it goes in different directions and then the politics get in to picture– 34:39 JK: And religion– I was going to say. 34:42 AD: Yeah, religion, but religion is still a very big factor in twenty first century. 34:47 MT: Of course. 34:48 AD: I mean would you think that would still continue? It is continuing ̶ 34:52 JK: I was going to say that Armenians were the first Christian culture they learnt from that so that was how it developed– which is really interesting. Armenian first country to develop Christianity– 35:09 MT: Like the first nation? 35:10 JK: Yeah first nation ̶ 35:11 AD: First nation, yeah. 35:12 JK: It is really interesting. 35:15 AD: yeah, and then it– I am not very knowledgeable about, you know, religious history, but it just took different and then– as I said politically whoever was dominant took over so in that case you know, Catholics they were politically dominant and then they took over and then the second strong one was the Orthodox, you know, Greece and you know, Russia that area, so then in that case the Gregorian group which is Armenians they became minority in Christianity as well. So it is yeah– 36:01 JK: Interesting. 36:02 AD: Yeah, it is, it is very interesting. 36:05 JK: That is why I think Armenians play– I think religion plays a big role in Armenian culture that is how I would think. 36:12 AD: Because of that, and also coming from Istanbul, and I did a research when I was a student, about Armenian Churches along the Bosphorus, and I went so many different– I do not remember how many. And people do not even know like this like really unique architecture and there are in Ottoman architecture very important Armenian architects. Actually the most famous architect in Ottoman architectural history is Sinan, architect Sinan, and he was Armenian. Nobody says that is, but he was. And then Kirkov, Garabet Kirkov, it is like so many Armenian architects that, it is like architecturally it is just very, very important names. 37:30 JK: Yeah, also when I was asking my mother about the last names you know how it means what you do. Kachadourian, I know you are interested about what it meant, it meant like the cross, the kept the cross or something, so like based on religion; Kachadour– so that is what it really means like the cross like grabbing it and keeping it, like catch it. And then on my mom’s side, Kabakyan that is, they were like squash and pumpkin– 38:02 AD: That is right, I told you that. 38:04 JK: Yeah you did tell me that. So I found that is really interesting. 38:08 AD: Because it is Turkish, I do not know, I say Turkish maybe it is Kurdish, I do not know but kabak either like squash ̶ Actually we have one word, both squash and then pumpkin you say kabak, like zucchini squash ̶ is it in Kurdish too? 38:26 MT: Yes, one word. 38:27 AD: Yes, kabak so, and here you have like all different ̶ so I am like which one is which, and kabak maybe they were like fruit ̶ I told you that maybe they were raising kabak or something, I do not know, and also in Eastern part of Turkey I know they also make like musical instruments and things like that from pumpkin– 38:56 JK: Oh, wow. 38:56 AD: Yeah, not that I am a musician but I know like a lot of things going on and “ian” [yan] is son of. I know that. So, it is like easy to catch that. 39:06 JK: To understand who they are and stuff. 39:14 AD: yeah, yeah exactly. So, any other questions? So now you know the questions you need to ask your mother. So she is probably going to give you more details and then you go. So what are the names of your family members, I am curious, like did they keep Armenian names or did they choose Western names? JK: Well, on my dad’s side his dad, his dad’s, my grandfather’s, name Harutun, my younger brother’s Henry Harutun, my grandmother is Victoria, I am not sure if that– I do not think that translates to Armenian. But, my grandfather his brothers and sisters, their named Arslanian which is Armenian, Louise, I think there is a translation for Armenian because my grandfather’s side, they are pretty much all Armenian and they like to keep the Armenian heritage basically. Aristaks, that is another great uncle of mine. On my mom’s side, Annie is my Aunt but her– she has another name that translates to Armenian, she goes by Annie but that is not her real name. 41:03 AD: I see. 41:06 JK: Yeah, and Edouard, he is another one. Madeline, I am not sure if that translates but Varoujan, Leon, Nora I am not sure where they got Nora that is my mom’s name. 41:17 MT: Nora is Arabic. 41:20 JK: Yeah, I do not know. 41:21 AD: Like from Noor. 41:23 JK: Noor is Armenian word, its means sweet. 41:27 MT: It means light, Noor means light. 41:29 JK: Oh light. 41:31 AD: In Arabic but in Armenian, maybe. 41:33 JK: Maybe, I thought it meant sweet; I have to ask her, I am not sure. 41:38 AD: Yeah, so your mom speaks Arabic as well. 41:41 JK: Yes she speaks Turkish, Armenian, Arabic, French and English and then my aunt, they were stuck in the house in Lebanon during the war, they could not do anything, this is after– like they could not go to school and stuff so they were stuck in their house. And they could only eat like bread, they did not have meat. So my aunt she read all these books, so she knew Spanish and Italian as well so she knows seven languages which is really interesting. 42:11 AD: Wow, so when your mom speaks does she have an accent? 42:18 JK: I got used to it, she does, I can tell she does. My friends know she has an accent. Especially when she speaks English she is not the best at it, since it is one of the later languages she did learn. 42:32 AD: So she speaks like me, with an accent. 42:34 JK: Yeah. 42:35 AD: Okay, so I did not listen to the interview Marwan transcribed your interview from Montreal. But he was just trying to figure out where the interview was, so I heard very short ̶ brief like a couple of words and I was like who is this Turkish interview, she sounded Turkish to me, whoever you were talking to, who was that? 43:02 JK: That was my mom’s aunt. 43:04 AD: Like her accent, speaking English sounded like a Turkish speaker is speaking English, to me. So what does she speak? 43:14 JK: She can speak Armenian, Turkish and she speaks English but it is hard for like the big words I was saying she did not understand that why my second or third cousin was there speaking Armenian trying to translate it because sometimes she would not understand what I was trying to ask. 43:30 AD: Yeah but her English, her accent in English sounded like Turkish speaker too. 43:34 JK: Okay yeah. 43:35 AD: Okay. 43:36 JK: It is very interesting. 43:38 AD: Yeah, yeah absolutely. So but your dad has no accent what so ever? 43:44 JK: No he is from– he is a Binghamton native. 43:49 AD: So, okay before we end, I did not ask so much about your father’s side. So who is here from your father’s side of the family, in town? 44:02 JK: Everyone so ̶ 44:03 AD: But you said you are not so close to them. 44:07 JK: I am close to them but I, like, I find my mother’s side more interesting and more fun to be around. They are very– 44:17 AD: Americanized? 44:19 JK: Not actually not really, I do not think so, I think because they are– I do not have– my cousins do not live here from my dad’s side either, that it is hard really to connect with them because they are much older. I have my grandfather, Harutun, he is my dad’s dad, dad, yeah. Okay, and then he has two brothers and one sister, so one is Aristaks so he is general surgeon here, so he is still in Binghamton. Then Arslan[ian], he is very– they are–all of them have very strong Armenian culture, they go to church– 45:03 AD: So are you going to interview with all these people? 45:05 JK: Hopefully yes. Another one is Louise; that is their sister, so they all live here. 45:13 AD: So they all are well educated, I gather. 45:16 JK: Most of them yes. Especially the doctor, he went to Syracuse but they all went to Binghamton high school too, so they are from this area as well. 45:30 AD: Okay, tell your father convince them to interview with you. 45:35 JK: Yeah, I will. 45:36 AD: So, they all are like born and grew up here and, so your grandfather is still alive, your father’s father? 45:46 JK: Yes. 45:48 AD: So, how does he speak? Does he have an accent? 45:50 JK: No, because I believe because they were born here ̶ 45:53 AD: Oh, so that is like, so from your father’s side you are like third generation. 45:59 JK: Yeah. 46:00 AD: Oh, wow. 46:01 JK: I have to ask, I am not too familiar with them. 46:04 AD: If he was born here first, your father second, you third. 46:11 JK: I have to see though where they came from before that because that would be interesting. I know either on my grandmother’s side or my dad’s grandfather’s side, they came from through Cuba. 46:23 AD: Okay, now you have two tasks Jackie since we open all that up. You got to interview with your grandfather. 46:32 JK: Yeah, he actually, he has got really sick this past week which is interesting ̶ 46:39 AD: Well you got to talk to him. 46:41 JK: I know, before ̶ 46:43 AD: Please make the time. Please make the time. And talk to him because this is like a library. 46:50 JK: Exactly. 46:52 AD: It is about to burn, so you got to talk to him. Because it is very important, and so I think your first thing should be interviewing with your grandfather and then you can get all the news and it is not just important for the history of Armenian culture in Binghamton area or in the US but your family history too. So you will know all this and we are going to document it which is great! 47:29 MT: Jackie you mentioned a name Arslan, and you mentioned that your mother reads, right? That she reads Armenian? 47:36 JK: Yes. 47:37 MT: Okay does she read any, like, Armenian literature, novel or things like that? 47:42 JK: I am sure she did but in school, in Sunday school. We have Armenian Bible, she knows how to read it. 47:51 MT: How about other books? 47:54 JK: Oh, yes we have Armenian cook books, the magazines are Armenian, yeah. 47:59 MT: The reason I mentioned that because there is a novel it is written in poetry, it is like poem. The title is Prince Arslan, I assume it should be Armenian because the name is Armenian. But I read it in English, but it is very– 48:17 JK: I will ask about it. 48:19 MT: We have it in the Kurdish collection actually, but I read it when I was young, so it is really interesting this novel, it is written in poetry and it has been translated into Kurdish in poetry. 48:31 AD: Is it in Kurdish? 48:32 MT: Oh, we have it in Kurdish but I know the culture is not Kurdish– 48:34 AD: I mean we have it in Kurdish. 48:36 MT: Yes, we have it in Kurdish. 48:38 AD: So, we need to look into that to see if there is like an Armenian copy. Let us check and see if there is. 48:47 MT: It is very famous, Prince Arslan. I never knew that it might be Armenian but I know from the names like Faruk, do you have Faruk as a name? 49:02 AD: Faruk ̶ 49:03 MT: No, it is girl’s name, Faruk Laqaa or something like that. 49:10 JK: I will have to ask, does not sound like– nobody in my family but maybe. 49:15 MT: I mean the name sounds like Armenian– Yeah you should read that. 49:20 JK: I will ask. Maybe yeah. 49:34 AD: But what I know from Istanbul is like– really in Istanbul the Armenian community, my observation this is– the older generations they keep the traditional Armenian names, but like very good friend of mine, her name is Megi. I mean how Armenian that is! You know what I mean? So it is like even my generation, we are talking about fifty year old, so like, they tend to like get more Western names than–maybe at that time they were thinking oh, such boring names but I mean some still picks, you know–People go different things. They go back to original names and then they get tired of it, they pick different names so– 50:34 JK: I am not sure, even on my mom’s side there is some Armenian names ̶ 50:39 AD: Or then they have Armenian names but they have like these nicknames, Western names. 50:46 JK: Yeah, to assimilate it. 50:48 AD: You know what I mean? So that is also ̶ 50:51 MT: I think the old generation they’ve tried to keep the surname at least. Most of them they have the surname, yeah– it is dying out within the new generation as time passes. 51:09 JK: Yeah. 51:09 AD: What is the name of that Author? Prince what? 51:13 MT: Well Prince Arslan is the name of the book. 51:18 AD: Oh, the name of the book. Okay, but anyway, we will look at it. I am interested in looking at it. So, any questions, any more questions? 51:38 MT: If she wants to add something? 51:40 AD: Yeah, do you want to add anything that we forgot, you think that it is important? 51:48 MT: There are questions but they do not apply to her because she is young– 51:51 AD: –New generation. But you certainly can ask more question to your grandfather ̶ 52:03 MT: Do you know if your family, like your mother or father they were in like politics? Because there has been some politics going on in Binghamton community. 52:15 JK: My father, my dad he is very much into politics, because he works– 52:20 MT: There are like two different parties in Armenia. 52:23 AD: In Armenia, Armenian politics. 52:26 JK: My parents probably know more about it. My dad loves looking at what is going on in Armenia. There has always been a divide, even the language which is spoken; I know there is like a West side and the Eastern side. There is different words that they use, but it is like Armenian, they speak Armenian but they have different slang words and things like that and how it is spoken which is really interesting, so but they would know more– 52:55 MT: I think that Armenian diaspora; they speak Western Armenian or maybe Eastern? 53:01 JK: It depends on where you from I think– 53:03 MT: Yeah but the dialect that they speak here is not spoken anymore in Armenia, so the official language I think is Eastern Armenian and the Diaspora people they speak Western Armenian– 53:15 AD: Eastern Armenians are people from the former Soviet Union? 53:20 MT: Yeah. 53:21 AD: Yeah, so the Western Armenian it is like people left Ottoman Empire, or Turkey. So I think that makes– and to me it makes a lot of sense because one influenced by the Russian, the other one influenced by Turkish. So it happens a lot. 53:44 MT: Yeah, when people here go back to Armenia they have a hard time to understand the Eastern Armenian. 53:52 AD: It is a different dialect probably. 54:00 JK: Yeah. Even my mom’s side and my dad’s side, when my mom is talking to my grandfather and my grandmother they use different words for like çörek they call it with different word on my grandparent’s side which is interesting. 54:13 AD: Çörek? 54:14 JK: Yeah. 54:15 AD: I told you çörek. 54:16 JK: I love çörek. 54:17 MT: But you did not bring it. 54:19 AD: We will go visit your mom. 54:21 MT: You were supposed to get it from Turkey, from Istanbul–the original. 54:25 JK: That is my favorite. Wow, do you helva, have you heard of it? 54:32 MT: Do you pronounce– or maybe it has come from the Turkish– We say halwa, it is like you change the ‘WA’ sound to ‘V.’ 54:44 JK: Yeah, helva. 54:45 AD: I think that is like– let us put it that way, like Anatolian, let usnot just say just Turkish. So it is like that is the region. Regional affect I think. And I see that a lot with Kurdish culture too. Regional affect, so you have more Arabic influence and Kurds from Turkey have more Anatolian because that is the land, I mean that is the seasoning they use, you know, like all these ingredients, it is regional effect on people than ethnic. I mean it is similar but you see that I certainly like when I was processing the Kurdish collection, I could tell which piece of artifact came from Iraqi region or Iranian region or Turkish you know Anatolian region. I could easily tell because it is there, and there is nothing wrong with that because it is the region you know, same thing in this country. Cannot you tell the difference between Southern and Northern? 56:06 JK: Yeah. 56:06 AD: It affects. There is– you know, it certainly affects. You can tell the difference, so I think the words, the food everything. I mean Armenian food is–I read an article actually, somebody– because I am into food, I love food. So somebody, I wish I saved that article, did a research to see the difference between Armenian food that you can eat in Istanbul than in Yerevan. Like there is a difference. 56:52 JK: Wow. 56:53 AD: Yeah, I mean– when I read it I said wow, that is exactly supports my argument. I mean it is just as delicious but it is different. 57:06 JK: Different influences, yeah of course. It is interesting. 57:07 AD: When Armenians do this and that and then Armenians over there are cooking totally different– 57:17 JK: It is finally something totally different from us. 57:19 AD: Exactly. 57:20 JK: Because it is so Westernized. 57:23 AD: Yeah, there is this, okay, God I cannot think of– I, I did not get enough sleep– there is this appetizer, which is very, very famous in Armenia. So Armenian culture introduced to– especially for Istanbul cuisine. I do not want to say the whole Turkey, but in Istanbul because there is a great effect there. So you basically make a paste from chick peas– I am asking if you ever–s o and then you make this inside like with onion, and then you kind of topik, have you ever heard of that ̶ 58:10 JK: No, but it sounds like you are making humus. 58:14 AD: But it is not– I need to find the picture, and like that is like when you say what is the biggest influence– and especially like– 58:29 JK: And you know what, it is interesting as well, my friend from Binghamton University he was looking up Armenian food because he is really interested in food and he loves Armenian food, and he thought that there is a type of donut, but it is actually Russian. 58:47 AD: [laughs], so I am just proving with the– look at that! So– 58:54 JK: I have never seen that. I know this. 58:56 AD: That is lentil balls. 59:01 JK: We have that for Easter! 59:05 AD: Yeah, I think thank you Jackie for your time, thank you so much. So this is– (End of Interview) Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Jacqueline Kachadourian https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/addca401e9f29ed469e6cac9400cf83f.mp3 79abb94447f7571581ac06b708694b19 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Broome County Oral History Project Subject The topic of the resource Broome County -- History Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Description An account of the resource The Broome County Oral History Project was conceived and administered by the Senior Services Unit of the <a href="http://www.gobroomecounty.com/senior">Office for the Aging</a>. Funding for this project was provided by the Broome County Office of Employment and Training (C.E.T.A.), with additional funding from the Senior Service Unit of the National Council on Aging and Broome County government. The aim of this project was two-fold – to obtain historical information about life in Broome County, which would be useful for researchers and teachers, and to provide employment for older persons of a limited income. The oral history interviews were obtained between November 1977 and September 1978 and were conducted by five interviewers under the supervision of the Action for Older Persons Program. The collection contains 75 interviews and transcriptions, 77 cassette tapes, and a subject index containing names of individuals associated with specific subject terms. One transcribed interview does not have an accompanying audio recording. In 2005 Binghamton University Libraries’ Special Collections Department participated in the New York State Audiotape Project which undertook preservation reformatting of the audiotapes, and the creation of compact discs for patron use. Several interviews do not have release forms and cannot be reviewed. See the <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">finding aid </a>for additional information. Acknowledgment of sensitive content Binghamton University Libraries provide digital access to select materials held within the Special Collections department. Oral histories provide a vibrant window into life in the community. However, they also expose insensitive, and at times offensive, racial and gender terminology that, though once commonplace, are now acknowledged to cause harm. The Libraries have chosen to make these oral histories available as part of the historical record but the Libraries do not support or agree with the harmful narratives that can be found in these volumes. <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/digital/">Digital Collections</a> are created for educational and historical purposes only. It is our intention to present the content as it originally appeared. Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context 2 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Ben Coury, Digital Web Designer Yvonne Deligato, Former University Archivist Shandi Ezraseneh, Student Employee Laura Evans, Former Metadata Librarian Caitlin Holton, Digital Initiatives Assistant Jamey McDermott, Student Employee Erin Rushton, Head of Digital Initiatives David Schuster, Senior Director for Library Technology and Digital Strategies Coverage The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant 1977-1978 Relation A related resource <a href="https://archivesspace.binghamton.edu/public/repositories/2/resources/44">Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections, Broome County Oral History project</a> Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed McAvoy, James J. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Dobandi, Susan Date of Interview 1978-02-01 Collection Broome County Oral History Project Date of Digitization 2016-03-27 Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 26:49 Minutes Streaming Audio Streaming URL <a href="https://eternity.binghamton.edu/delivery/DeliveryManagerServlet?dps_pid=IE55978">Interview with James J. McAvoy</a> Subject LCSH McAvoy, James J. -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Hotels -- Employees -- Interviews; Prohibition; Johnson City (N.Y.); Faatz Brush and Felting Works Company Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Broome County Oral History Project Interview with: Mr. James S. McAvoy Interviewed by: Susan Dobandi Date of interview: 1 February 1978 James: I think we could pull that curtain down. Susan: No, that's fine. Mr. McAvoy could you tell us something about your early recollections of your childhood—something about your parents? James: Well Mother and Father lived together with six children and they're all—two of us is all that's left. I'm the second oldest one and I have a sister. She's alive yet she is 80, she lives in Binghamton. She is 80 years old. The rest of them has all passed away. My mother—my father he was 93 when he died. My mother was 90.  Susan: What kind of work did your father do? James: Eh? Susan: What kind of work? James: Ah he a well a when we were young we used to run a hotel. We run a hotel over in Four Corners for 30-40 years then after that time Prohibition that shut the hotel up so we lived on the farm there for a while and when he got some kind of work he came down here. I stayed on the farm there for a while and I lost all my dairy in the TB test. I said the TB test. My wife was sick quite a little bit that was the girls’ job so my wife she was sick an awful lot she always was such a great worker. She worked too hard on the farm so she was at Sayre Hospital, so she was up there I came up here and got a job. When she got her out we lived on the farm for about a month and I got a house up here and we moved up here that was ‘48 I think. Susan: How much schooling did you have as a youngster? James: How many? I had a 5 girls. Susan: No, no, schooling—school? James: Oh I never had too much school. We only had a country school about the ninth grade. We never got too far in school we never had money enough to go to college so of course them days the colleges were so far away. They wasn't like they are today so, we ain’t got too much education don't think that. We got away with it in the world of course we made a lot of mistakes along as everybody else as long as the graduated people does but a I often missed it but a—so then after we got up here they was better schools up there so I had five daughters and there is two of them graduated down from Meshoppen High School. The other three graduated from Johnson City High School. A—So they well was—I have one daughter who lives up in Hillcrest and I have another daughter who lives over in Endwell and then I have a daughter who lives over on Crisfield in Vestal and then I have one daughter who lives in Meshoppin, PA. Susan: Well, can you tell me something about some of your jobs that you had? James: Ah I—used to be a foreman on the road for a Tillion coal contractor company. I done that for about 3 years. I was Assistant Foreman. I wasn't a big hot shot but I was over all the grading work and all that kind of stuff and they were leaving town then didn't have no jobs so I didn't want to leave home to go with them because they only had about 6 months work on a job or somethin’. So then I come up here and I got a job with Felters and I worked 20 years there. Susan: What kind of work did you do there? James: Well, I ran a machine. I operated a carding machine. Susan: What did they make? I knew of the Felter Co, but E-J's made shoes. James: They made felt—felt—made all kinds of felt—made, oh, I couldn't tell you all the kinds, at that time there were 25 or 30 different kinds of felt. They made felt for the government, made felt for ink pads and anything you want they made it for shoes felt and all that stuff. They were a nice place to work for. The work wasn't hard. It was steady work. Dusty but otherwise twas a nice job to work and they were a nice company to work for so after I got through there they moved out of town when I quit. I was sixty nine years old when I—when they moved out of town, so I—well I done a little painting around, carpentering and I got tired of that and I quit and I didn't do anything ever since. Then my wife got sick and she had a stroke so we stayed home and took care of her for quite a while. Susan: Can you recall of any of the big changes that have happened here? James: That's right. Yeah.  Susan: —in the area since you— James: That's true. Yeah. That of course is a lot of changes in life since we were born. Susan: Were the trolley cars here when you first came here to—was it Lestershire or had it changed to Johnson City? James: It was Johnson City. Yeah—yeah I used often wonder when I was a young kid I'd often wonder I'd like to go to Lestershire—ha ha ha—but when I got there and I found out it was altogether a different place—ha ha ha. Used to hear people at home out in our country about the doom down here a lot of them worked at the shoe factory they’d be telling about Lestershire and next thing we knew it was about Johnson City. Ha ha ha yeah—yeah, so I don't know. Susan: What about some of the buildings I mean can you recall when you first came here—a what it was like? James: Oh there was a lot of business when we first come here and was a lot of places that started business entirely. You could go most anyplace and get a job then. There was the Robinson Lumber Co. and there was the big Spool & Bobbin, the foundry over where the Philadelphia sales is and another factory right down there in Endwell—a—err—Johnson City Heel & Last ah there is a lot of them here that's gone out of business since I come here. Yeah, you could go out most anytime.  Susan: Were there any—a—important events like big fires or things that you recall when you were younger? James: Oh well not up around here that I know of, of course no not really. Of course down in our country Pennsylvania there used to be they lumber that country over, you know, then somebody started a fire clean the brush ha ha cleared the timber off and they were big fires but there were always fires barns and houses burning one thing or another but the country there was never as big fires as you have up here you know. Susan: We've been trying to gather information from people that have worked in the cigar factories that were here at one time. James: The cigar factory fire—well that was before I came up here. Susan: Oh it was. James: That's the time it burned up all them girls but that was a few years before I moved up here. Susan: I see.  James: Yeah. But my girls they all come up here and they all went to work they got jobs and finally all got married so I'm working now. I have one daughter she lives in Massachusetts I don't know something else what you know what happened around here.  Susan: Well is there anything you can tell us about your parents? When they were growing up or any of their customs? What were your people? What background were they? James: What? What? Susan: What background were they? James: Oh they I don’t— Susan: Well you knew that there were a lot of Polish and Russians here. James: Oh they were just common ordinary people you know the ah—yeah—my mother and grandfather, grandmother my grandfather, Carter, he was about 94 years old when he died. Susan: But was he born in this country? James: He was born in a—New York State. Yeah. He was born up here someplace up here. My grandmother was born down in Auburn, Pennsylvania. Her name was Farley and—and like anything else we're scattered all over the country. What do you do live here in Binghamton? Susan: I—I was born in Binghamton and I was brought up in Johnson City. My family is from here. James: Yeah, well my wife she was born in Binghamton—err Pennsylvania too. Susan: Well the McAvoys are quite—quite a well known name in this community. James: Oh yes. Susan: Don’t you have a some of your relatives? James: Cousins of these McAvoys up here Tom, the judge.  Susan: The judge. When I first heard the name I said, “McAvoy, well you must know quite a few people.” James: Yeah. Oh well I don’t know we were never too close together we were always good friends back and forth but you know yet my grandfather used to all I know is what he told me. He said there were six of them, and their parents died when they were young and they were scattered all over the country. Some of then New York, some of them in Scranton and I don't know where he was and I never knew too much about them because he'd never tell ya too much. He was grown up an orphan of some kind then he went west for quite a while when he went out on that gold hunt you know but I guess he never got too much gold. Susan: Your grandfather did or your father did? James: Yeah, well he was past eighty when he passed away. Yeah—yep. Susan: What—what do you think about the changes? What do you think about the changes from a—a the radio when it first came and now television?  James: Do you like television? Well, I think I'll tell ya some that’s all right some that they've gone a little too far with. I do for a fact. Susan: But you have lived to see a lot of changes. James: But not when we were kids—ah we never had television, never radio. I helped build the first telephone line ever to come in our country. There used to be 52 on one line. Susan: Fifty-two, that's interesting. James: Yeah—ha ha yeah. Susan: How about when you first started working for Felters? Can you remember what you earned? James: Yeah, I started in at 80¢ an hour when I started in but I got through I was getting $1.30. Susan: $1.30. James: Yeah, but I was just as well off at the 80¢ as I was with the $1.30 because everything wasn't so high it didn't cost us any more to live at that than when we were getting $1.30 because everything went up so in prices and everything. Yeah. Susan: Can you recall some of the things you did as a young man for entertainment socially? James: Does what? Susan: Can you recall what you did as a young man? I mean from the standpoint of fun, recreation? James: Oh well we used to winter times—we of course you may think it’s funny but we used to there used to be a lot of quilting bees, tying comforter and lot of us get together if you had a quilting bee we'd tie your quilt and then we played checkers, played cards, a lot of dances. They was we had just good times as they have today at least we didn't know any better—ha. But today we didn't have no way you never got so far away from home because about all we had is a horse and wagon 8 and 10 miles was our limit today they don't mind three or four hundred miles with a car—yeah—we all got along. We was never found any fault. Used to have a lot of nice ice cream socials, oyster suppers, dances and all of that. Susan: Did you ever go to those barn raising affairs? James: Oh God, yes. Oh sure. Susan: —to help one another.  James: We had that right along. Yeah. Neighbor build a barn and everybody turned out and helped him. Yeah—there ain't no more of that anymore. Now it's all done mechanically. Yeah, yet I can remember when they used to go to the woods with a broad ax and cut the frames right out in the woods. The old fellows put them together and they'd go together too. Susan: And they lasted a long time. James: Yeah, oh God, last a long time. Well if they used hemlock or pine they'd last for years. Hemlock or hardwood didn't last so long because the worm eat if you didn't keep the roof on it and keep it dry. Yeah most of us built—Our country there was a lot of hemlock and pine. We used that. Susan: Well, Mr. McAvoy it's been nice talking with you. James, Well I'm glad I talked to you too. Susan: It's a lovely day, after all that snow we had.  James: Yeah. Talk to Lena there she's got a better record yeah. Susan: I will, thank you very much. This is Susan Dobandi interviewer and I have been talking with James J. McAvoy who lives at 15 Park St., Johnson City, NY. The date is Feb 1st, 1978. Rights Statement This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with James J. McAvoy Subject The topic of the resource McAvoy, James J. -- Interviews; Broome County (N.Y.) -- History; Hotels -- Employees -- Interviews; Prohibition; Johnson City (N.Y.); Faatz Brush and Felting Works Company Description An account of the resource James J. McAvoy discusses his childhood working for his family's hotel for about thirty five years before its closure due to the prohibition movement. He talks about working at the Felters Company. As a young man he participated in a barn raising and discusses social activities. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource This audio file and digital image may only be used for educational purposes. Please cite as: Broome County Oral History Project, Special Collections, Binghamton University Libraries, Binghamton University, State University of New York. For usage beyond fair use please contact the Binghamton University Libraries Special Collections for more information. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Recording 43 Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource McAvoy, James J. ; Dobandi, Susan Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 1978-02-01 Date Modified Date on which the resource was changed. 2016-03-27 Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. Broome County Oral History Project Extent The size or duration of the resource. 26:49 Minutes https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/90356e6ae8f586727376c878129bf626.jpg f8bdcf5336537ff3a1a07e3a39962950 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/bc72c418a7971e7fe9789d0c0a5e85a8.mp3 0c648814fe737a76adf1256d789c7592 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Audio interviews Title A name given to the resource McKiernan Interviews Description An account of the resource Stephen McKiernan's collection of interviews includes more than two hundred interviews with prominent figures of the 1960s, which were collected between the mid-1990s to 2023 The collection provides narratives of people who were actively involved in or witnessed events in the 1960s, an era which spurred profound cultural and political transformation in the twentieth century. Interviewees include politicians, artists, scholars, musicians, authors, and veterans who delve into the decade’s most prominent issues and events, including the civil rights movement, the free speech movement, the anti-war movement, women’s rights, gay rights, segregation, the Vietnam War, Woodstock, Hippies, Yippies, and individualism. <h3>The McKiernan 22</h3> <div>Stephen McKiernan interviewed legends of the 1960s. When asked in 2021 where one should start when sifting through his vast collection, he provided the following list:</div> <ul> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/854">Julian Bond</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1866">Bobby Muller</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1175">Craig McNamara</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/910">Dr. Arthur Levine</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/837">Diane Carlson Evans</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/942">Dr. Ellen Schrecker</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/876">Dr. Lee Edwards</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/841">Peter Coyote</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1233">Dr. Roosevelt Johnson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/899">Rennie Davis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1222">Kim Phuc</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/917">George McGovern</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/833">Frank Schaeffer</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/840">Rev. Dr. Frank Forrester Church </a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1240">Dr. Marilyn Young</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/842">James Fallows</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/835">Joseph Lee Galloway</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/911">John Lewis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/839">Paul Critchlow</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/888">Steve Gunderson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1159">Charles Kaiser</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/2407">Joseph Lewis</a></li> </ul> Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Stephen McKiernan Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Language A language of the resource English Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright. Template: Simple Audio Player (Amplitude.js) This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Date of Interview 2010-06-29 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Steven McKiernan Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed James M. Fallows Language English Biographical Text <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"James Mackenzie Fallows is a writer, editor, columnist, and journalist. His writing pieces have appeared in The New York Times Magazine, New Yorker, Slate, and many others. He has been a professor visiting several universities in the U.S and China. In addition, he wrote ten books and received the 1983 National Book Award. He studied at Harvard University for his Bachelor's degree in 1970 and Queen's College, Oxford for economic development."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":15105,"3":{"1":0},"11":4,"12":0,"14":[null,2,0],"15":"Arial","16":10}">James Mackenzie Fallows is a writer, editor, columnist, and journalist. His writing pieces have appeared in The New York Times Magazine, New Yorker, Slate, and many others. He has been a professor visiting several universities in the U.S and China. In addition, he wrote ten books and received the 1983 National Book Award. He studied at Harvard University for his Bachelor's degree in 1970 and Queen's College, Oxford for economic development. Digital Publisher Binghamton University Libraries Digital Format audio/mp4 Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data 1 Microcassette Material Type Sound Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Keywords <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Family structure; 1960's; Baby boom generation; Racial Issues; Civil War; Watergate; Gulf and Tonkin Resolution; The War in Afganistan; Iraq War; Martin Luther King Jr.; Student protest"}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":2,"4":{"1":2,"2":14281427}}">Family structure; 1960s; Baby boom generation; Racial Issues; Civil War; Watergate; Gulf of Tonkin Resolution; The War in Afganistan; Iraq War; Martin Luther King Jr.; Student protest Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 46:08 Subject LCSH Authors; Editors; Journalists; College teachers; Fallows, James M.--Interviews Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Rights Statement Many items in our digital collections are copyrighted. If you want to reuse any material in our collection you must seek permission, or decide if your purpose can qualify as fair use under the U.S. Copyright Law Section 107. If you think copyright or privacy has been violated, the University Libraries will investigate the issue. Please see our take down policy. If using any materials in this online digital collection for educational or research purposes, please cite accordingly. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with James Mackenzie Fallows Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Fallows, James M. ; McKiernan, Stephen Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/wav Subject The topic of the resource Authors; Editors; Journalists; College teachers; Fallows, James M.--Interviews Description An account of the resource James Mackenzie Fallows is a writer, editor, columnist, and journalist. His writing pieces have appeared in The New York Times Magazine, New Yorker, and Slate, among others. He has been a professor visiting several universities in the U.S and China. In addition, he wrote ten books and received the 1983 National Book Award. He studied at Harvard University for his B.A., 1970 and Queen's College, Oxford for economic development. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2010-06-29 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context McKiernan.Oral.10.2016.12 Date Modified Date on which the resource was changed. 2017-03-01 Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. McKiernan Interviews Extent The size or duration of the resource. 46:08 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/7d02ce8853c1b77aa304b2e8aa4299aa.jpg a555dffc71217e18c54e15e305a7821b https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/a8cca57341ece4caa22dfde32ba7ec84.mp3 5bd492ceb0a679a785e09994e7266c13 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Audio interviews Title A name given to the resource McKiernan Interviews Description An account of the resource Stephen McKiernan's collection of interviews includes more than two hundred interviews with prominent figures of the 1960s, which were collected between the mid-1990s to 2023 The collection provides narratives of people who were actively involved in or witnessed events in the 1960s, an era which spurred profound cultural and political transformation in the twentieth century. Interviewees include politicians, artists, scholars, musicians, authors, and veterans who delve into the decade’s most prominent issues and events, including the civil rights movement, the free speech movement, the anti-war movement, women’s rights, gay rights, segregation, the Vietnam War, Woodstock, Hippies, Yippies, and individualism. <h3>The McKiernan 22</h3> <div>Stephen McKiernan interviewed legends of the 1960s. When asked in 2021 where one should start when sifting through his vast collection, he provided the following list:</div> <ul> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/854">Julian Bond</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1866">Bobby Muller</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1175">Craig McNamara</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/910">Dr. Arthur Levine</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/837">Diane Carlson Evans</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/942">Dr. Ellen Schrecker</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/876">Dr. Lee Edwards</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/841">Peter Coyote</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1233">Dr. Roosevelt Johnson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/899">Rennie Davis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1222">Kim Phuc</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/917">George McGovern</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/833">Frank Schaeffer</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/840">Rev. Dr. Frank Forrester Church </a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1240">Dr. Marilyn Young</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/842">James Fallows</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/835">Joseph Lee Galloway</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/911">John Lewis</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/839">Paul Critchlow</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/888">Steve Gunderson</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/1159">Charles Kaiser</a></li> <li><a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/show/2407">Joseph Lewis</a></li> </ul> Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Stephen McKiernan Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Language A language of the resource English Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright. Template: Simple Audio Player (Amplitude.js) This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Jan C. Scruggs Date of Interview 2011-11-26 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Stephen McKiernan Language English Digital Publisher Binghamton University Libraries Digital Format audio/mp4 Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data 1 Microcassette Material Type Sound Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 87:09 Biographical Text <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Jan Scruggs is a United States Army veteran who founded the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund and was the President of the foundation until 2015. He received the Purple Heart Medal for wounds received in combat, and was awarded three Army Commendation Medal, with 'Valor' device, along with the medal for Valor. After leaving the army, Scruggs received his Bachelor's degree from American University and his Master's degree in psychology, researching post-traumatic stress disorder."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":13311,"3":{"1":1},"4":[null,2,4884200],"5":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"6":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"7":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"8":{"1":[{"1":2,"2":0,"5":[null,2,0]},{"1":0,"2":0,"3":3},{"1":1,"2":0,"4":1}]},"9":0,"10":2,"11":4,"12":0,"15":"Arial","16":10}">Jan Scruggs is a United States Army veteran who founded the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund and was the President of the foundation until 2015. He received the Purple Heart Medal for wounds received in combat and was awarded three Army Commendation Medal, with 'Valor' device, along with the medal for Valor. After leaving the army, Scruggs received his Bachelor's degree from American University and his Master's degree in psychology, researching post-traumatic stress disorder. Keywords <span data-sheets-value="{"1":2,"2":"Affirmative Action; Vietnam Veterans; Post-traumatic stress disorder; Vietnam War; Vietnam Memorial; Anti-War Movement; Civil Rights Movement; Millennial generation."}" data-sheets-userformat="{"2":513,"3":{"1":0},"12":0}">Affirmative Action; Vietnam Veterans; Post-traumatic stress disorder; Vietnam War; Vietnam Memorial; Anti-War Movement; Civil Rights Movement; Millennial generation. Subject LCSH Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans; Post-traumatic stress disorder; Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund; Military decorations—United States; Scruggs, Jan C.--Interviews Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Rights Statement Many items in our digital collections are copyrighted. If you want to reuse any material in our collection you must seek permission, or decide if your purpose can qualify as fair use under the U.S. Copyright Law Section 107. If you think copyright or privacy has been violated, the University Libraries will investigate the issue. Please see our take down policy. If using any materials in this online digital collection for educational or research purposes, please cite accordingly. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Jan Scruggs Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Scruggs, Jan C. ; McKiernan, Stephen Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/wav Subject The topic of the resource Vietnam War, 1961-1975--Veterans; Post-traumatic stress disorder; Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund; Military decorations—United States; Scruggs, Jan C.--Interviews Description An account of the resource Jan Scruggs is a United States Army veteran who founded the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund and was the President of the foundation until 2015. He received the Purple Heart Medal for wounds received in combat and was awarded three Army Commendation Medal, with 'Valor' device, along with the medal for Valor. After leaving the army, Scruggs received his Bachelor's degree from American University and his Master's degree in psychology, researching post-traumatic stress disorder. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2011-11-26 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context McKiernan.Oral.10.2016.153 Date Modified Date on which the resource was changed. 2018-03-29 Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. McKiernan Interviews Extent The size or duration of the resource. 87:09 https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/a867875bb1189b4634f509fc65e550c6.MP3 fa1ba64b028710d1e03807cdcd27af7e https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/10c108126a98f8b4f171430d0d9087cb.jpeg 75dc8bf73998ab8dc41aaa6ecaa6cb43 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Middle Eastern Oral History Description An account of the resource This collection includes interviews of Middle Eastern immigrants who settled in the Binghamton area. Since the rise of nationalism and the repression of minorities during the last phase of the Ottoman Empire, the ethnic groups in the Middle East have faced physical pressure and violence, cultural assimilation, and ethnic cleansing in the nation-states they lived in, which made them to leave their homeland behind and settle throughout the United States. This project looks at the details about the impact of diaspora. Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright.  Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Aynur de Rouen, Ph.D. Relation A related resource <a href="https://www.binghamton.edu/libraries/about/collections/oral-histories/index.html#sustainablecommunities">Sustainable Communities Oral History Collection</a> Template: Simple Audio Player (Amplitude.js) This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Date of Interview July 7, 2019 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Joseph Seif Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Janet Hazar Language English Digital Publisher Binghamton University Digital Format Audio Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 41:49 minutes Biographical Text Born in Damascus, Syria, Jeanet grew up in a rich and diverse environment. Due to unrest in Syria, her family and she were forced to leave for the U.S. Her family's property was confiscated by the Syrian government and the Damascus International Airport was built on it. Today Jeanet resides in Appalachian, NY with her family. Keywords Syria, Damascus, Hafez Al-Assad, Family, Religion, Syrian Culture, Syrian Food, New York Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Rights Statement Many items in our digital collections are copyrighted. If you want to reuse any material in our collection you must seek permission, or decide if your purpose can qualify as fair use under the U.S. Copyright Law Section 107. If you think copyright or privacy has been violated, the University Libraries will investigate the issue. Please see our take down policy. If using any materials in this online digital collection for educational or research purposes, please cite accordingly. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Janet Hazar https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/files/original/4ad3dade9e07c21989df7f163995debd.mp3 8e699e5a681a4d200333ead51d8b6e7c Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Oral Histories Title A name given to the resource Oral Histories from 1960s Binghamton Alumni Description An account of the resource In 2019, Binghamton University Libraries completed a mission to collect oral interviews from 1960s alumni as a means to preserve memories of campus life. The resulting 47 tales are a retrospective of social, professional and personal experiences with the commonality of Harpur College. Some stories tell of humble beginnings, others discuss the formation of friendships; each provides insight into a moment in our community's rich history. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Irene Gashurov Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-2018 Relation A related resource <a href="https://omeka.binghamton.edu/omeka/items/browse?collection=18">McKiernan Interviews : 60's collection of Oral Histories</a> Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In copyright. Template: Simple Audio Player with Transcription This template displays an audio player by Amplitude.js with a scrollable transcription which is loaded from the "Transcription" metadata field. This template displays an audio player with the first attached image file as the 'cover image'. For its audio source, the template looks for the first attached audio file. If additional audio files exist, they should be combined using audio editing software, or a separate Omeka item should be made for each part. Date of Interview 2017-12-14 Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Irene Gashurov Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Janice L. Strauss Year of Graduation 1968 Biographical Text Janice is a Niagara Falls native. She worked as a Spanish teacher in Broome County. Interview Format Video or Audio Audio Keywords Harpur College – Sixties alumni; Harpur College – Alumni in secondary education; Harpur College – Alumni from Upstate New York; Harpur College – Alumni living in Broome County. Accessibility Copy/Paste below: Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Binghamton University Libraries is working very hard to create transcriptions of all audio/visual media present on this site. If you require a specific transcription for accessibility purposes, you may contact us at <a href="mailto:orb@binghamton.edu">orb@binghamton.edu</a>. Subject LCSH Harpur College – Sixties alumni; Harpur College – Alumni in secondary education; Harpur College – Alumni from Upstate New York; Harpur College – Alumni living in Broome County. Rights Statement Many items in our digital collections are copyrighted. If you want to reuse any material in our collection you must seek permission, or decide if your purpose can qualify as fair use under the U.S. Copyright Law Section 107. If you think copyright or privacy has been violated, the University Libraries will investigate the issue. Please see our take down policy. If using any materials in this online digital collection for educational or research purposes, please cite accordingly. Transcription Any written text transcribed from a sound, or alternative text from a visual medium Alumni Interviews Interview with: Janice Strauss Interviewed by: Irene Gashurov Transcriber: Oral History Lab Date of interview: 14 December 2017 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (Start of Interview) IG: 00:03 You will keep track of time? Okay. So-so please tell me your name, your birth date- Third speaker: 00:05 Yeah. JS: 00:13 Okay. IG: 00:14 -and where, and where we are. JS: 00:16 I am Janice Strauss, and my birth date was December 17, 1946 and we were in my home in Endicott, on Bean Hill Road. IG: 00:29 So, could you tell me where you grew up? JS: 00:34 Well, I was born in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, but only lived there for five years, and my parents moved to Niagara Falls, New York, and that is where I grew up, in an infamous area now called Love Canal, which we did not know about at the time. [laughs] IG: 00:49 So-so could- when did you come to Harpur College? JS: 00:55 I came to Harpur College in 1968, no 1964-1964 I graduated in 1968. Came in the summer of 1964 because Harpur College was still on trimester. And so, they had three semesters a year, one the first one started in July of 1964. IG: 01:20 So, what- do you have any memories, sort of, you know, brief snapshots of what the campus looked like when you first arrived, or, you know, from-from the time that you were there? JS: 01:30 Well, it was certainly much smaller than it is now. It was all red brick. The buildings were all red brick. There were none of these other designs. Um, and it was in perpetual- it was under a state of perpetual construction. There was always an area that was being added, um modified. I remember them planting trees one summer and pulling them out the next year because they were going to put a building right where they had just planted the trees. So, it is constant-constantly changing. IG: 02:07 Great planning. JS: 02:08 Yeah, we wondered [inaudible] wise guy, college kids, every once in a while, wondered about that. [laughs] IG: 02:15 So um, what were um- what was- tell me what were some of the significant events during the time that you were there that you remember that stand out? Um, historical events? JS: 02:31 Oh, historical events. Well, the entire time there was overshadowed by the Vietnam War, protests. People constantly leaving campus to go on busses to Washington, DC, running around, borrowing things from other people, everything from handkerchiefs in case they had to be prepared for tear gas to-- we were all rummaging through things to find things to send them off. As far as campus itself, we had a visit from Governor Rockefeller, Nelson Rockefeller at the time, because he had a hand in expanding campuses all over the state. And sometimes they called it Rockefeller's rock pile or mud pile, because with all that construction and building, something was always torn up in a mess, and when it rained, it would be muddy and-and I remember that a lot--people being concerned about that. Other significant historical events, the one that just hangs over my head is Vietnam. IG: 02:35 And how did you feel about the Vietnam War? JS: 02:38 I thought it was a dumb idea. Then I know that I know more, I think it was an even dumber idea. [laughs] I was not- I was still a little green. I just knew that we were sending a lot of people over there to kill other people, and the domino theory was-was right up front and center at the time. Our government was constantly telling us that if Vietnam fell to communism, then the whole rest of Southeast Asia would become communists, and we had to be worried and concerned about that. But even then, it was clear that it was a guerilla type war that our government did not even understand, and yet, standing back and looking in, you could see what was happening and-and the- the um- and it made for-for so many more deaths, because we did not seem to understand the strategy. We were fighting two different wars, and it meant that more people were being killed on our side, and more people were being killed on their side as they dumped Agent Orange. And I even remember us protesting against the Dow Chemical corporation because they were producing Agent Orange- IG: 04:50 During your time on campus? JS: 04:52 Yes-yes. So that was the biggest thing by far. IG: 04:56 Do you think that you became politicized on campus? Was, or did it stem from your upbringing? JS: 05:06 More so on campus-- just before I went to Harpur College, I had been an exchange student to Ecuador, and that opened my eyes. That was, that was the beginning, because then I saw what was happening to USAID money. Money was not going to the common person. I learned a different way to think-- everything from as simple as a space you know how we are sitting right now, we were fairly comfortable not in Ecuador, if you were friendly, you have to be here different. And because of how I was raised, I take a step backward, and they would take a step forward, and pretty soon I would be against the wall every day. [laughs] Things that you never thought about at all. I was very green when I went to Ecuador, and that started me thinking more along political and different lines. Kind of opened my eyes that there were there were different things out there that I never knew about. IG: 06:01 So, you spoke Spanish before you went to Ecuador. JS: 06:07 No-no, I had studied three years of German, [laughs] a year of Latin, a year of Latin, and three years of German. And yeah, I learned it quick, quickly, very quickly, um, yeah. So- IG: 06:19 Obviously, a talent for languages. JS: 06:22 Yeah, so when I came- eventually became a Spanish teacher. IG: 06:27 What? What did your- what was your home life like? What did your parents do? JS: 06:33 My dad was a factory worker. He worked for DuPont. It was a terrible job. I did not totally realize it and appreciate it at the time. At that time, though, they paid laborers decently so they could earn a living-- we had a small house. We owned our own home. I was the oldest of five kids, and my mom, for most of my childhood was a homemaker. It was only when they started cutting back at DuPont, and my father got a lesser job, but my mother went back. She already had her college degree, and she went back into teaching. And so, when I was in high school, my mother went back to work but I was the oldest. The youngest was only in kindergarten at the time, but- so I was- as the oldest child, I often took care of my younger siblings, but not until I was in high school. I mean, I led a pretty sheltered life, quiet, lower middle-class neighborhood, with my dad working his tail off, I think, which eventually killed him. He died when he was only 62 and by then, his hair roots had started to turn green from all the chemicals and he made, he made sodium for DuPont, and they did something called tickle the cells, which meant that they stirred up big, giant furnaces, and the sodium would pop up at them. And you would see them hanging out as you drive by the factories, you would see them hanging out the windows trying to breathe better. And I did not appreciate when he brought- he wore long underwear every day to protect himself from the burns. And when he came home each night, you could ring the sweat out there was that much. I mean, that is so you can imagine how hot it had to have been inside and all that kind of stuff. And as a kid, I do not- look back and look back at it. As an adult, I can appreciate so much more what he did and what he went through than I did as-as-as a kid, you know, but there were a lot of those in Niagara Falls. IG: 08:35 It was a family that valued education. JS: 08:38 Very much so. Yeah-yeah. IG: 08:42 Because you went on to college and became a Spanish teacher. And your siblings? JS: 08:46 They all went to college-- all of them. I have a brother who has just retired as a- was a registered nurse. I have a brother who became an engineer. Lives in Boston. He worked for the EPA up until this year. I have a sister who was a systems analyst who has retired and now lives here. She lived in New York City her whole adult life, and my youngest sister got a degree in accounting and did the books and things for a car company. So yeah. IG: 09:19 So, returning a little bit to campus. What was residential life like? Who were your friends? You know how did you spend time outside of class? JS: 09:35 Well, we made lifelong friends. IG: 09:36 Yes. JS: 09:37 I pulled this out in case you wanted to see. I did not know how this works, so I did not know what you wanted to see or do. [crosstalk] Oh, whatever works for you. But um, we have, we still have at least a dozen friends or more from-from those days-- that people we met on campus. Um, at the time, and I think it still is-- Harpur College was a geek school, and anytime you were not studying, you knew somebody else was studying and screwing up that bell shaped curve that you had to get over that hump [laughs] it was going to be- your grades were not going to be so good. And so, there was a lot of pressure, and we released pressure in good ways, fun ways, silly ways. I am not even sure they are acceptable today, the guys had, well, we had a curfew. IG: 10:09 Yes. JS: 10:10 The women had a curfew, which was- we were on campus this fall, the ladies were shocked. They said you had a curfew, because my wise guy husband had said to them, oh, we used to lock up the women. And they laughed. And when I was going like this with my arms folded, they looked at me and looked back at him and said, “You are not kidding.” And he said, “No,” he was not kidding. We had a curfew at 11 o'clock, and then the guys went out. When they came back, they would do things like have panty rays. You familiar with those? Oh my gosh, they the guys would come back, they would maybe been to town for a couple drinks or something, and so they were having fun, and they knew all the women were locked up in the dorms, and they come under our windows, and yeah, "We want panties. We want bras" and-and girls would throw them out. And-and I thought it was so dumb and silly. I went down to the basement one time with my roommate, and this is how we bonded and did so many things together. You asked, you know what? What it was like? We went into the lost and found in the laundry room, found some old bras, got some name tags. A lot of these young men had been in summer camps, and they had their names sewn in all their clothes. So, we took some of those labels out of their clothes and sewed them onto the bras and shot them out the window. So, the bra had a guy's name a label on it. And it was really funny, because the next day, some guy would come up to another guy and say, I found your bra last night. [laughs] So we did goofy, silly things like that that were just, you know, let off steam, but did not take too much time. [laughs]So that is kind of stuff we did. IG: 12:10 So, you know, how did you feel about curfews at the time? JS: 12:15 Even at the time, I found it annoying. You found annoying, but you just sort of accepted it, like we did not have any demonstrations about it, or anything like that, but I remember being especially annoyed with him one time. I still married him anyway. Because, because my roommate had been kept out late by her boyfriend. She had been saying to him, "I have to get back for curfew." IG: 12:35 Right. JS: 12:36 And um, he brought her back late, and at 11 o'clock they locked that door, man-- you could not get in. So, you had to ring the buzzer, and the house mother would come to the door. The head resident would come open the door, write you up that you would come late, and you got sent before the judicial review board for your punishment. So, he was on the judicial review board, all right, so he knew me, and he knew that I had in my closet, in my room, things for making cookies. So, he used to everyone, so I will make cookies in that little kitchenette in the basement. So, he sentenced her to make chocolate chip cookies for the entire dorm. And they all thought it was really funny we were- so I helped her. We were down there steaming the whole time while we made these chocolate chip cookies for the whole dorm. [laughs] In a sense, the punishment was silly, goofy, but we were still annoyed. [laughs] IG: 13:32 Right. And apparently that a peer of yours made- JS: 13:36 Right. [laughs] IG: 13:37 -made the judgment- JS: 13:38 Yeah-yeah. IG: 13:41 What were some of the expectations for you, for, maybe for-for you when you went to college, before going to college? So did you think of having career-- what was nor- the norm for women at the time, or maybe you were outside of the norm-- because of your Ecuador experience. JS: 14:00 And, yeah, in my group, and in-in, you know, this lower middle-income kind of thing, not everybody went to college. A lot of them went off and started working right away. But I remember my father, who got drafted out of college and never finished college. I think that is one reason he ended up as a laborer, telling me how proud he was that I was the first person on his side of the family to ever graduate from college, and he was very excited that I was going to college. And so, what expectations were just that I would do well. I had really good grades in high school. I did not have really good grades at Harpur. I had, I struggled to get over that hump on the bell-shaped curve. I remember one time getting 91 points out of 100 and it was a C plus. And I was so upset, I went to see the professor, and I handed him my paper, and I said, "Look, I only missed nine points on the whole test." And he pulled out of his drawer a graph and went through from the graph for my class, and said, "Look at this graph." And I looked at it, and the majority had gotten 90 or above. And he showed me how I fell exactly, just above the hump that he called a C, with that 91 points. And that is how they did the grading. He graded. He-he charted the-the grades of every student along this curve, and that is how you received your grade, not how many points you got on a test, but where you fell on that bell shaped curve. And I remember being so frustrated. [laughs] I did find the actual system there pretty frustrating. Even when I was there, when I look back on, I go, "Huh," but even when I was there, I remember thinking, this is really annoying. [laughs] IG: 15:48 So, at the time, did Harpur College have a reputation of being a tough school academically? JS: 15:55 Yeah-yeah. In fact, my guidance counselor at my high school called Niagara wheatfield. I lived at- the name of the town was actually Wheatfield, right outside of Niagara Falls. I remember my guidance counselor saying to me, “You are not going to get in there.” But I did get accepted and-and so I went. But I think with a 90, with a lower 90 high school average, I was on the lower end of the people accept it at Harpur College. So, I struggled, but I graduated, and some of those other people did not. [laughs] IG: 16:27 So, do you think that they did not graduate? Did Harpur College have also the reputation of being a party school or? JS: 16:34 No, not at all. No, not at all. IG: 16:37 Very studios. JS: 16:37 Yeah, no. IG: 16:40 What did you study? JS: 16:42 Well, mostly Spanish [crosstalk], but I started [crosstalk] IG: 16:46 [inaudible] academically [inaudible] JS: 16:48 Um, it was tough, but it was um, not what I expected. I expected I had come back just from Ecuador, speaking a lot of Spanish, and I wanted to build on that and improve on that. And instead, it was strictly a literature curriculum. It was read-read-read- IG: 17:02 Right-right. In English? JS: 17:08 -and no in Spanish. IG: 17:10 Uh-huh. JS: 17:10 You would read the novels in Spanish, but some professors conducted class in English and some in Spanish. It was, it was a mix. IG: 17:18 Right. JS: 17:19 And so, it was not what I had hoped. I had hoped to get much stronger in my Spanish, and I developed some strengths from the reading, some vocabulary, but not- I did not become [crosstalk], yeah, I- we did not- I took every conversation course they offered while I was there--usually they were only two credit courses, where our courses at the time were four credits. IG: 17:41 Right. JS: 17:42 Because they were on that trimester thing. We had four courses each semester, and each course was worth four credits. So, we did 16 credits per semester, and they only offered these two credit conversation courses, and I think I wound up with a total of eight credits in conversation. So, it was not exactly what I had hoped I still had the opportunity to use the language, but it was different than what I expected. IG: 18:05 Do you have any professors that stand out in your memory as being exceptional? JS: 18:13 Oh, absolutely. A bunch of- IG: 18:15 Give us some examples. JS: 18:16 -bunch of them who are excited in what they did and very good. And there was a fellow who died shortly after I graduated. His last name was Bachelor, Dr. Bachelor, and he was so enthusiastic. He would read these books and say, does not this like tug at your heartstrings. I mean, what motion [crosstalk] IG: 18:33 Remember the books that he went- JS: 18:35 Oh, God. That is tough. IG: 18:36 What were the classes? the literature [crosstalk] JS: 18:40 What were the classes- IG: 18:40 The literature classes? What-what writers did you... JS: 18:45 Oh, my goodness, that is tough. I remember that the categories, I remember we did one whole thing on-on South American literature, one on the Golden Age in Spain. I mean, the courses that they were centered around those particular things. I mean, we read all the classic ones. Read Cervantes, if you can believe it, we read the Quixote from start to finish- IG: 19:07 That is incredible. JS: 19:07 -three-three tones. [laughs] There was a lot of reading, a lot. IG: 19:13 For- you know, how many people did you have, how many students did you have in a class--for example, by today's standards? JS: 19:20 For example, by today's standards, pretty small, I am going to say between 15 and 20 in a class. Yeah-yeah. IG: 19:30 So, what other, what other, you know, faculty really made an outstanding impression? JS: 19:36 Oh, gosh, what I remember, hmmm [crosstalk] IG: 19:41 -friends with anyone after you know- JS: 19:44 Faculty, people? IG: 19:45 Faculty, yes. JS: 19:46 Hmm, I do not know that I did--Jeff did. I think Jeff actually went to a couple of their homes and things like that. But um, no. IG: 19:57 So, you did not, you did not- JS: 19:59 Yeah, I mean, on campus, we would visit with them and go to their office and talk with them. There was a German professor that I loved. I had to drop German after about a year because I could not fit in. If you wanted to graduate with a major in Spanish- IG: 20:14 Right. JS: 20:14 -you had to have another romance language. IG: 20:16 I see. JS: 20:17 And I could not carry three languages and still do all the other required courses that I needed. IG: 20:24 So, which other romance language... JS: 20:26 I picked up Italian. So, I did Italian for a while. IG: 20:29 So, do you think that Romance were strengths of Harper College at the time? JS: 20:35 Romance Languages? IG: 20:36 Yes. JS: 20:38 Well, they have very strong Romance Language department. IG: 20:40 Very strong. JS: 20:41 Oh, yeah, sure, yeah. IG: 20:43 So, if you did not go to faculties' homes, you know what-how you know, what was your recreation like? You- did you belong to any clubs or organizations? How did you unwind? Yeah. JS: 21:01 A couple clubs that- not a lot. Honestly, it was study-study-study. There really, was not- IG: 21:08 Really? JS: 21:08 -a lot of spare time for other things. We-we joined a few organizations, um, I belonged to the Newman Club, but they met maybe once a week for an hour. IG: 21:19 What was Newman Club? JS: 21:19 Newman Club was affiliated with the Catholic Church. Um and um, I cannot even remember what we did together. [laughter] Terrible. What-what sticks in my mind are the things we did together as friends, like that silly stuff I told you about the panty raids and-and, or one time when there was a terrible snowstorm, we all walked all the way from campus into Downtown Binghamton and found the only restaurant still open, and-and, you know, had had a good time there. IG: 21:23 I see. What was Binghamton like at the time? Was it very rural or...? JS: 22:01 No. Actually, I think it had more greater population than it does now. Actually, did not have the state- the tall state office tower buildings yet, or anything like that, but it was a busy place. But they did not- there was not too much town and gown mingling. They did not really care for Harpur College students. They-they always referred to us as the Harpur hippies. IG: 22:25 Oh, I see, yes. JS: 22:26 Um, when I went to the public library in Downtown Binghamton to get a library card, and she was very friendly and said, you know, fill out this form, do not worry. And I had put, you know, Box 187 Harpur College. And she went, "Oh, Harpur College," her whole demeanor, her whole tone, everything changed. I remember going for an interview for a job after I first graduated, and some kids hanging out of school, and some kids hanging out with school bus go, "There she is. There she is. That is the Harpur hippie. That is the Harpur" and I did not look like a hippie other than that. I had long hair, but that was about it. IG: 23:01 That is, that is very interesting, and it opens up a number of questions. So, you would go to the public library, would you, you know, would you use the library on campus? And what was it like? JS: 23:17 Oh, yeah, I go to the public library for novels and things like that. IG: 23:21 Yeah. JS: 23:21 I go to the one on Harpur College for everything else. All my school needs, whatever books we were supposed to read, or if I did not understand something I was reading, I would go there to look for an analysis of what I was reading. It was I looked at the one on campus much more academically. And by the way, there only was one I bring now, like I have lost track. Everybody has a library. The science building, there was just one, and it was all open stacks. And that is not true with all everything anymore. IG: 23:51 Going back to Harpur hippie. So how did the college acquire this reputation? Was it for the anti-war activism, do you think? JS: 24:02 I think in large part, I the first I remember hearing of Harper College back home in Niagara Falls or in the town of Wheatfield [chuckles] was when they sent people to protest the house on Un-American Activities Committee hearings in Washington, DC, and that is when they started to gain that reputation that they were this extreme liberal group, they did not use the term progressive back then or anything. But I remember people say- yeah, at that time, it was a small college. The reason I picked it is I applied at three state universities. First of all, only state universities, because they were the cheapest. IG: 24:41 Yes. JS: 24:42 And then when I was accepted at all three Albany, Buffalo and Harpur, I picked Harpur because it was the smallest, and you asked me about the class size- IG: 24:50 Yes. JS: 24:50 -that had, that had a lot of meaning for me, the fact that there was a lot of interpersonal exchange with the professors and all that kind of stuff. And to this day, I really appreciated that we got to know our professors. IG: 25:01 Were your parents involved at all in your college decisions? JS: 25:07 To the extent that they said I could apply anywhere I wanted, as long as it said SUNY in front of it. IG: 25:13 Okay. JS: 25:13 That was a financial. That was a financial. IG: 25:16 Did they know about Harpur's sort of liberal reputation? JS: 25:22 I am sure they have, they had heard of it. They were both well-read but-but I do not think they care. IG: 25:27 They were fine about it. JS: 25:28 Yeah, I do not think they cared one way or another. They did go with me once to visit the campus before I started there. IG: 25:35 So, what did you do after you graduated? You said that you found a job as a school teacher. Did you go- so what was your just career and trajectory like? In essence- JS: 25:52 Wow! That is, um... IG: 25:54 Did you- were you a Spanish school teacher all your life, or... JS: 25:58 Yeah, pretty much, although once I was, um into education--a flyer came across my desk for- from Nazareth College, which is based up in Rochester. IG: 26:10 Right. Right. JS: 26:11 But they were offering what they called satellite courses in Ithaca for English as a second language, and I always enjoyed that. In fact, I had volunteered to teach some kids at the public library who were who had come to this country, who needed English as a second language. And I enjoyed it. And I thought, well, that would be interesting. So, I took those courses and got certified in ESL as well. So um, that did me well, because I only worked part time for a while when my kids were little, and I had been working 80 percent at Union Endicott, when this flyer came across my desk, and then there was an opening out in Owego full time. And so, I moved out there, and they started using me as ESL as well, since I had my certification. And then when I retired from teaching Spanish out in Owego, um SUNY Cortland called and said they- their modern language department taught both Spanish and English as a Second Language, and they could use me with both certifications and all that kind of stuff. So, to this day, I still work part time for SUNY Cortland, and my ESL still serves me well, so I use both. I use. IG: 27:25 Excellent. JS: 27:25 Yes. IG: 27:27 So, do you think um, that um, you mentioned that the school had a very strong academic reputation? How do you think that you know, it shaped you for your, you know, for your future life? Do you think it- could we say that-that it- JS: 27:49 Oh, sure. IG: 27:50 -a formative that you had a formative experience there, because some people just go through college without [crosstalk] JS: 27:55 Yeah, I think some of the people who graduated did so because they learned I had to stick to it and really keep working hard and um, and it forced me to, create, develop that kind of persona- IG: 27:56 Yes. JS: 27:59 -where I am going to stick to it and I am going to get it and I- you know, I am going to get over that stupid hump on the bell shape. It certainly shaped me that way. For me that way. IG: 28:26 Do you think that the liberal arts, you know, academics, open doors that-that would not have been opened otherwise, or is that fair to say? JS: 28:36 Open minds- IG: 28:37 Open minds, open minds... JS: 28:38 -for sure. I to this day, I highly recommend that people have a kind of liberal arts education. You need to know about everything in this world. And when you get a liberal arts education, you are exposed to psychology, sociology, you name it. We had to have a little bit of everything in the first two years before we could go on and specialize. And I think everybody needs that if you are going to understand each other and understand other programs. And yeah, I would highly recommend it. IG: 28:42 Is the open mindedness, what attracted you to your husband when you met him? JS: 29:22 Open mindedness. Is he open minded? [laughs] IG: 29:27 I am assuming. Well, I do not know. What attracted me to Jeff? I would say no. I would say more his well- yes, he had to be open minded if he was close minded. No, absolutely not. That would, that would be a detraction so that so I guess maybe you are right. I had not thought about it that way. It is more his gentleness, kindness, concern for other people. That kind of stuff is what really attracted me to him. How did you meet? JS: 29:53 Um, he was a terrible language student, and this is true. [laughs] This is how we met. And I sat here, and he sat there, and he kept moving my arm because he did not understand anything the professor was saying. And he poked me [inaudible] "What did she say? What did she say?" So, I quick translated into English for him, and he would peek and see what-what I had done for homework. He did not get to move my arms during tests, though, or-or he would find out when I was going to the language lab. That was part of our classes too. So, he could sit beside me and because you would have these earphones on headsets, and he would say, "Okay, what did they say? What they say?" [laughs] And then, I remember coming back to the dorm one night and seeing him there, that guy in the Spanish class. Who does not know any Spanish? IG: 30:42 When did you meet? When- remember, were you a freshman, or... JS: 30:46 Oh, yeah, it was first semester. Because it was so small--the summer, the summer sessions were small because once you get accepted there, then you can pick what semesters you are going to attend. And many people just chose to attend two semesters a year rather than do the whole three in part because of the war, they did not want to graduate early, as long as they were a student, they still had a deferment. Um, so um, some people would go all three semesters. Some people would only go two semesters, and the summer semester, therefore was small, and you got to know almost everybody on campus, and he was living in the same dorm as I-- Johnson. And one wing, they called this a co-ed dorm. I know this isn't how it works now, but one wing was women and one wing was men, and the men were not allowed on the women's floor. The Women's were not allowed on the men's side, but that was our co-ed dorm. And after 11:00 curfew, there was some dispute as to who went where, but I seem to recall, the women were only allowed in the upper lounge, and the men were allowed in the lower area where the rec room and the snack machines were. Um, I guess it depended on which dorm you were in, because whoever was not allowed where the snack machines were would yell down and actually drop money and ask them to buy candy bars or something. We would throw them up. [laughs] So he was in the same dorm, so I saw him every time was coming and going, and then he was also in my experimental psychology class too. So. IG: 32:24 Was he allowed to visit you in your dorm? JS: 32:30 Well, I remember [crosstalk] he was, he was living in the same dorm, but he was only allowed in a men's wing, and we were allowed in the women's wing. IG: 32:36 Oh, in other words, he could not come into the women's room. JS: 32:40 No. IG: 32:40 No, I did not [crosstalk] JS: 32:41 I am going to say once, I do not remember exactly how often, but I am going to say about once a month they had open house. But even then, even then, if say I-I invited him to my room, which I was allowed to do during open house. When he came up, we were supposed to stand at the entrance to that floor and yell "Man on the floor" so that anybody could close their doors if they knew a man was coming through. So yeah, we did that. We yelled "Man on the floor," [laughs] and then he could come in and visit. IG: 33:17 Did anybody think of contesting those rules, or you did not really... JS: 33:23 I do not know. I remember when they opened the Hinman complex. Again, Jeff might be able to answer this better than I, with him being on a Ju-judicial review board and things like that. At some point the decision was made, and I do not know by whom to allow that to be a co-ed dorm where- again, only women in one suite and one floor, but we were, we were allowed to make our own rules. And so, we called them the self regs, because somebody first asked me which dorm I had lived in over there. And I said, "No, we call it the self reg" so um, [laughs] we actually made rules that-that did away with curfew for women over there. That was the that was a first on campus when we first moved into the Hinman complex. So that is when it started to change while we were still there. [laughs] IG: 34:19 That is incredible. So, did you feel empowered? JS: 34:22 Absolutely. [laughs] Yep. IG: 34:27 So, getting back to Jeff, so how you know- how did your relationship develop? You know, did you become girlfriend and boyfriend in college or... JS: 34:41 Yeah-yeah. IG: 34:41 did you [inaudible] after graduation? JS: 34:43 He invited me on a hayride, they actually had a hayride on campus. Yeah, that was our first date. Was on a hayride. And, yeah, it was on again, off again. Because this is the first thing that came to my mind when you said open mindedness. Jeff was Jewish and I was Catholic. IG: 34:57 Yes. JS: 34:58 Um, and it was not seemed to be a problem for my parents. My father was Presbyterian or something, and as far as my mother was concerned, that meant they were a mixed marriage, because we used to, they used to make fun of me because my mom called it a mixed marriage, and to most of the kids on campus, a mixed marriage was black and white or something like that. So, but we have done that DNA test, and Jeff is something like 97.6 percent Ashkenazi Jew. I mean, there was no mingling, and his parents were beside themselves that he was going to hang out with a "shiksa." [laughs] And so it was on and off again. We go out for three, four weeks. And then he-he would actually call and say, you know, we have to break up because, you know you are not Jewish and all this kind of stuff. And then he called me again, and he said, you want to go see the movie on campus. And I would say, "Is this a date?" He said, "Oh no, absolutely not." I said, "Oh, well, then who else is going," "Well, nobody else." And I say, "Sounds like a date to me?" "No, it is not a date." [laughs] So that is what I thought at first when you said, open minded. IG: 36:10 No-no [inaudible] JS: 36:11 It really did not play a role one way or another. [laughs] IG: 36:16 So how long did it take you before he- before you became a couple? JS: 36:23 That- it was definite that was on again off again, I am going to say, a couple of years before he decided, okay, it is on. He will tell you; it was my red hair. [laughs] I used to have red hair that he just could not resist. I do not know. [laughs] IG: 36:40 So that that is, so that is, that is very interesting, and we are- I will ask him this question, but where is he from? JS: 36:52 He is from Long Island. IG: 36:53 From Long Island. JS: 36:54 We were different economic strata as well. His dad was a CPA, and did very well. IG: 37:01 Yeah. JS: 37:02 And that bothered his parents, too. I am positive, but. IG: 37:08 So, um, I think I am just thinking of what else I can ask you-- so-so you know, did your-your lives, your lives continued um, in Binghamton? You stayed both in Binghamton and your husband, found work here, and you settled down. Um, did you continue having ties with the college itself? I know that you have friends, but did you have occasion to, you know, visit for some kind of alumni event, or... JS: 37:49 We still do, we still do. I think that is probably how you found this. We still go over. Yeah um, there have always been plays to see, concerts to do. And as we came to know more and more people in the community, even they would be a draw. For example, my son's friend was in the music program, and so we would go over whenever he was doing a recital, even if it was for his thesis or something, you know. So, there were all kinds of reasons to-to draw us over there. We have done partnerships with they have partnership program with foreign students, and we have done that several times. IG: 38:28 Could you explain that? JS: 38:29 Well, um, you just [inaudible] as an alumni. They will send you things, saying, "Would you help out with this program or something?" And if you say yes, then they match you up with-with a student. For example, there was a student, Shen-Shen Zhou, who's now going for her doctorate here. Who- when she first came here from China, they said, "Well, she has no family in the area? You would be in lieu of her family." If there is a holiday, and you know, there is- campuses emptying out, have her over. So, we had her for Thanksgiving, Christmas, things like that. And eventually she met an American guy and married him, but we went to the wedding and-and there was another young lady from Pakistan that we got matched up with, and she is now living in Boston, and she is- we are together on Facebook. We do not see her as much as we see Shen-Shen, but. IG: 39:21 So-so um, you know, what was your activity with the students? Like, did you take them out to restaurants, or [crosstalk] JS: 39:30 We brought them here. IG: 39:31 You brought them here. JS: 39:32 Brought them here. [crosstalk] No-no, they lived on campus. IG: 39:36 But to have dinner here for the family. JS: 39:38 Yeah. Uh-hmm. IG: 39:40 Over what period of time? JS: 39:42 Depended on who they matched us up with and how long they stayed here. IG: 39:47 Of course, was this, after your- first of all, how many children and did- went to Binghamton, where did your- JS: 39:59 [crosstalk] our own children? IG: 40:01 Yes-yes. JS: 40:02 My son went to- well, he started at Broome Community College. IG: 40:06 Yes. JS: 40:06 And graduated from Ithaca- IG: 40:08 I see. JS: 40:09 -in communications. So, he works for Channel 34 news station- IG: 40:13 Oh! That is great. JS: 40:14 -here, he is a news producer. He is not on camera, but he does- he makes commercials and all that kind of stuff, which is kind of fun, because when I see really bad one on TV, you know those car commercials that are so hokey, I will call and say, "Did you do that commercial?" [inaudible] "Mom, we do whatever the customer wants." [laughs] "I know what you are going to say." And our daughter that you met her already lives about five minutes down the road and is a secretary in the guidance office at Union Endicott High School. IG: 40:44 Oh! JS: 40:44 So, they are both- both local, which is very nice. That means our grandchildren are local. IG: 40:51 So, they did not go to Binghamton University. JS: 40:53 No-no. IG: 40:54 I misunderstood. JS: 40:56 No, they were there. They know of it, but yes, no, neither one of them attended classes there. No. IG: 41:02 So apart from the foreign student program, do you look upon Binghamton sort of as a cultural center? JS: 41:12 Oh, yeah, for sure. IG: 41:14 After graduation. JS: 41:14 Yeah, we have gone to plays, you know, orchestra type performances, some alumni events. Yeah, whatever we see is going on over there. We will, we will stop by, and we are sort of a hub for all these friends I told you about who now live everywhere else, like we really got together this fall. For many of them graduated in 1967. Jeff and I graduated in (19)68 but some of them went through that- went faster through the trimester program, and so this was their 50th, so they wanted to do something for their 50th. So, we had a house full, and we all met over on campus and attended some of the activities there. IG: 42:03 So-so did you know, actually, did you have a vision of what your life after graduation would be like? Or did it kind of just fall into place? JS: 42:19 For me, I cannot. I know a lot of people plan-plan-plan for me, it just kind of fell into place. After Ecuador, I decided I wanted to do something with Spanish. I was not even sure what, but I sort of started volunteering to work with kids and enjoyed the teaching. And right about the time we were ready to graduate, or just before, they created the MAT program, and it was like an opening, okay, we could do that. We both managed to get jobs teaching-- Jeff more because- IG: 42:47 [inaudible] MAT program? JS: 42:48 Masters in the Art of Teaching. IG: 42:49 I see. JS: 42:50 I think they still have it. IG: 42:51 Yeah. JS: 42:52 And, I mean, it has changed over the years. First, they had Spanish, then they did not, then they did. I think it was back. But Jeff, more so than I was looking at the teaching end of it, because you could still get a deferment from the war for being a teacher, and that was important, so important to so many of those young guys. And that is how he ended up in it. I just sort of naturally gravitated toward it because I liked it. And since we both got jobs here and had decided to get married. Right after we got our bachelors, we just stayed here and finished our masters. And his parents tried to get him to go to Long Island, but every time he goes down there and we get stuck in traffic, or there would be long lines, he would say, "No, I really do not want to live there." [laughs] IG: 43:40 So, you know, how has- I am just wondering, how has Binghamton University changed over time? Harpur College changed over time in your perception of a better school, a better experience, or is there something missing? JS: 43:57 It is different. [laughs] I mean, there are good things and there are bad things, if you recall, one of the things I liked the best was the smallness of it and how you could get to know everybody. That is no longer true. But then there are a lot more opportunities in so many different fields than there used to be. There did not used to be a school of engineering, there did not used to be a school of nursing. There did not- you know, all these now that there was one in pharmacy, they never used to have all those opportunities um, but it is so big now you can get lost over there. So, it, it is different. I mean, there is there is good and-and bad from- IG: 44:36 Do you think most of your graduating class did well for themselves? The majority? JS: 44:41 Yeah-yeah. Well, certainly, all the ones we have kept in touch with- IG: 44:46 Kept in touch with. JS: 44:47 Absolutely. IG: 44:48 The ones with a strong liberal arts education? JS: 44:51 Mm-Hmm, for sure. IG: 44:53 So, what are the most important lessons that you have learned from the experience of going to Harpur College? JS: 45:01 Goodness, what is the most- lessons. Huh. [laughs] I mean, I certainly learned a lot about how to deal with life. Um, I learned it- opened up my world. Remember, I came from that tiny little family in Niagara Falls. It started really with the exchange student experience, but it continued with-with Harpur. I mean, again, I found a culture that I was not familiar with. They caught- they actually called me for a while. Maybe he will remember the funny little upstate girl, because most of the people on campus were from downstate, and even that in and of itself, I found bizarre that they called me up upstate when they said they were coming upstate, when they were coming to Binghamton, to me, coming from Niagara Falls, coming to a place that borders with Pennsylvania, is downstate, and they said, "No-no-no-no-no, you do not understand it all." If you are anywhere north of Yonkers, you are upstate. In fact, even if you are in Yonkers, you are upstate. [laughs] So it was a culture that I was totally unfamiliar with, and was honestly a little scary at first. It was a different accent. They were much more outgoing and much quicker to criticize. I was kind of inhibited no longer, but I really was kind of inhibited and did not speak up, and learned to do all of that there. So that guess that partially answer your question. IG: 46:31 Right. So, it is kind of an acculturation. JS: 46:34 Absolutely, yep. IG: 46:37 And I think you know, broadening experience. Um, what you know, what was the proudest memory from being at Harpur College? JS: 46:50 That I graduated. [laughs] IG: 46:52 That you graduated. JS: 46:53 There were times when I was not sure that was going to happen. When I saw that a 91 was a c plus, you know, that I made it, but maybe that sticks out, you know, more than anything else, and my father coming to me that and telling me that I was the first person in his family to have graduated from college. Now my mom did, but he met on his side of the family. So. IG: 47:21 Do you have any sort of concluding remarks? We still have your husband to interview. That is another [crosstalk] JS: 47:29 Well, see if he says the opposite of everything. [laughs] Third speaker: 47:34 I have a question. JS: 47:35 Sure. Third speaker: 47:36 You studied Spanish. Was there any Spanish speaking person in campus as a student at that time? JS: 47:44 Yeah. Third speaker: 47:45 Like someone from Spain or Latin America? JS: 47:47 Well, there was a fellow that lived in our dorm that we were friends with. I do not know what happened to a Māori Cruise. He was from Cuba. Third speaker: 47:54 Okay. JS: 47:55 We hung out with him. Yeah, I encountered other ones, but I do not remember their names. Third speaker: 48:01 [crosstalk] some- JS: 48:02 Some, but not a lot. Third speaker: 48:04 How about Black? Were there any [crosstalk] JS: 48:06 Some, some, again, not a lot. One of our best friends was a guy by the name of [inaudible], and he was from what at the time was Rhodesia, now Zimbabwe, and he had an interesting life. He was already in his 30s, but he was living on campus with all us youngsters, um trying to get his education, and eventually got his masters up at McGill because he needed a degree from some country within the British Commonwealth, so that when he went back to Zimbabwe, he could be successful, and I do not understand what happened to him, but he ended up in Belgium, I think so. I think there was no place for educated Blacks at the time in Rhodesia, Zimbabwe. I cannot remember exactly when it became Zimbabwe, but it was still Rhodesia when he was with us, but again, not a lot, not a lot. IG: 49:05 So, with the exception of you know, you opened a whole other set of questions, but with the exception of you who have, who had international experience before coming to college, do you think the rest of the student community was pretty, you know, white and insular, and mostly came from downstage. JS: 49:27 In my mind, a bunch of white downstairs. [laughs] IG: 49:30 Yeah. JS: 49:32 In my mind, yeah. IG: 49:33 So, there were very few international students or students of color [inaudible] JS: 49:38 I hope that is accurate, but that is how I remember it. Yeah. I mean, where are these folks? Go ahead, just look through the pictures. Well, this- these are Harpur College pages. At the time, Harpur College bought a place out in Halsey Valley--beyond Owego. And because Jeff was on the judicial review board, he knew who to talk to-to get the keys, and we would go out there, dorm room. I am sorry, you guys probably cannot see very much here. These are all Polaroids. Do you remember back when people used to do Polaroids? Jeff me, Jeff and me, Jeff and me. But this is at that place out in Halsey Valley. They called it Lake Empire. But what I am looking for- here we are--this was a duck- a boat race on the Susquehanna. Everybody had gone down there. Look at their faces. I do not know, folks. I am not seeing a lot of different ethnicities here. Well, there was Mach- there was Machana. We were good friends with him. He was, yeah-yeah. That is, let me see, that is Machana, yeah-yeah. IG: 50:55 For the faculty, yeah, international, did you have- JS: 50:59 Yes. IG: 51:00 Yes, so your Spanish department. Where did they come from? JS: 51:06 Senora Borgel was from Spain, itself, mostly Spain. One from Germany. IG: 51:19 Spanish teacher, Spanish- JS: 51:20 No, that was psychology, one from Switzerland. That was sociology. Where else they were from? IG: 51:37 Did having that kind of international, small presence, you know, connect you to the wider world, or change your view of- JS: 51:48 No not too much. IG: 51:49 Not too much. JS: 51:50 A little bit, but not a lot. Yeah, no, so you can see, yeah, you are right. They were mostly white, huh! Studying. Even when we were relaxing, we were studying. [laughs] IG: 52:09 You were studying. JS: 52:10 That is how I remember it. Somebody's always screwing up the bell-shaped curve pressure, but we are still good friends with him, with her, with her, her, both of them. They live up in Syracuse. Most of us met our spouses there. IG: 52:29 Oh, really. JS: 52:30 Yeah, kind of lost touch with her and her, but our resident, our head resident in our dorm, had was married and had a baby. That is that was his little one. His first name was Dean. Is that a bizarre name for a campus? Think about this. There were so many people that would say to him every time they saw him, hello, Dean Porter. And I know they thought the Dean was his title, not his name, but it was his name. He was not a dean. He was just the resident that had resident. IG: 53:07 Where was this photograph taken on campus? JS: 53:09 No, they, they took a break one spring and went, during spring break, went camping in the not Great Smokies, Shenandoah-Shenandoah area, down in Virginia. IG: 53:27 So, did-did anybody- you did not have any foreign study programs at the time at Harpur College? JS: 53:34 Yeah, they did go, yeah, um, one of the young ladies here, one of my roommates, went to- they had a program in Salamanca, Spain. IG: 53:43 Yeah. JS: 53:43 And, and they also had one in France. I am trying remember the name of the city. It will come to me later. Yeah, there were, there were programs like that where you could go for a semester and study abroad. But that was expensive. And, yeah, I never went because I did not have the money, yeah. IG: 54:02 Subsequently, you went traveling and you saw these places, or some of those places. JS: 54:06 Most of them, not-not-not Spain, so much. Jeff and I have been down- well, we have hosted many, many exchange students here in this house, long term exchange students-- mostly wrote rotary students, but from a couple other organizations as well. And we have had four from Brazil, so we went down to Brazil and visited them. While we were there, we went over to Argentina, just because we were close. IG: 54:29 Wonderful. JS: 54:30 We could see we have been to Mexico a whole bunch of times. I would go shopping. He would make fun of me, because when I was teaching, I would buy all the little trinkets on the street and bring them back for prizes and things in class. And I remember one time having a whole bag of them. And we got to customs, and Jeff and that guy said, "Well, what did you buy…? IG: 54:51 Yeah. JS: 54:51 -in Mexico." And Jeff looked at the guy and went, "Junk." And the guy just said, "Okay, I passed through." [laughs] So to this day, I still tease them about junk that was not junk, that was stuff for my students. [laughs] IG: 55:05 But you kept up your language through these travels. JS: 55:08 Yeah. So yeah, use it some that way. Yeah. We also get together with other Spanish teachers. IG: 55:14 Oh, that is [inaudible] JS: 55:15 Although we retired teachers are starting to lose it. We-we first got together when we retired, and we would speak all in Spanish during lunch, and then it got to be just a half hour. And the last time we forced ourselves to do 10 minutes. [laughs] It is not quite what it used to be, yeah. IG: 55:32 Well, I can understand that language suffers from misuse. JS: 55:37 I keep it up more on campus. IG: 55:39 Yes. JS: 55:40 When I go up to Cortland- and I go into the Foreign Language Department, we are much more likely to address each other. [crosstalk] Yeah. IG: 55:41 I see. So, any concluding remarks? Do you have any outstanding memories? JS: 55:55 No, the only thing that sticks in my mind, and I am not sure it is where you want to go with this, but how nice it was back then. You know how people are talking right now about this big deal, free tuition, free college, tuition, everything. We basically had that at Harpur College-- they only accepted you if you had an average in the 90s or so. And we used to take something called the regents exam, regions, scholarship exam, which no longer exists, and we all scored high enough on it that we all got a regent scholarship. And that regent scholarship paid our tuition. Our tuition was only $200 a semester, and but that meant for me, as a kid from a lower income family with five children, with just a factory worker dad and so on, I could go to college with no problem. All my tuition was covered. It was free. In that sense, room and board was more. I borrowed money for some of the room and board, and my parents paid for some of it, but it made it relatively painless to get through college, to get a college education, so that you could rise, in other words, you could have a mobile, social, economic society. And so, it is quite doable. It is quite possible. And I feel really strongly about that, that we could do it if we had the political will. I mean, it was done. It is not a first. We had it, [laughs] and I am very grateful for that, or I would not be here. [laughs] You know, IG: 56:52 That is what it should be. JS: 57:29 Yeah, so and Harpur College had that for sure. IG: 57:34 And most, do you think that most kids had- were there on scholarship, or... JS: 57:40 I' d say most of the kids on campus had a scholarship just because of our averages. Yeah-yeah. Jeff did, I did. IG: 57:46 Academic scholarships. Third speaker: 57:48 And that also made a huge difference, of course, campus life, because everyone was intellectually- IG: 57:56 motivated, Third speaker: 57:57 Same level. IG: 57:59 yeah-yeah. for sure. So that is it. Well, good. Third speaker: 58:05 Thank you very much. JS: 58:07 Thank you. It has been fun talking about it. You know, and trying to make me think of things I have not thought about them. I will leave that here if you want something. Oh, this would be a better indicator you were asking about ethnicities and stuff. Just flip through it. This is the, yeah, look, it looks all white to me. Gosh, I never thought about that. Yeah, holy cow. IG: 58:37 I think that was probably standard at the time. Do not you think? JS: 58:41 I guess, I guess how sad. Kept touch with some of these people. Yeah, you are welcome to skim through it to see what you can find. But they are, they are broken up by- IG: 59:02 Year? JS: 59:03 No, by majors. And so, I wonder if there would be a difference, depending on whether you are looking at humanities or sciences or I will bet you find a difference between male and female. Betcha-betcha [bet you]. Find most of the females in the humanities part. Third speaker: 59:21 Absolutely. JS: 59:24 Anyway. IG: 59:25 I love this. [laughs] JS: 59:28 You want me, let me go get- yes, that was the other thing too. Do you know a lot of schools at that time were still insistent that everybody dress family for dinner? We were Harpur hippies. They did not have a dress code. You could wear jeans. IG: 59:42 She breaks the mode. JS: 59:43 At night and-and that is a little bit what-what they look like. [laughs] IG: 59:48 Is it a little bit what you look like? JS: 59:50 Oh, yeah. Jeans- IG: 59:51 Glasses, jeans. JS: 59:53 We all, we all, we were all nerds. We all have glasses. We- IG: 59:57 She has sunglasses. JS: 59:58 No, yeah, that is different. IG: 59:59 [inaudible] JS: 1:00:01 But we were all in jeans, yeah. IG: 1:00:03 Boots. JS: 1:00:04 Yeah, I did not do boots, IG: 1:00:06 Yeah. Okay. JS: 1:00:07 Yeah, let me go get the other guy and relieve him. IG: 1:00:11 Thank you so much. JS: 1:00:12 Send him your way. (End of Interview) Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Janice L. Strauss Subject The topic of the resource Harpur College – Sixties alumni; Harpur College – Alumni in secondary education; Harpur College – Alumni from Upstate New York; Harpur College – Alumni living in Broome County. Contributor An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource Strauss, Janice L. ; Gashurov, Irene Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource audio/mp3 Description An account of the resource Janice is a Niagara Falls native. She worked as a Spanish teacher in Broome County. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Binghamton University Libraries Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource 2017-12-14 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource In Copyright Language A language of the resource eng Type The nature or genre of the resource Sound Identifier An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context Janice Strauss.mp3 Date Modified Date on which the resource was changed. 2017-12-14 Is Part Of A related resource in which the described resource is physically or logically included. Oral Histories from 60's Binghamton Alumni Extent The size or duration of the resource. 60:14 minutes